Thoughts on this boat please folks.

[Alan de Enfield]

26 minutes ago, Matt&Jo said:

Hull condition was fine with next to no pitting at all... most was on the base plate at 0.7mm

It really sounds as if you have made the decision and are just looking for reassurance that you are doing the right thing.

If it all goes pear shaped it'll cost me nothing, if it works out fine then I can say 'told you so' -  so if it helps, GO FOR IT !!

[LadyG]

I think it is natural to feel a bit of a cold shadow when making a one off decision, I know I did when I got near to a purchase,  so much depends on it, its not like buying a car, nothing like. 

There is no desperate rush, sleep on it..............

[Matt&Jo]

I actualy called and said no i redact my offer we love the boat but this current settled figure is not acceptable....just trying to think of a way forward with this as we want the boat....

Was thinking of offering an additional 1000 and seeing what we can get in terms of concession from the vendor

[LadyG]

Let them sleep on it, its their turn to talk...............

[rusty69]

Pity you can't bypass the broker.

[Matt&Jo]

9 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Let them sleep on it, its their turn to talk...............

Did that saturday and the seller just said okay....such a shame, my wife is gutted but is equally stubborn so im going to stop boring you all with my issues and just say sod it...someone will buy it and its potential problems

Edited March 25, 2018 by Matt&Jo

[Alan de Enfield]

25 minutes ago, Matt&Jo said:

Was thinking of offering an additional 1000 and seeing what we can get in terms of concession from the vendor

To be honest I would be thinking of offering a 'couple of £1000' less and don't bother with a survey. That would give you an additional £3000 to play with for repairs which would certainly cover the issues you have highlighted. A boat is :

1) The Hull / Structure

2) The Engine

3) The gear box

If you are happy that the above are in reasonable (working) condition then anything else is pretty much cosmetic and can be relatively easily (comparatively cheaply) fixed.

Offer him £2000 less than your current offer, say "Its cash today, no survey and I'll take the boat away (assuming the engine / gear box runs), alternatively you can hold out for however many months it'll take to find someone else, who may make the same offer, in the meantime you are incurring mooring, licence and insurance costs  and the boat continues to depreciate. It is often that the 1st offer turns out to be the best. Your choice, let me know quickly as I will still be looking at other boats."

[rusty69]

1 hour ago, Alan de Enfield said:

What did the 2015 survey say about hull condition (bearing in mind a lot can still happen in 3 years)

 

1 hour ago, Matt&Jo said:

Hull condition was fine with next to no pitting at all... most was on the base plate at 0.7mm

 

10 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

To be honest I would be thinking of offering a 'couple of £1000' less and don't bother with a survey. That would give you an additional £3000 to play with for repairs which would certainly cover the issues you have highlighted. A boat is :

1) The Hull / Structure

2) The Engine

3) The gear box

If you are happy that the above are in reasonable (working) condition then anything else is pretty much cosmetic and can be relatively easily (comparatively cheaply) fixed.

Offer him £2000 less than your current offer, say "Its cash today, no survey and I'll take the boat away (assuming the engine / gear box runs), alternatively you can hold out for however many months it'll take to find someone else, who may make the same offer, in the meantime you are incurring mooring, licence and insurance costs  and the boat continues to depreciate. It is often that the 1st offer turns out to be the best. Your choice, let me know quickly as I will still be looking at other boats."

How does the OP satisfy themselves that the hull is in reasonable condition?

[Athy]

1 hour ago, mrsmelly said:

Most windows leaked on this boat when I bought it. A pain in the aress 

Surely "pane"?

 

So, Matt and Jo, your current situation is that you are NOT buying the boat? The storyline is careering along so fast that i can't keep up with it - I imagine that you feel the same at times.

[Alan de Enfield]

11 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

 

 

How does the OP satisfy themselves that the hull is in reasonable condition?

Not easily and mostly by experience and luck.

Look at the water line for a starter - is there a lot of corrosion or just 'surface rust'.

