nb Russia

[Rufford]

Unfortunatly refusal of assistance is not at all uncommon when working with vulnerable people, there are many reasons why, some of which suggest mental I'll health, embarrassment, and or fear. I speak from long and frustrating experience that it's difficult.

 

However, and not to personally attack Sean as I have never met him, but he is a housing officer by trade I believe. I don't belive that this particular experience is what is needed to work with somebody such as this guy. Sean maybe able to help him off of his boat with housing, but what about those that need support whilst on boats? To walk away from a person who needs help but is refusing is far from utilising the skills needed to be a decent welfare officer.

And welcome Sir Japser, we are practically neighbours, I'm down at spikes bridge

 

It is sad but I have seen it countless times. And lets face it, I bet most of us have refused help when we needed it. Too proud, dont want to be a nuisance, I suppose its the stiff upper lip way of the British.

 

Shame :-(

[SirJasper]

to my knowledge the owner ( I feel uncomfortable naming him), was living in a waterlogged boat, wading in and out of her, with no heating, and very unsafe electrics , with mold on every surface. the owner clearly has depression/ mental health issues, and had not paid any mooring fees for a considerable time. as CRT is supposed to be a charity, and they were aware of this mans struggle, it seems to me that they had some sort of moral responsibility for the welfare of this tenant. I know it was not strictly their problem, but they should look beyond the limits of their landlord / tenant relationship with this man, they were the largest organisation he came into contact with on a regular basis, and could have done something.

[Naughty Cal]

to my knowledge the owner ( I feel uncomfortable naming him), was living in a waterlogged boat, wading in and out of her, with no heating, and very unsafe electrics , with mold on every surface. the owner clearly has depression/ mental health issues, and had not paid any mooring fees for a considerable time. as CRT is supposed to be a charity, and they were aware of this mans struggle, it seems to me that they had some sort of moral responsibility for the welfare of this tenant. I know it was not strictly their problem, but they should look beyond the limits of their landlord / tenant relationship with this man, they were the largest organisation he came into contact with on a regular basis, and could have done something.

If someone is unwilling to accept help then you cannot force it upon them.

 

I think you are looking too much into the "CRT is a charity" topic. It isn't a charity in the traditional sense and they have no obligation to offer assistance to people or for peoples welfare.

 

You seem to think CRT should have done more. What would you have expected them to do?

[MtB]

to my knowledge the owner ( I feel uncomfortable naming him), was living in a waterlogged boat, wading in and out of her, with no heating, and very unsafe electrics , with mold on every surface. the owner clearly has depression/ mental health issues, and had not paid any mooring fees for a considerable time. as CRT is supposed to be a charity, and they were aware of this mans struggle, it seems to me that they had some sort of moral responsibility for the welfare of this tenant. I know it was not strictly their problem, but they should look beyond the limits of their landlord / tenant relationship with this man, they were the largest organisation he came into contact with on a regular basis, and could have done something.

 

 

Fair enough, but you still haven't said exactly what you expected them to do, other than take moral responsibility for his welfare. Do you think they should have repaired his boat? Forcibly re-homed him? Or what?

[Tuscan]

to my knowledge the owner ( I feel uncomfortable naming him), was living in a waterlogged boat, wading in and out of her, with no heating, and very unsafe electrics , with mold on every surface. the owner clearly has depression/ mental health issues, and had not paid any mooring fees for a considerable time. as CRT is supposed to be a charity, and they were aware of this mans struggle, it seems to me that they had some sort of moral responsibility for the welfare of this tenant. I know it was not strictly their problem, but they should look beyond the limits of their landlord / tenant relationship with this man, they were the largest organisation he came into contact with on a regular basis, and could have done something.

Would you know if he is being helped now ? Or is he now both boatless and homeless?

[SirJasper]

thanks for the welcomes, and perhaps I am being slightly unfair to CRT but it has been frustrating seeing this guy left, as Lady Muck indicated "rough sleeping" on a boat, with no one in authority doing anything. As neighbours, we have given what support we can to this individual but we have had to walk on egg shells, not to upset or make this guy feel judged or under any further stress from unwanted intrusion into his private life. I just feel ashamed of our community, that we couldn't get this guy the help that he needed.

[Bod]

I feel that as an organisation C&RT should have made the local Social Services aware of the situation, C&RT being a recognized waterway authority, the S.S. should have taken notice.

Help being refused, is very difficult to deal with, but at the end of the day, then if a person is a danger to themselves or others, then the police have the means to act.

 

Hopefully should this situation happen again, then the C&RT Welfare Officer, will be in a position to help. Most likely by getting other agencies involved, as soon as required.

