debbieg Posted April 8, 2013 Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 hi all....i am new to boating and have just discovered a very rusty hole just under the top rubbing strake on my 1979 colecraft. i am terrified that this is a indication that the rest of the hull is covered in holes. am i right to think this way? the boat is coming out of the water this coming weekend so all will be revealed then. i was just wondering if anyone could say why it would rust badly in this area as i believe this to be an unusual place for this to happen. am i right in thinking this? i believe worse case scenario would be a total overplate??the boat is coming out of the water this coming weekend so all will be revealed then. i purchased the boat at what i believed to be a really good price and have a contingency fund for any work that needs doing. if anyone could advise/calm me down so i dont have nightmares tonight i would really appreciate it!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueStringPudding Posted April 8, 2013 Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 What did the survey say? (Think I know the answer to this question) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GSer Posted April 8, 2013 Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 If its any consolation rust often starts next to the strakes/ guards as small spots are often missed when blacking those areas. Wait till the boats out and checked before getting too stressed about it, fretting about it won't change anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex- Member Posted April 8, 2013 Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 (edited) hi all....i am new to boating and have just discovered a very rusty hole just under the top rubbing strake on my 1979 colecraft. i am terrified that this is a indication that the rest of the hull is covered in holes. am i right to think this way? the boat is coming out of the water this coming weekend so all will be revealed then. i was just wondering if anyone could say why it would rust badly in this area as i believe this to be an unusual place for this to happen. am i right in thinking this? i believe worse case scenario would be a total overplate??the boat is coming out of the water this coming weekend so all will be revealed then. i purchased the boat at what i believed to be a really good price and have a contingency fund for any work that needs doing. if anyone could advise/calm me down so i dont have nightmares tonight i would really appreciate it!!! Many older boats and many new ones too are not fully welded along the bottom of the rubbing strake, just every 6 inches, the remaining gaps were usually filled with silicone sealer, of course this doesn't last long falls out and eventually water gets trapped behind. It has been known to freeze and force the gap open wider. That's just one possibility though, there are many other causes possible on a boat that old. It's probably not very thick steel either, 6mm base plate possible. At the end of the day metal can be welded and patched up. Just hopefully not too much of it Edited April 8, 2013 by Julynian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greedyheron Posted April 8, 2013 Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 It's really frightening finding a hole, I sympathise. Mine had holes in random places but was fine for the most part- try not to panic yet ( says me who posted almost daily in a complete panic for a while). I can tell you it feels much better once you know how big the problem is and have found someone to fix it- welder came to start fixing mine today- phew! Hope there are no more holes for you to find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebotco Posted April 8, 2013 Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 Could it just be an old/unused sink outlet hole that has rusted around the edges? Don't know much about these things, except I've got one like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Ambrose Posted April 8, 2013 Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 hi all....i am new to boating and have just discovered a very rusty hole just under the top rubbing strake on my 1979 colecraft. i am terrified that this is a indication that the rest of the hull is covered in holes. am i right to think this way? the boat is coming out of the water this coming weekend so all will be revealed then. i was just wondering if anyone could say why it would rust badly in this area as i believe this to be an unusual place for this to happen. am i right in thinking this? i believe worse case scenario would be a total overplate??the boat is coming out of the water this coming weekend so all will be revealed then. i purchased the boat at what i believed to be a really good price and have a contingency fund for any work that needs doing. if anyone could advise/calm me down so i dont have nightmares tonight i would really appreciate it!!! Colecraft did have this issue, do'nt know if they have addressed it, my survey pointed out that the rubbing strake on my Colecraft were not welded all the way on the bottom edge. Glad you reminded me as I need to take steps to prevent any holes appearing. