Using the ladder in a lock

[Chris J W]

"Hold on to it!"

Broad lock - paddles on both sides? tried it - it dont work!

 

Not been in a broad-lock where there's not been bollards or posts yet, but couldn't you use a mooring pin? Even if only to hold the rope at slack so that you can still pull the boat back to your side?

[WJM]

You said - never been in a broad lock with a single narrow boat!

 

Near ground paddle plus far gate paddle does a good job of keeping the boat on the wall - but you still need something to hold it firmly in place when it tries to wander.

 

Bash in a mooring pin? - Adds to the workload, wont hold very well, and if we all did that think of the state of the ground. Much easier to use the fixture provided - after all ladders are clearly not suitable for climbing so best to put them to some use!

[GUMPY]

"Hold on to it!"

Broad lock - paddles on both sides? tried it - it dont work!

 

On GU locks if you only open the ground padddle on the same side as the boat, the boat ususlly stays on that side and just moves back and then forward ( unless it is a working boat and/or very front light). This can be stopped by a line to a bollard at the head of the lock or the gate you are working , yes I know the boat will still come to the top gate but at least it wont damage it there.

Also before they put the silly baffles on you could open the opposite gate paddle and that would also hold the boat on the same side. Now with the baffles its pot luck depending on which way round they have fitted the baffles.

 

Julian

[Chris J W]

You said - never been in a broad lock with a single narrow boat!

 

Me? I've never said that. I've a 57ft narrow, and done nearly all the broad locks up to the summit of the GU on my own with only mine in the lock.

 

Near ground paddle plus far gate paddle does a good job of keeping the boat on the wall - but you still need something to hold it firmly in place when it tries to wander.

 

Bash in a mooring pin? - Adds to the workload, wont hold very well, and if we all did that think of the state of the ground. Much easier to use the fixture provided - after all ladders are clearly not suitable for climbing so best to put them to some use!

 

I just accept that she's going to wander now. As soon as you open that ground paddle even a little bit the bow is going to get caught and the current take her over. So I just do a few notches, let her drift over, pull her back and repeat.

 

My point about the pin was not that it should take the movement of the boat, but just to be a secure place to tie the rope with sufficient slack so that she can wander off - but without the risk of loosing your rope.

 

I accept it adds to the work load, but not by much and worth it for ones own safety and the safety of the boat?

[Nine of Hearts]

Has anyone single handed the 11'er at the top of Tardebigge without using the ladder?

[WJM]

I am a four paddles boater - near ground plus far gate till its half full then the other two - all full on. I like to travel, so I need my bollards!

[Supermalc]

River Soar and GU locks with 2 people with smallish cruiser going upstream. Open a lower gate, close paddles while boat is going in. Close gate. Person on boat holds it in a ladder rung with centre rope. At top end open GATE paddles first, followed by ground paddles. No need for pussyfooting about. Person on boat can easily manage to hold it against the side with the rope. When the lock has filled some, the person on the boat has to move the rope to a higher rung. When lock is full, open a gate, then close all paddles, while boat leaves lock. Shut the gate and jump aboard and off. About 7 minutes on average, as long as locks are with you. Handcuffed ones take a bit longer. You can't open the gate paddles all the way until the lock as filled on one or two, as the boat is too close to the 'waterfall', but this soon diminishes and the ground paddles soon fill the lock enough to reduce it.

 

Oh, and other than for hanging onto, no need to use ladders either.

[KenK]

Has anyone single handed the 11'er at the top of Tardebigge without using the ladder?

 

Yes

 

Going up. Stop the boat with the rear in line with the steps on left hand side, walk up steps with centreline, pull boat in, operate lock.

 

Going down, boat in, operate lock, pull boat out, stop it with rear in line with steps close bottom gate, away you go.

 

If you think that's difficult try Bath deep lock.

 

Ken

[Sir Nibble]

Y'know, it occurs to me that everyone has their own method and it works for them. But just because you get on ok with it don't make it universal. What about when there are only gate paddles? or ground paddles? only some of the suggestions on here give the impression that the locks they are familiar with are the only type there are. What about locks that behave differently? I, for instance have experimentally tried pushing lock gates open with the boat, wouldn't move, the crew of the boat I was in company with got tired of waiting for me to nudge open the gates of a clearly full lock so I did it by hand. So do I have a different type of lock? is my engine unable to produce the neccessary shove? (after all it wasn't a one finger job to open the gates, it took a whole hand) or maybe the laws of physics were temporarily suspended to spite me. As for "anyone who uses a ladder is a fool" try single handing Bradford on avon town lock going up, you either use the ladder or bowhaul the boat back to a winding hole and go the other way, try it somewhere like Caen hill, possible, if you're a horse!