Remember the welfare officer can only act on what he knows!

 

Bod

[Wanted]

If someone is unwilling to accept help then you cannot force it upon them.

 

I think you are looking too much into the "CRT is a charity" topic. It isn't a charity in the traditional sense and they have no obligation to offer assistance to people or for peoples welfare.

 

You seem to think CRT should have done more. What would you have expected them to do?

No obligation? You Clearly have little knowledge of the governance of any large organisation, and that of a charity. I would suggest that by appointing a welfare officer CRT are accepting responsibility also.

Fair enough, but you still haven't said exactly what you expected them to do, other than take moral responsibility for his welfare. Do you think they should have repaired his boat? Forcibly re-homed him? Or what?

A welfare officer with more than just housing experience would use or employ the skills of someone to use a range of techniques and acts in order to assist. This could range from as little as befriending services right up to the might of the mental health capacity act.

 

Either way, and as I suspect, the idea of a welfare officer may well be just a token act to suggest that something is being done when really it will be to push as many people onto the housing register and off of the cut as possible.

 

I'll eat my words and publicly apologies when I read that the welfare officer has successfully halted and turned around a section 8.

[Athy]

I would suggest that by appointing a welfare officer CRT are accepting responsibility also.

Well, quite so - the clue's in the name. He is there to concern himself with the welfare of people on the waterways.

 

On the other hand, as I think was mentioned earlier, he's just one chap covering about 2,000 miles of waterways, and his "in" tray must be getting mighty crowded.

[p6rob]

Sadly it does sound like this guy is his own worst enemy. At what point could anyone have stepped in without being accused of interfering against his will before it became too late. Sounds very much like being stuck between a rock and a hard place in a creek with no paddle.

 

Hindsight is a perfect science but I like to think I'd have dropped a pump in and helped if I noticed a nearby boat getting progressively lower in the water. Of course, offset against that I'd have objected if someone else decided they felt obliged to pump out my boat and I'd be equally upset if it sunk after no one had helped pump out my boat knowing it had been steadily sinking for two years. I am an oxymoron, perhaps he is too.

[bottle]

Title: Welfare Officer

 

Job remit: ....

 

Job description: ....

 

 

Does anyone know or are we all guessing what it should be.

 

 

 

The holder of the title and those that appointed him will.

[Paul G2]

No obligation? You Clearly have little knowledge of the governance of any large organisation, and that of a charity. I would suggest that by appointing a welfare officer CRT are accepting responsibility also.

 

A welfare officer with more than just housing experience would use or employ the skills of someone to use a range of techniques and acts in order to assist. This could range from as little as befriending services right up to the might of the mental health capacity act.

 

Either way, and as I suspect, the idea of a welfare officer may well be just a token act to suggest that something is being done when really it will be to push as many people onto the housing register and off of the cut as possible.

 

I'll eat my words and publicly apologies when I read that the welfare officer has successfully halted and turned around a section 8.

 

It sounds like maybe you should have applied for the Welfare Officer job at CRT - and I mean that sincerely.

 

It's really a pity that mental health issues are so thoroughly and universally misunderstood. Just looking at the comments on this thread, you have people who would probably give you the shirt off their back talking like there is nothing anyone can do. If this man were laying on the ground bleeding to death, most likely everyone here would jump to his aid and do anything they could to save him. But when he is figuratively bleeding to death from mental illness, those same people throw up their hands and say there's nothing can be done. As you have pointed out, though, that doesn't necessarily have to be the case.

 

It seems CRT missed the boat when writing the job description and necessary qualifications for their welfare officer. It's probably too late to do anything now. Most organizations like CRT would never admit they made a mistake and seek a more qualified individual. Perhaps you can use this instance as an opportunity to contact Mr. Parry and make a case for the proper qualifications for a welfare officer. Even if he isn't willing to admit a mistake and seek someone with other qualifications, perhaps he could be convinced to train the officer they have so that he is more cognizant of mental health issues and how to deal with them.

[Wanted]

It sounds like maybe you should have applied for the Welfare Officer job at CRT - and I mean that sincerely.

 

It's really a pity that mental health issues are so thoroughly and universally misunderstood. Just looking at the comments on this thread, you have people who would probably give you the shirt off their back talking like there is nothing anyone can do. If this man were laying on the ground bleeding to death, most likely everyone here would jump to his aid and do anything they could to save him. But when he is figuratively bleeding to death from mental illness, those same people throw up their hands and say there's nothing can be done. As you have pointed out, though, that doesn't necessarily have to be the case.