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chalky Posted April 8, 2013 Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 It could be much worse. Royal wedding weekend last year my brother in law found a small damp speck of rust in the bilge of his springer. He picked at it and a small water jet appeared. When RCR came out they tried to seal it with epoxy putty, then a wooden plug (which went straight through) and so on up to the biggest plug they had. It floated over night (with spare bilge pumps on stand by) till they managed to get to a dry dock for repairs 2 days and 10 miles later. If its above the water line and you're floating I wouldn't worry until you've got it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starcoaster Posted April 8, 2013 Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 My survey noted that my rubbing strakes were not fully attached at the bottom; I have looked at them several times to work out why this might a be a problem and why it was deemed noteworthy in the survey. I could not work it out. Surely the worst that can happen is that the strakes separate from the body of the hull, but the body of the hull remains intact? Or not? If it is a problem, what should I do about it, or what can I do preemptively to prevent later drama? I cannot see any gaps or anything through the blacking and I am not sure how silicone could be used to seal it over the blacking or how this could even be applied at the bottom of the strip without leaving a real mess? Should I be doing something about this now, before something happens, and if so, what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtB Posted April 8, 2013 Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 It's really frightening finding a hole, I sympathise. Well yes, but not all holes are the same. Some are more trickey than others.... A hole under a rubbing band is the best sort of hole to find. It is NOT necessarily an indication of the state of the hull under the waterline. As other have suggested, the lack of a continuous weld along the underside of a guard rail is asking for trouble. Back in the day when you boat was built, Colecraft were the cheapest hulls money could buy (other than Springers) and built down to a price not up to a standard. Even so, they were bloody good boats and if you just get it welded up, your boat probably has another 20 years in it before you need to worry. No doubt others will be along soon to contradict me MtB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex- Member Posted April 8, 2013 Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 My survey noted that my rubbing strakes were not fully attached at the bottom; I have looked at them several times to work out why this might a be a problem and why it was deemed noteworthy in the survey. I could not work it out. Surely the worst that can happen is that the strakes separate from the body of the hull, but the body of the hull remains intact? Or not? If it is a problem, what should I do about it, or what can I do preemptively to prevent later drama? I cannot see any gaps or anything through the blacking and I am not sure how silicone could be used to seal it over the blacking or how this could even be applied at the bottom of the strip without leaving a real mess? Should I be doing something about this now, before something happens, and if so, what? Well surely that's a problem if it should occur. If the gap remains sealed and no water can ingress then I would leave it but keep an eye on it. Sealer would have been put in it when built, it could well last years, decades even. What happens if water does ingress is that he rubbing strake and hull trap water in the gap that will continuously attack the steel and rust, hence holes in those areas. In cold weather freezing the trapped water can expand and force off more rubbing strake as it expands. If it aint broke though don't fix it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debbieg Posted April 8, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 Thank you all for your quick replies....i feel a little better now.I probably should have had a survey but ive read so much about the surveyors being over cautious etc that i thought id take a chance! Also if id paid for a survey every time i looked at a boat i wouldnt have had the money to buy one in the first place. (or a contingency fund) lol. The replies about not being fully welded all the way around the rubbing strake makes a lot of sense to me as the hole it long (3 inches) rather than round. I hope the post will help others too. I will post again when i know what the damage is when shes been in the dry dock. Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Ambrose Posted April 8, 2013 Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 My survey noted that my rubbing strakes were not fully attached at the bottom; I have looked at them several times to work out why this might a be a problem and why it was deemed noteworthy in the survey. I could not work it out. Surely the worst that can happen is that the strakes separate from the body of the hull, but the body of the hull remains intact? Or not? If it is a problem, what should I do about it, or what can I do preemptively to prevent later drama? I cannot see any gaps or anything through the blacking and I am not sure how silicone could be used to seal it over the blacking or how this could even be applied at the bottom of the strip without leaving a real mess? Should I be doing something about this now, before something happens, and if so, what? Hi Starry, you can get black sealant from Screwfix, wet or dry surface goes by the name of "Roofers Mate Lead sealant" made by Geocel cost is about £6-00 or Sikaflex do a black sealant for about £8-00, various others on their website. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timleech Posted April 8, 2013 Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 Well surely that's a problem if it should occur. If the gap remains sealed and no water can ingress then I would leave it but keep an eye on it. Sealer would have been put in it when built, it could well last years, decades even. What happens if water does ingress is that he rubbing strake and hull trap water in the gap that will continuously attack the steel and rust, hence holes in those areas. In cold weather freezing the trapped water can expand and force off more rubbing strake as it expands. If it aint broke though don't fix it Actually my observations over the years tell me that sealer was very rarely used on guards (rubbing strakes) where they are not continuously welded, and welding the lower edge was not the norm for a long time. Actually some boats built not so many years ago for a well-known hire company only had them tack welded top and bottom. Sealer is likely to get blown out by a decent pressure washer anyway. Yes, long term, you will get more corrosion around guards where they are not fully welded. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Mack Posted April 8, 2013 Report Share Posted April 8, 2013 (edited) Actually some boats built not so many years ago for a well-known hire company only had them tack welded top and bottom. And real boats have the guards rivetted on at intervals, with the edges unsealed top and bottom. You see some with bulging guards between every rivet. Edited April 8, 2013 by David Mack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEngo Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 And some, but not all early colecraft had a horizontal seam under the top guard. It was then their practice to stitch weld this seam at intervals not continuously. The seam was then covered by th guard which was welded continuously on top but stitched at the bottom. N Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debbieg Posted April 28, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 28, 2013 Hi folks, just a quick update and another cry for help! Hull was fine all blacked and rust hole filled. although I have been advised my lister engine is on it's way out and that a bmc 1.5 or 1.8 would be a good replacement. Does anyone have one for sale or know a man who has? I have also posted in the for sale/wanted section. Thanks to you all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddingtonBear Posted April 28, 2013 Report Share Posted April 28, 2013 Get the Lister rebuilt or find a direct replacement as it won't necessarily be cheap to fit another type of engine and box. Well done for getting away with it!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madcat Posted April 28, 2013 Report Share Posted April 28, 2013 I would always suggest keeping the Lister and getting it sorted. Glad your hull is ok,I bought my boat knowing it had 2 holes in the front,one each side of the stem post. All fixed now. Back to the Lister,tel us what it is and where the boat is,better brains than mine can then advise on good engineers local to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debbieg Posted April 28, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 28, 2013 Thanks for your advice folks. I am of the same opinion as you....I would rebuild the lister. it's a 3 cylinder air cooled....we have been told that one of the cylinders needs attention. Hubby insists he would rather put a bmc in the boat! We are located near shardlow if anyone can help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luctor et emergo Posted April 28, 2013 Report Share Posted April 28, 2013 Why on earth would you put an out of date taxi engine in your boat, at a cost of several thousend pounds? If you want to change the engine, get a modern, new engine (Barrus, Shire, et al). Better still, spend a few hundred on the Lister, and have an engine which is bullet proof, and has character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeanS Posted April 28, 2013 Report Share Posted April 28, 2013 Who has told you there's a problem with the cylinder? Are they qualified to make that claim? What are the symptoms. If it's loud, oily, and hot in the engine room, that means it's working fine I have a new 52HP engine. I sometimes wish I still had my Lister.....at least it felt like it would last forever, whereas I keep thinking this one might fall apart...although I have no facts to back that up....it's just that its not....a .....Lister. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luctor et emergo Posted April 28, 2013 Report Share Posted April 28, 2013 I have an SR3, and move about a lot. The Lister is a smokey engine, leaks oil, and is loud. It will also seize when overheating. It will also fire up after cooling down. It will also run on virtual sludge, well, a gunked up fuel filter anyway. I believe it will run if you trow diesel in it's general direction. Anybody removing a Lister is attempting a picknick without cheese slices, held between two slices of bread, cut diagonally. And most (o.k. Many) surveyors are crapping themselfs about getting something wrong, and 'err on the side of caution'. Most surveys are not worth the cost of the paper they are written on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLWP Posted April 28, 2013 Report Share Posted April 28, 2013 Thanks for your advice folks. I am of the same opinion as you....I would rebuild the lister. it's a 3 cylinder air cooled....we have been told that one of the cylinders needs attention. Hubby insists he would rather put a bmc in the boat! We are located near shardlow if anyone can help. A Lister SR3 is a pretty bomb proof and long lived engine, well worth repairing. If you were putting another engine in, I wouldn't choose a BMC, I'd go for a Japanese engine. Do the sums before you make a rash decision. There will be a lot of welding in fitting a water cooled engine into an air cooled installation, and probably a lot of ballasting. And a gearbox. And lots and lots of labour If it helps, I'm rebuilding a 40 year old SR2 for a client at the moment that looks to have another 40 years life in it. Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bizzard Posted April 28, 2013 Report Share Posted April 28, 2013 If Colcraft fitted the air cooled Lister from the start I doubt if there will be a skin water cooling tank for a water cooled engine,'' further big expense''. Those Lister air cooled engines can be more or less overhauled in situ. Find out which cylinder is deficient. The separate cylinder heads, barrels and their valve gear are removeable individually, pistons can then be inspected then also, even the con-rods can be disconnected through the crankcase side door. Not many engines modern engines including BMC that you can do all this to in situ in a boat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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