Cautionary Tale

[Andy Healey]

Seen some comments on blacking on here recently and also some talk of grit blasting. I have just spotted this sad and cautionary tale on a blog I follow.Story not fully told yet but looks like an absolute nightmare scenario.

http://www.nb-kelly-louise.com/2014/11/the-dream-that-turned-into-nightmare.html

I am sure they will not mind this tale been shared to make others aware of potential pitfalls.

[MtB]

Grim tale but virtually impenetrable writing style. I gave up in the end.

 

 

MtB

[Alan de Enfield]

"The Start Of Our Trail Of Devastation", will detail how we bought our boat in March 2009 as a 4 year old

 

One of the many pits is now known to have penetrated the full depth of steel, although that remains pretty much it's original 6mm thickness throughout.

 

6mm of pitting, in a 6mm base plate, is some serious pitting

 

I did not think that anyone was building boats with a 6mm base plate in 2005 - must have been a real 'economy' boat.

 

Still a shame that the boat yard (after grit blasting) did not inform then that the bottom was perforated - just painted over it and re-floated it.

Edited November 26, 2014 by Alan de Enfield

[matty40s]

I am not sure that it was the base plate that was pitted, it just says 6mm steel hull.

I also am not sure that the boat pictured is only 10 years old - handrails and front end are slightly dated.

Perhaps the last 10 years blackings have just been ...."black it please"- with no other instructions.

 

Grit blasting /nail guns etc, are invasive, they will strip loose metal and debris, to leave a clear surface.

A surface pit, may also have internally a pit or rust where internal water seepage or condensation has rotted the inside out.

 

This doesn't excuse the fact that someone should have noticed a hole, or someone should have noticed a sunk boat - however, we have only one side of the story here.

[Alan de Enfield]

I am not sure that it was the base plate that was pitted, it just says 6mm steel hull.

 

Good point - assumptions are dangerous.

[Emerald Fox]

Would be nice to know the name of the boat yard so that we don't end up unwittingly supporting their iffyness...

[Rob-M]

Would be nice to know the name of the boat yard so that we don't end up unwittingly supporting their iffyness...

Look back at previous blog posts (20 Feb) and there is a reference to the marina they went to for the previous blacking. As the post said they went to the same marina as they used before I presume it is that one.

[Proper Job]

I sorry, but I don't see how this is the boat yards fault

 

He was very clear in his instructions about what he wanted the yard to do. Grit balst and two pack the hull, re pack the stern gland, check the prop, rudder and anodes

 

No where did he ask for a hull survey. It's up to the owner to ascertain the hull condition.

 

The yard could well not have known that the hull had been compromised. A small hole at the bottom of a pit is not always easy to see and if the hull was already fairly pitted, they're not going to spend time going round every pit to check.

[nebulae]

I had a similar experience with an ex Bingley Marine boat.I had the hull sides and bottom grit blasted and blacked it myself.As I was close up to the hull when applying the blacking,I could see that it all looked good,with no significant pitting. The boat was about 10 years old at the time. When it was craned back in,I had a leak. Quickly removed the ballast and identified the problem and welded up.I wonder how many boats around the system have this problem? I understand that there is a big problem now with poor quality steel on the market.This is why all steel building frames from this year have to be made by certified fabricators.

[Athy]

So he has just disposed of it "to the trade" at a "teeth-clenching" price. May we expect to see it on the sales list of a prominent Midlands broker before long?

 

I must agree with MTB, the chap must be either a civil servant or a contract lawyer - brevity and succinctness are not features of his writing style.

[Bee]

Attaching blame is not the scary thing here, it is how quickly the steel, be it bottom or sides, was holed and that really is alarming. This was not just 'rust' or wear and the boat was seemingly protected by paint, anodes, and some sort of galvanic isolator. What else could have been done to prevent this pitting? Your average car with steel as thin as a hacksaw blade, in winter salt and really tough conditions and a body used as a 12volt return manages to last as long as a boat in fresh water constructed with great thick slabs of steel. That is what I find scary. Does the quality of steel vary enormously?

Edited November 27, 2014 by Bee

[Athy]

. When it was craned back in,I had a leak.

Full marks for your self-control in waiting so long, Neb.

[Alan de Enfield]

Does this act as a warning, or maybe even cast doubt, on the suitability of using such an abrasive, and potentially 'penetrating' method of cleaning steel. I reckon 'grit' at 1000's of psi will be pretty errosive stuff.

 

Does the operator have insurance in case they 'go through' the hull - how do you argue it was 'their fault' and not just a 'thin-bit'?

 

Slightly similar - with my (water) pressure washer, if I loose concentration/ talking and just stand with the lance in one spot for a few minutes, I can actually cut 'pits' into concrete patio slabs.

