Jump to content
Strawberry Orange Banana Lime Leaf Slate Sky Blueberry Grape Watermelon Chocolate Marble
Strawberry Orange Banana Lime Leaf Slate Sky Blueberry Grape Watermelon Chocolate Marble
Fender151

BSS & Chocolate box connectors

Featured Posts

Advice/ experience please

I have a chocolate box connector from my 12v fridge to the 12v supply, I have been advised these connectors is not BSS compliant, I can't find any specific reference on the BSS requirements spec, 

Do folks have any information, advice.

 

Thanks,

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is Aroha the boat with lots of windows, was Kermit green, cruiser stern with a BMC 1.8D? If so I know it well. Belonged to some friends of mine and I may have installed that fridge!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Fender151 said:

Advice/ experience please

I have a chocolate box connector from my 12v fridge to the 12v supply, I have been advised these connectors is not BSS compliant, I can't find any specific reference on the BSS requirements spec, 

Do folks have any information, advice.

 

Thanks,

 

Advised by whom? A BSS inspector? Or by some bloke on the towpath?

 

Good question though. It's something I've heard claimed occasionally and I don't believe it either.

 

 

A related rumour I hear occasionally is when chocolate block connectors are used, bootlace terminations on the wires must be used. I don't believe that, either!

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No I don't believe there is anything in BSS regs about not using chocolate block connectors on 12 volt electrics.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What is good practice and what is practical and acceptable are not always the same thing. I have never heard of an inspection knockback due to choc block. As far as I know a twisted and soldered joint, insulated, is still acceptable.

Bootlace ferrules are often recommended but millions of choc block joint have been made without.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Advised by whom? A BSS inspector? Or by some bloke on the towpath?

 

Good question though. It's something I've heard claimed occasionally and I don't believe it either.

 

 

A related rumour I hear occasionally is when chocolate block connectors are used, bootlace terminations on the wires must be used. I don't believe that, either!

 

 

We have a few chocolate block (not “box”, but never mind!) connectors on our boat. Certainly nothing in the BSS to prevent it.

As to bootlace termination, this is an RCD a requirement as per ISO 10133 para 10.3. But the BSS does not automatically check for or require compliance with the ISO. However screwing down onto a stranded wire is not best practice -  strands get broken, resistance will increase and possibly the wire may eventually disconnect especially if it’s a thin one.

Edited by nicknorman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As others have said, nothing against Chock Block connectors in the BSS. Bootlace ferrules are best practice but again not mandated under the BSS

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, WotEver said:

As others have said, nothing against Chock Block connectors in the BSS. Bootlace ferrules are best practice but again not mandated under the BSS

 

Yes and this thread touches on another issue.

 

It is important in my opinion to maintain a clear distinction between 'best practice' and 'mandatory requirements'. People commonly confuse the two (even BSS inspectors!) and I think this is the root of much of the misinformation exchanged in the pub or on the towpath, as perhaps in the case of the OP.

 

'Best practice' ignored should never be a BSS fail. Nor should be breaching a requirement in the RCD, even though complying with RCD is widely considered 'best practice'.

 

As I often say here, in order to sort out what is or is not permissible, first one has to decide with which set (or sets) of regulations one wants or needs to comply. In the case of the OP they clearly want to comply with BSS and nothing else. 

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Whilst I appreciate they may not be best practice, I hope that is not something that has been introduced to ban them, as built from new our boat has loads of them, and I have added a few more when adding additional lights etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you, or the examiner, have any concerns about Choc Block connectors (which are BSS compliant AFAIK) you can always wind some insultion tape round the connector to cover the cable screws.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

TIP.  To prevent the ragged cut off end of the terminal screws from chewing up the wires in a choc bar or box just pop in a small ball bearing in before the screw to soften the blow, the ball should remain stationary as the screw presses it down onto the wires.

  • Greenie 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bicycle wheel bearing balls should do the trick from a bike shop. Come in a cage these days, just bust it open with side cutters.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, bizzard said:

TIP.  To prevent the ragged cut off end of the terminal screws from chewing up the wires in a choc bar or box just pop in a small ball bearing in before the screw to soften the blow, the ball should remain stationary as the screw presses it down onto the wires.

 

5 minutes ago, bizzard said:

Bicycle wheel bearing balls should do the trick from a bike shop. Come in a cage these days, just bust it open with side cutters.

 

TIP:

 

A better way to do this is use bootlace ferrules. Made for the job, cheap as chips and a LOAD less grief than robbing the ball bearings out of your bicycle wheels. 

 

:giggles:

 

 

  • Greenie 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

 

TIP:

 

A better way to do this is use bootlace ferrules. Made for the job, cheap as chips and a LOAD less grief than robbing the ball bearings out of your bicycle wheels. 