 

It seems CRT missed the boat when writing the job description and necessary qualifications for their welfare officer. It's probably too late to do anything now. Most organizations like CRT would never admit they made a mistake and seek a more qualified individual. Perhaps you can use this instance as an opportunity to contact Mr. Parry and make a case for the proper qualifications for a welfare officer. Even if he isn't willing to admit a mistake and seek someone with other qualifications, perhaps he could be convinced to train the officer they have so that he is more cognizant of mental health issues and how to deal with them.

I did consider it, and on one hand it would have been a great job, alas, my career is working in development of these services now and not so much face to face (although I still keep my hand in) and I fear that the job would just be to act as the puppet for a token approach.

I mean no ill will of the guy who's job it is however I am slightly at odds at how he was appointed and what a missed opportunity this could have been.

[Rufford]

Sadly it does sound like this guy is his own worst enemy. At what point could anyone have stepped in without being accused of interfering against his will before it became too late. Sounds very much like being stuck between a rock and a hard place in a creek with no paddle.

 

Hindsight is a perfect science but I like to think I'd have dropped a pump in and helped if I noticed a nearby boat getting progressively lower in the water. Of course, offset against that I'd have objected if someone else decided they felt obliged to pump out my boat and I'd be equally upset if it sunk after no one had helped pump out my boat knowing it had been steadily sinking for two years. I am an oxymoron, perhaps he is too.

 

ROFL

 

I think you about summed it up.

[MtB]

 

ROFL

 

I think you about summed it up.

 

You what? It's not funny.

 

However I too think Rob summed it up.

 

We are all oxymorons and hypocrytes too, each in our own way...

 

MtB

[Bee]

Without getting into any welfare or moral issues I am surprised CRT did not act to prevent a potential pollution issue and make efforts to keep the boat afloat. I wonder if the fire brigade would have turned up with a pump? They seem to when houses get flooded.

[Naughty Cal]

Without getting into any welfare or moral issues I am surprised CRT did not act to prevent a potential pollution issue and make efforts to keep the boat afloat. I wonder if the fire brigade would have turned up with a pump? They seem to when houses get flooded.

Trouble is if crt pump out one boat and keep it afloat they will be expected to do the same elsewhere across the system.

[MtB]

Trouble is if crt pump out one boat and keep it afloat they will be expected to do the same elsewhere across the system.

 

As pointed out in post 23...

[Emerald Fox]

"there are a dozen or so that I can think of of the top of my head, right now, basically rough sleeping but in a boat." - could not Prince William and Kate Middleton not go and give a hand to their subjects? I'm sure they have little else better to do...

[Emerald Fox]

We could all help out here by listing all boats and situations we consider to be 'iffy', so that CRT and everyone here can check to see how things are (hopefully) improving.

 

But where is the line? People living on boats and can't afford to - no money - do we just throw wheelbarrows full of cash into the Black Hole?

How should people with not enough money be treated?

 

Removed some content which I felt was invasive of someones privacy. DeanS

 

This forum is intended to be a family forum and the language and terms used should reflect this. You agree, through your use of this service, that you will not use this forum to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, speculative, inaccurate, aimed to deceive, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, inflammatory, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy,

 

 

Perhaps a new section could be made in the forums to be called 'Boats in Potential Danger' or 'Help Needed' ?

 

(Oh - and we donated 4 litres of diesel to that boat, that's what we had in our little 'emergency' container)

Edited January 11, 2015 by DeanS

[Emerald Fox]

A day has gone by... has anybody helped the nameless green narrowboat in Banbury centre? Sitting there with dead batteries.

[Erie Canal]

Before we all second guess ourselves into a frenzy, I have copied the details of the initial post to Sean and will also see if we have a Chaplain up there to help/ who has already helped. We are finding more and more cases like this, it is absolutely tragic, but I am sure all together, even at this late stage, between us, we can help him. Please feel free to PM me any more contacts/ details that may help,

[Erie Canal]

A day has gone by... has anybody helped the nameless **** narrowboat in ******? Sitting there with dead batteries.

Again, will see who we have in the area, and please PM any details you wish to share,

Edited January 11, 2015 by DeanS

[MtB]

Before we all second guess ourselves into a frenzy, I have copied the details of the initial post to Sean and will also see if we have a Chaplain up there to help/ who has already helped. We are finding more and more cases like this, it is absolutely tragic, but I am sure all together, even at this late stage, between us, we can help him. Please feel free to PM me any more contacts/ details that may help,

 

 

 

I think Emerald Fox said the green boat is a female boater....

 

 

MtB

(Or did you mean the owner of RUSSIA?)

[Erie Canal]

My mistake, Mike, been in the car today for 5 hours visiting family. Ready to hit the sack...