Closed winding holes

[Dharl]

On our first ever trip out of Hilperton on a 45ft Hireboat we made a mistake reading the map thinking that there was a winding hole below Seend Bottom lock - which there wasn’t.    As it was our last day and had be back at the base for 0900 the following morning we managed to find a widish but if the K&A, stuck the nose in a bush and managed to wind ok with a combination of  short turn technique and using the stern line to pull her round without using the engine to damage the bank.......

[Nightwatch]

On 16/07/2020 at 08:43, Athy said:

The winding hole belongs to Gregg Klaes, owner of Forge Farm and Clattercote Wharf. If the sign puts off a lot of boaters, that's because it's supposed to.

   About half a mile further towards Claydon, round the bend and before the locks, there is a winding hole immediately beyond what we call Anorexics' Bridge, the bridge with the very thin top.

I agree. I was going to state similar. 

[mrsmelly]

16 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Some issues of Nicholsins were reprinted because there were so many errors.

 

I generaly use them as a " Rough Guide " there are so many errors that we tend to edit them as we go along. The latest set show a water point here for instance and there isnt one and never has been peeps pull up for water and indignantly state " Well Nicholsons says there is one lol ". The list of mistakes is endless.

[Dave123]

On the flip side there is a fairly new 'official' winding hole on the south Oxford at Twyford wharf. It used to just be a silted hole in the private bank just for those who moored there. Now it has CRT signs including no mooring opposite it now. The South Oxford does need more winding holes to stop unnecessary journeys through locks just to wind. It would save water.

Edited July 17, 2020 by Dave123

[Athy]

11 minutes ago, Dave123 said:

 The South Oxford does need more winding holes to stop unnecessary journeys through locks just to wind. It would save water.

More to the point for many boaters, it would save time.

[Athy]

1 hour ago, Dharl said:

On our first ever trip out of Hilperton on a 45ft Hireboat we made a mistake reading the map thinking that there was a winding hole below Seend Bottom lock - which there wasn’t.    As it was our last day and had be back at the base for 0900 the following morning we managed to find a widish but if the K&A, stuck the nose in a bush and managed to wind ok with a combination of  short turn technique and using the stern line to pull her round without using the engine to damage the bank.......

There is satisfaction to be derived from j-u-s-t getting round like that. We have done similar just North of Banbury lock, turning our 45-footer with inches to spare (and we've done it twice to prove it wasn't a fluke!)

 

On the other hand, one looks and feels a bit of a pruneau if such a manoeuvre is tried and fails -m as we did with our first boat near the Anchor pub at Hartshill. A 40-footer, she j-u-s-t wouldn't get round A 38-footer certainly would have done. The small crowd which had gathered was quite well entertained.

[mrsmelly]

59 minutes ago, Dave123 said:

On the flip side there is a fairly new 'official' winding hole on the south Oxford at Twyford wharf. It used to just be a silted hole in the private bank just for those who moored there. Now it has CRT signs including no mooring opposite it now. The South Oxford does need more winding holes to stop unnecessary journeys through locks just to wind. It would save water.

It's only short though. Any boats moored anywhere near make it hard to negotiate. 

[Dharl]

52 minutes ago, Athy said:

There is satisfaction to be derived from j-u-s-t getting round like that. We have done similar just North of Banbury lock, turning our 45-footer with inches to spare (and we've done it twice to prove it wasn't a fluke!)

 

On the other hand, one looks and feels a bit of a pruneau if such a manoeuvre is tried and fails -m as we did with our first boat near the Anchor pub at Hartshill. A 40-footer, she j-u-s-t wouldn't get round A 38-footer certainly would have done. The small crowd which had gathered was quite well entertained.

Luckily was far enough out in the sticks that there were no witnesses....prob why it was successful!   I had tried further down just by the previous locks just after the aqueduct when we first realised our (ok mine, not SWMBO) Mistake and failed miserably.    That time there was some hikers and a live aboard all watching with interest....

[TheBiscuits]

1 hour ago, Athy said:

On the other hand, one looks and feels a bit of a pruneau if such a manoeuvre is tried and fails

 

It's worse when you know you can turn there so go in confidently then discover the water level is a few inches lower than usual so you get jammed on the bottom.

 

Don't ask me how I discovered this ...

[Onionman]

I use winding holes but if I couldn't and a person at a marina shouted at me to complain at my turning round I'd politely ask them to explain what harm I could possibly be causing. I'd also offer to give my name and the address at which they could summons me for trespass.