Roll your sleeves up and feel along the bottom as far as you can reach.

Is the sacrificial edge still in place, or worn totally away ?

Look under the floor and in the bilge - boats can rust from the inside out as well as outside in.

Remember that rust is 8-10 times thicker than the steel it replaces - 10mm thickness of rust comes from just 1mm of steel.

What thickness was shown on the last survey - where has it been kept since then ? Has it been left hooked up on mains ? Are there other boats around it ?

 

Its always a risk, but so is relying on a surveyor (as I found out to my cost)

 

Edit to add - If the boat is over 20/25/30 years old and you intend to insure it 'fully comp' you will need a survey anyway. (You can just insure it 3rd part, which is sufficient to get your licence)

Edited March 25, 2018 by Alan de Enfield

[rusty69]

I spose you could add, remove weedhatch and have a good look round with a torch too.

Ifits been on mains has galvanic isolator/Isolation transformer correctly fitted.

Edited March 25, 2018 by rusty69

[Dr Bob]

6 hours ago, Matt&Jo said:

Hull condition was fine with next to no pitting at all... most was on the base plate at 0.7mm

What's that in feet and inches? Mr smelly will not understand.

On windows, we had 4 leaking windows which were sorted with a mixture of Cpt Tolleys and some new foam sealing strip. Ok probably an ongoing battle with time but new sealing strip made a huge difference. May not be as bad as you think.

[MtB]

6 hours ago, Matt&Jo said:

We love the boat we do....leaky pram hoods and potentialy leaky windows just scares us financialy....

 

I'm getting really worried by your comments about relatively trivial expenses. These are going to crop up continually once you own a boat. 

Have you actually watched that video in another current thread about reasons not to buy a boat? The ongoing maintenance expenses will be anything but trivial once you are a boat owner and I get the feeling you are expecting once all survey faults are ironed out, no more ever will ever occur... WRONG!

A boat is a never-ending maintenance project. 

Edited March 25, 2018 by Mike the Boilerman
correct a worm

[TheBiscuits]

12 minutes ago, Dr Bob said:

What's that in feet and inches? Mr smelly will not understand.

27.56 thou in allegedly sensible units.

Much easier to work with

 

[Sea Dog]

2 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

27.56 thou in allegedly sensible units.

Much easier to work with

 

You can't go using imperial measurements to 2 decimal places!  Surely you mean 27 and 14/25ths of a thou? 

[Matt&Jo]

13 hours ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

I'm getting really worried by your comments about relatively trivial expenses. These are going to crop up continually once you own a boat. 

Have you actually watched that video in another current thread about reasons not to buy a boat? The ongoing maintenance expenses will be anything but trivial once you are a boat owner and I get the feeling you are expecting once all survey faults are ironed out, no more ever will ever occur... WRONG!

A boat is a never-ending maintenance project. 

I dont mind paying for it once its mine but to buy problems is a bit of a tough pill to swallow mike....

[MtB]

6 minutes ago, Matt&Jo said:

I dont mind paying for it once its mine but to buy problems is a bit of a tough pill to swallow mike....

 

Buying a boat at all is to buy a stream of ongoing maintenance expenses and other expenses.

One or two maintenance issues you might have missed at the point of purchase are hardly a 'tough pill to swallow' when you look at the bigger picture. 

Edited March 26, 2018 by Mike the Boilerman
Improve clarity

[Matt&Jo]

20 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Buying a boat at all is to buy a stream of ongoing maintenance expenses and other expenses.

One or two maintenance issues you might have missed at the point of purchase are hardly a 'tough pill to swallow' when you look at the bigger picture. 

But i dont know if they will be minor thats the point mike...its a gamble getting the survey done and loose the deposit or inherit thousands of pounds of problems.... because he wont budge on price post survey faults.....

Ive had sea fairing vessels so i know all about the costs of running and owning boats...i dunno maybe your right but as om not a rich man 50/60k is a chunk of change to risk

[MtB]

10 minutes ago, Matt&Jo said:

But i dont know if they will be minor thats the point mike...its a gamble getting the survey done and loose the deposit or inherit thousands of pounds of problems.... because he wont budge on price post survey faults.....