In short, I don't LIKE using a ladder, and I don't LIKE suspending my life to sit on the bog! Somethings you just have to do.

[Chris J W]

Out of interest (and for future reference!) - what makes that lock so difficult to use without using the ladder? No landing stage? Bridge?

[Nine of Hearts]

Somethings you just have to do.

Very true. My earlier post was in curiosity, mainly because it just didn't occur to me to NOT use the ladder when I went through that lock. I think dangers are sometimes over-stated. My chemistry teacher at school, who was in favour of nuclear power, was fond of pointing out that stairs killed thousands every year yet no one ever suggested banning their use.

 

(In response to Chris J W, it are 11' deep and so is a bit too far the old jump on to the roof dodge, although being a narrow lock, at least you wouldn't miss!)

Edited November 15, 2007 by Nine of Hearts

[carlt]

Y'know, it occurs to me that everyone has their own method and it works for them. But just because you get on ok with it don't make it universal. What about when there are only gate paddles? or ground paddles? only some of the suggestions on here give the impression that the locks they are familiar with are the only type there are. What about locks that behave differently? I, for instance have experimentally tried pushing lock gates open with the boat, wouldn't move, the crew of the boat I was in company with got tired of waiting for me to nudge open the gates of a clearly full lock so I did it by hand. So do I have a different type of lock? is my engine unable to produce the neccessary shove? (after all it wasn't a one finger job to open the gates, it took a whole hand) or maybe the laws of physics were temporarily suspended to spite me. As for "anyone who uses a ladder is a fool" try single handing Bradford on avon town lock going up, you either use the ladder or bowhaul the boat back to a winding hole and go the other way, try it somewhere like Caen hill, possible, if you're a horse!

In short, I don't LIKE using a ladder, and I don't LIKE suspending my life to sit on the bog! Somethings you just have to do.

Sorry snibs but I've single handed caen hill and Bradford and the only time I have used a ladder is when I fell in about 10 years ago on claydon flight.

 

The reason I've never used a ladder is because I'm scared of heights and a ladder up a wall is particularly bad.

 

If there was no way of negotiating a lock without climbing a ladder then I would, as you said, reverse to the nearest winding hole. I've not had to do it yet, and don't expect to.

 

I have sat in a boat, waiting for high tide, before I could get off, though, despite being tied to a perfectly good ladder, though.

 

Btw, if a horse can haul a boat, a person can, if you know how to do it properly, and have the correct running gear.

[Nine of Hearts]

Btw, if a horse can haul a boat, a person can, if you know how to do it properly, and have the correct running gear.

Christ, carl! How fit are you? I just walk when I'm bow hauling mine.

 

NB: Shocking vertigo too, but I like the fear.

[Chris J W]

(In response to Chris J W, it are 11' deep and so is a bit too far the old jump on to the roof dodge, although being a narrow lock, at least you wouldn't miss!)

 

Ta. But still confused ... From Snibble "(on going up) you either use the ladder or bowhaul the boat back to a winding hole and go the other way". Why not just bowhaul straight in? I've bowhauled in and out Denham, and that must be of a similar hight.

[carlt]

One of the main problems with not using a ladder, when single handing, is, if bow hauling, passing the rope under annoyingly placed bridges. Sometimes this is impossible (without having arms like Mr Tickle).

 

In this instance the sensible thing to do is use the ladder but, the funny thing about irrational fear is that it doesn't promote common sense. The next sensible thing to do is to wait until someone comes along, explain your predicament and hope that they sympathise.

 

If, like me, you possess a fierce independent streak and asking favours doesn't come easily, you devise a method which would turn out similar to mine.

 

I won't go into the details because using the ladder is far safer (unless you are going to freak out, 3 feet up, like you're on the north face of the Eiger) and requires practice, timing and a full set of ropes.

 

The top lock on the Buckby flight where the A5 crosses is where you'll see me do it most often.

[magpie patrick]

Out of interest (and for future reference!) - what makes that lock so difficult to use without using the ladder? No landing stage? Bridge?

 

A main road crosses the bridge immediatly below the lock. the lock abuts the bridge which must be about 30 feet long (theroad carriageway is around 6.5m, sorry to mix it but roads are measured in metres these days! errrm 21 feet). Even Mr Tickle would struggle! I should imagine various tricks like floating the rope through and reaching it with a pole might be possible but the ladder is the easiest by some margin.

[Chris J W]

A main road crosses the bridge immediatly below the lock. the lock abuts the bridge which must be about 30 feet long (theroad carriageway is around 6.5m, sorry to mix it but roads are measured in metres these days! errrm 21 feet). Even Mr Tickle would struggle! I should imagine various tricks like floating the rope through and reaching it with a pole might be possible but the ladder is the easiest by some margin.