As for the earlier question, would I allow people to use my drive to turn round? Yes, I would and I do. It doesn't bother me even slightly. Why would it? The nose of their car crosses my boundary line for a moment and then they go on their way, happy in the knowledge that they are now heading in the right direction. You'd have to have a distressingly petty outlook on life if that concerned you even for a second.

I don't go as far as Bill Bryson who, if he sees a no turning sign, uses the entrance and gives a merry toot of his horn in greeting.

Edited July 17, 2020 by Onionman

[Athy]

10 minutes ago, Onionman said:

You'd have to have a distressingly petty outlook on life if that concerned you even for a second.

 

It may distress you and seem petty to you, but to many people it would not.

[Captain Pegg]

9 minutes ago, Onionman said:

I use winding holes but if I couldn't and a person at a marina shouted at me to complain at my turning round I'd politely ask them to explain what harm I could possibly be causing. I'd also offer to give my name and the address at which they could summons me for trespass.

As for the earlier question, would I allow people to use my drive to turn round? Yes, I would and I do. It doesn't bother me even slightly. Why would it? The nose of their car crosses my boundary line for a moment and then they go on their way, happy in the knowledge that they are now heading in the right direction. You'd have to have a distressingly petty outlook on life if that concerned you even for a second.

I don't go as far as Bill Bryson who, if he sees a no turning sign, uses the entrance and gives a merry toot of his horn in greeting.

It becomes an issue when such an action becomes routine because eventually someone will cause damage - or at least wear - that has an implication for the owner. Of course no one wants to think they will be the one to cause such damage but if a large number of boaters all declare it’s OK to wind in the same marina entrance and then routinely do so it would likely come to a head in time.

 

JP

[Onionman]

41 minutes ago, Athy said:

It may distress you and seem petty to you, but to many people it would not.

 

That would be because many people are petty. You see them every day. Park outside their house for half an hour and they get wound up. Go to bed with their spouse and they get wound up. Lean against their wall when you meet a friend in the street and they get wound up. Let someone into a traffic queue and they get wound up. Drive at the speed limit and they get wound up.

Endless pettiness.

Edited July 17, 2020 by Onionman

[frahkn]

23 minutes ago, Athy said:

It may distress you and seem petty to you, but to many people it would not.

Those to whom "it would not" are the people with "a distressingly petty outlook on life", as I understood the post.

 

Sorry, I type slowly.

Edited July 17, 2020 by frahkn

[Tracy D'arth]

5 hours ago, Athy said:

I would substitute "some" and "possibly" for the highlighted words. But your comment does raise a couple of points:

- Most marinas have a wide bit of canal by their entrance to enable their moorers to get in and out, so that you can turn round without actually going through the entrance. We have done this at Braunston a few times, for example.

- If you do stick your bows into the actual entrance, as the water is CART's, what rule are you breaking?

- To what extent does shouting affect the performance of your boat?

 

Neither Cropredy nor Braunston marinas has a No Turning sign as far as I'm aware. Fenny does, but they allowed us to turn there after I'd asked permission.

 

I always turn at Fenny if I have to, to use the pump out. But then I often buy a token one day and do the pump out when they are closed.

TD'

[Machpoint005]

On 16/07/2020 at 08:58, Athy said:

>>Would you feel the same about allowing other people's cars to turn round in your drive?<<

 

Yes, I do, provided they do no harm. It happened a couple of days ago. No problem at all.

 

48 minutes ago, Onionman said:

>>I don't go as far as Bill Bryson who, if he sees a no turning sign, uses the entrance and gives a merry toot of his horn in greeting.<<

I admit to having done that once or twice.

[Machpoint005]

5 hours ago, Captain Pegg said:

CRT do not ‘own’ the water that is not on their land, they maintain a supply to their business partner for which they levy a charge. If you pass the original line of the bank then you will be trespassing on the marina owner’s land.

 

IANAL but it may be open to question whether the water above a tract of land is in fact "permanently attached" to it. The tort of trespass on land is "unjustifiable interference with land which is in the immediate and exclusive possession of another". It is not necessary to prove that harm was suffered to bring a claim. However, I wouldn't expect a civil action against the trespasser to succeed anyway, for several reasons.

 

Wind if you will, and if challenged, apologise profusely once the manoeuvre is over and done with. You won't be challenged, though.