 

:giggles:

 

 

Cobblers ? :giggles:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, bizzard said:

Cobblers ? :giggles:

 

Bless you...

 

 

22 minutes ago, bizzard said:

just pop in a small ball bearing

 

Or "ball bearion" as my cousin used to absolutely INSIST was the correct name for them...

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I appreciate that there might be a difference between solid and stranded cable, but if you look in the toolbox of any mains voltage electrician, especially one doing commercial/industrial wiring, you will find hundreds of choc blocks, though they do prefer white chocolate these days.

 

.............Dave

  • Greenie 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, David Schweizer said:

If you, or the examiner, have any concerns about Choc Block connectors (which are BSS compliant AFAIK) you can always wind some insultion tape round the connector to cover the cable screws.

If you have space to accommodate them, I reckon what was posted earlier is better.

These have cable clamps in them, so avoid any possibility of the wires being togged at the chocolate block and disconnecting themselves.  Obviously they also insulate the whole lot from its surroundings as well.

86064.jpg

86064.jpg

1 hour ago, WotEver said:

As others have said, nothing against Chock Block connectors in the BSS. Bootlace ferrules are best practice but again not mandated under the BSS

Some choc blocks the screws don't come down on the wires, but instead press on a metal insert that traps the wires.  I reckon using these is much like if you had ferrules in, as the wire strands should remain undamaged by the tightening of the screws.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Fender151 said:

Advice/ experience please

I have a chocolate box connector from my 12v fridge to the 12v supply, I have been advised these connectors is not BSS compliant, I can't find any specific reference on the BSS requirements spec, 

Do folks have any information, advice.

 

Thanks,

 

 

 

Your advisor is wrong.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think any of the 4 different BSS inspectors that have come into my boat have ever checked any of my 12v connections. Perhaps they should have done? Some of my crimped terminals aren't the best.

 

If you twist the exposed multi-strand cable before inserting it into the choc block connector doesn't it stay together when the screw clamps it down? I'd never heard of bootlace ferrules before but wouldn't they create a single point of contact with the screw which in some cases (for smaller cables if the screw pushes the ferrule to one side), the contact area might be quite small and increase resistance?

 

I guess it's all about using the correct size ferrule and connector for the size of the cable.

Edited by blackrose

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, blackrose said:

I guess it's all about using the correct size ferrule and connector for the size of the cable.

Or, if using crimp connectors, the correct size crimp. Plus a proper crimping tool, not one of those bent tin ones from Aldi. 

48 minutes ago, dmr said:

I appreciate that there might be a difference between solid and stranded cable, but if you look in the toolbox of any mains voltage electrician, especially one doing commercial/industrial wiring, you will find hundreds of choc blocks, though they do prefer white chocolate these days.

 

.............Dave

All the electricians I know have Wago connectors in their tool box. Not only do they make better contact but they’re much faster to use than chock block; important to a jobbing sparky. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, blackrose said:

I don't think any of the 4 different BSS inspectors that have come into my boat have ever checked any of my 12v connections. Perhaps they should have done? Some of my crimped terminals aren't the best.

 

If you twist the exposed multi-strand cable before inserting it into the choc block connector doesn't it stay together when the screw clamps it down? I'd never heard of bootlace ferrules before but wouldn't they create a single point of contact with the screw which in some cases (for smaller cables if the screw pushes the ferrule to one side), the contact area might be quite small and increase resistance?

 

I guess it's all about using the correct size ferrule and connector for the size of the cable.

Instead of bootlace ferrules you can use these to connect to choc blocks.

Blade crimps.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, Flyboy said:

Instead of bootlace ferrules you can use these to connect to choc blocks.

Blade crimps.jpg

Interesting, but if you are going to join to cables with a choc block, and crimp one of those to each cables, why not just use a connector with a crimp at each end?

94616_P&$prodImageMedium$

Same number of crimps, but no screwed connections.
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And non ones even mentioned giving the wire ends a scrape to bright copper before, crimping boot lacing, soldering and balls, especially soldering. No wonder folk get high resistance joints.

71-f5N9LeOL._SX385_ Quality street.jpg

Edited by bizzard

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

Interesting, but if you are going to join to cables with a choc block, and crimp one of those to each cables, why not just use a connector with a crimp at each end?

94616_P&$prodImageMedium$

Same number of crimps, but no screwed connections.
 

I was thinking the same, but at least the choc block lets you easily break and remake the connection with just a small screwdriver.  I have a splice to make on one of the wires that comes off the back of the domestic alternator that I had to bodge in the summer when we lost charging, I will be doing that with a crimp connector and not a choc block!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.