 

Ta!

 

Think when I get round there, then, I'll hang about till another boat comes along!

[Sir Nibble]

Sorry snibs but I've single handed caen hill and Bradford

 

No need to be sorry! I would love to know how you can single hand up at Bradford tho'.

For Chris' benefit, there is a road bridge immediately below the lower gates, there is no towpath just vertical walls. After the bridge is a boat which is part of a resteraunt. The only way I can see it is from the waiting mooring, fire a rocket line about 200 metres, under the bridge and into the lock (the tops of the gates aren't visible). Walk around and use a grapnel or a 30ft boathook to retrieve the line and pull. The boat will bounce off the resteraunt and the bridge sides and go into the chamber. Alternatively, put the boat into the lock, heave a line up and reverse the boat out paying out the rope as you go, until you can get back ashore at the waiting mooring. This would take a lot of rope, and come to think of it, you would need to go ashore to secure it and then drop it into the lock, put the boat in and pick it up, THEN reverse out.............

It's possible with enough rope and time when no one else wants the lock but you are unlikely to succeed this way as by this time one of the 4 or 5 boats waiting will put a crew ashore and work the lock for you.

Just re read this. I am not trying to ridicule your answer here Carl, I really would like to know how you did it. That is, presuming it wasn't down only, cos' that's easy if you don't mind leaving paddles and gates open behind you.

[David Schweizer]

Those people criticising Snibble obviously do not know Bradford Town Lock. The bottom gates of the lock are hard against the road bridge and there are no steps down and no towpath under the bridge. You can't even pass the rope under the bridge as there is a large building on the other side of the bridge right against the canal. To continue on youir way, the towpath has to be accesesed on foot by leaving the lock, crossing the road, walking down the road to the Canal Tavern, and using the track betwen the Tavern and Lock Inn Cottage, past the cottage gardens and on to the re started towpath 300 yards further down. How they did it with horses I do not know, I can only assume they poled their way out of the lock.

 

Sorry Snibble, I was still writing this when you posted your reply,

Edited November 15, 2007 by David Schweizer

[Maffi]

I have been through that lock up and down several times. There are steps down the side of the bridge. It is possible to step off going up having set the gate open. And going down you can hold the boat on the rope while you close the gate. No need to use the ladder if you choose not to.

 

 

Edit:- If you have not alreay read further own I was refering to Buckby Top Lock and not Braford-on-Avon Lock which was a few posts earlier.

Edited November 15, 2007 by Maffi

[Sir Nibble]

There are steps down the side of that bridge.

 

Very very very well hidden then, at both ends, and presumably passing through the building David mentioned. Ah! hang on, are you referring to Bath deep lock? 'cos for certain there are non at Bradford.

[bottle]

There is more than one Bradford

Edited November 15, 2007 by bottle

[Maffi]

Very very very well hidden then, at both ends, and presumably passing through the building David mentioned. Ah! hang on, are you referring to Bath deep lock? 'cos for certain there are non at Bradford.

 

Buckby top lock. David posted while I ws replying.

 

 

There is more than one Bradford

 

Only one at Bradford on Avon

Edited November 15, 2007 by Maffi

[KenK]

Normally I don't mind using ladders. This summer SWMBO left me to do the locks down into Bath whilst the girls went shopping. Waited for half an hour hoping someone would come along to assist, typically no one in sight. Then two boats came up, I figured all the locks were set for me so set off. I was fine until the deep lock, fortunately I had decided to hang on to the front rope as well as the centre line, as one look down convinced me no way was I climbing down into there, only seen it looking up from the boat before. The boat had wandered over to the far side, pulling like mad on the centre line wouldn't move it finally managed with the assistance of a couple of nice kind people who were passing to shift it with the front rope and get it out of the lock.

 

I agree with Snibble take each one as it comes and carefully they are all ready to play tricks on you.

 

Whilst on the subject of locks anyone know who's hidden the Leeds / Liverpool like ground paddles operated with a wooden spike at Newbury lock on the K&A as mentioned in the months Canal Boat, I've only been able to find gate paddles at both ends. Do the people who write these cruising guides actually cruise the waterway in question, that one was a load of waffle? Still Bones did give Snibble a mention, a nice one.

 

Ken

[magpie patrick]

Whilst on the subject of locks anyone know who's hidden the Leeds / Liverpool like ground paddles operated with a wooden spike at Newbury lock on the K&A as mentioned in the months Canal Boat, I've only been able to find gate paddles at both ends. Do the people who write these cruising guides actually cruise the waterway in question, that one was a load of waffle? Still Bones did give Snibble a mention, a nice one.

 

Ken

 

They were there last time I looked, admittedly that was a little while ago.