[Black Ibis]

Unfortunate situation. Photos of waterlogged interior etc added today. It's every boater's worth nightmare (that or fire)

http://www.nb-kelly-louise.com/search/label/Boating%20Disaster

[John V]

Look at it the other way Alan

If the grit blaster blows a hole in your hull then it was too thin in the first place and you have a chance to repair immediately whereas if you didn't have it grit blasted the hole could have appeared while you were on a crossing of the Wash trip or going down the tidal Trent!!

[Alan de Enfield]

Look at it the other way Alan

If the grit blaster blows a hole in your hull then it was too thin in the first place and you have a chance to repair immediately whereas if you didn't have it grit blasted the hole could have appeared while you were on a crossing of the Wash trip or going down the tidal Trent!!

 

Fair point - as long as the grit blaster, or the painter see the hole(s) before it goes back into the water.

[Andy Healey]

Attaching blame is not the scary thing here, it is how quickly the steel, be it bottom or sides, was holed and that really is alarming. This was not just 'rust' or wear and the boat was seemingly protected by paint, anodes, and some sort of galvanic isolator. What else could have been done to prevent this pitting? Your average car with steel as thin as a hacksaw blade, in winter salt and really tough conditions and a body used as a 12volt return manages to last as long as a boat in fresh water constructed with great thick slabs of steel. That is what I find scary. Does the quality of steel vary enormously?

Cannot really compare to a car, A fully assembled car body is fully immersed in a protective E Coating process, so slightly different scenario.

[Alf Roberts]

Fair point - as long as the grit blaster, or the painter see the hole(s) before it goes back into the water.

well it's a pretty gung ho kind of thing to do, just say, "grit blast" and not ensure some kind of inspection, survey or simply going along to have a look.

 

Given the faffing about coatings in the email, if it was me I would feel pretty stupid for missing this (rather than slinging blame)

 

And they can hardly blame the boatyard for "selling cheap to the trade" presumably they could have repaired and carried on rather than what appears at first sight a rather petulant act.

 

 

....and to add after reading the next episode - to simply trug off without making some effort to see the boat out the water is another irresponsibility. This blog, I can see, is simply a way of slinging some blame presumably for financial reasons.

Edited November 27, 2014 by Alf Roberts

[WJM]

Why wasn't the boat properly inspected by a qualified surveyor when it was out of the water? I blame the owner for failing to have the hull properly measured for thickness. I have my boat fully inspected EVERY time it is out of the water.

[Emerald Fox]

I suppose both owner & worker are to blame:

Boatyard for not having a quick run-round with an ultrasound guage and a hammer, after the blasting; owner for not taking advantage of boat-outta-water-opportunity and arranging a survey.

 

The boatyard could have suggested this?

 

Some old gent left his hat and gloves on my bus yesterday (whilst another driver took it on a short tour for a group of fossils - I found them whilst checking the vehicle after that tour); being a 'professional' I phoned to the hotel they're staying at to arrange the return of items, rather than just wait for someone else to contact me, or do nuffin' at all. A bit of extra effort and time, makes the world go round in a more pleasant way.

Edited November 27, 2014 by FadeToScarlet

[matty40s]

 

Boatyard for not having a quick run-round with an ultrasound guage and a hammer, after the blasting;

 

Surveyors are paid/trained to do this, not boatyards booked for blackings.

We will report any serious pitting found to owner prior to blacking, however, going round with ultrasound or hammer is way beyond the remit of what the owner is contracting us to do..

If serious, we will suggest spot welding, or maybe even plate welding before the blacking is done.

[John V]

This might be unpopular view but IMO the fault (if any) is with the owner. They should have been there checking and inspecting at every stage.. The only time a contractor is responsible is if you gave him the whole job...ie here's the boat check it, repair it, gritblast and paint it, do anything that is needed.

[Andy Healey]

Full story not yet out, so I would have reserved judgement until all details known. I think the main point the chap might be making is about the effects of galvanic corrosion as a guide to owners.

[David Mack]

I understand that there is a big problem now with poor quality steel on the market.This is why all steel building frames from this year have to be made by certified fabricators.

 

But that requirement is about the quality of the fabrication, not the material, so that what an old boss of mine referred to as "garden gate makers" don't start welding steel building frames.

[Giant]

This is an unfortunate situation. I get the impression that the owners were of the belief that it would be normal procedure for the boatyard to in effect carry out a survey. Meanwhile the boatyard probably assumed that the owner was satisfied as to the state of the hull if they were asking for this work to be done.

 

It's easy to argue that the boatyard should have prompted the owner that they might want to bring in a surveyor, it's also easy to argue that after owning the boat for some years the owner might have been expected to know this was standard practice.

 

What the courts would make of such a dispute is an interesting question.

 

[edited to be a bit more polite than my initial response]

Edited November 27, 2014 by Giant