Ive had sea fairing vessels so i know all about the costs of running and owning boats...i dunno maybe your right but as om not a rich man 50/60k is a chunk of change to risk

 

The main reason for a survey is to get the boat out of the water and have a good look at the hull. Measure the metal thinkness in a few dozen places in particular. Only a 'hull only' survey is needed for this and typical cost is £250 plus docking fees. 

The rest of the boat I'd have thought you could check out yourself with your boating experience. Stuff like making sure everything works as it should, look in the bilges, check windows for leaks, engine starts cleanly from cold, fluid levels, service record etc etc. 

£50/60k is a massive amount to spend on a boat. You can buy a perfectly good'un for £40k, and this would give you some headroom for ongoing maintenance.

[manxmike]

On 26/03/2018 at 12:55, Mike the Boilerman said:

£50/60k is a massive amount to spend on a boat. You can buy a perfectly good'un for £40k, and this would give you some headroom for ongoing maintenance.

Couldn't agree more.

I have had good experiences with Venetian Marina, found them straightforward and honest.

When I bought, it was at the bottom of the market so I got a good deal. Five years later I came to sell and the potential buyer found the hull was down to 2mm in places! My survey five years earlier had shown the hull to be 7mm at worst. I had used an independent surveyor and had no reason to doubt his findings.

My point is, even the best survey won't show up everything. The initial expenses, even if the survey is golden and glorious, will be scary. All sorts of things will only make themselves visible after a period of use - things that you will then wonder at their obviousness (is that a word?) and have to find either sufficient money to fix, or find a workaround. If you love the boat then all else pales into insignificance. If the hull / engine / gearbox is good then that's a great start, I agree that it seems heavily overpriced for what it is (and with the potential work needed) try knocking £10k off and see what he says - in the meantime keep on looking, the perfect boat is out there somewhere.

[Dr Bob]

3 hours ago, manxmike said:

Couldn't agree more.

I have had good experiences with Venetian Marina, found them straightforward and honest.

When I bought, it was at the bottom of the market so I got a good deal. Five years later I came to sell and the potential buyer found the hull was down to 2mm in places! My survey five years earlier had shown the hull to be 7mm at worst. I had used an independent surveyor and had no reason to doubt his findings.

My point is, even the best survey won't show up everything. The initial expenses, even if the survey is golden and glorious, will be scary. All sorts of things will only make themselves visible after a period of use - things that you will then wonder at their obviousness (is that a word?) and have to find either sufficient money to fix, or find a workaround. If you love the boat then all else pales into insignificance. If the hull / engine / gearbox is good then that's a great start, I agree that it seems heavily overpriced for what it is (and with the potential work needed) try knocking £10k off and see what he says - in the meantime keep on looking, the perfect boat is out there somewhere.

Absolutely agree. We spent just over £40k on ours and the £10k for a bit of an internal refit (new kitchen, dinette, et ,etc ) plus probably another £10k on other improvements, bits, spares and it is now very functional apart from the odd alternator issue caused by buying an infrequent red thermometer ( see other thread) and a dodgy water pump switch ( tune in tomorrow when you will hear Dr Bob say "does anyone know how to fix a dodgy water pump switch" - yes honestly but I need to take a pic first). If you spend £60k on the boat you will still need to find another £20k to sort out the things that need changing.

[JamesFrance]

9 hours ago, Dr Bob said:

 If you spend £60k on the boat you will still need to find another £20k to sort out the things that need changing.

And for that price you can have a well equipped new 57ft boat built, so I would prefer to do that.

[Dr Bob]

2 minutes ago, JamesFrance said:

And for that price you can have a well equipped new 57ft boat built, so I would prefer to do that.

No, I think it will be a bit more because you would need to spend a lot more on extras to get the boat to the point where it is good to live in....and dont forget all the spares.