Another down in a lock

[MHS]

 

I agree with Ditchcrawler. These signs are as good as useless when they are behind you. When you go into a lock you are looking at the far end of the lock not above and beside you. These accidents will continue until Cart alter the signs

 

I can see a pantomime theme appearing here.

 

It's behind you.

 

Oh no it isn't.

 

Oh yes it is.

 

Etc

[ditchcrawler]

Yes his hire boat was wooden looking at the photographs, well it was over fifty years ago.

 

I didn't say none had been sunk by stag or hen parties BTW, just perhaps they do it less frequently on the broads, but in the absence of any meaningful comparative stats. not 100% sure.

Funny 50 years ago I never heared of Narrowboats sinking in locks, But of course I didn't belong to CWF then.

[DHutch]

It should be in the insurers conditions, that one sex parties will not be covered by their insurence

And this will then stop accidents like this

I hope this never happens. And doubt it would have much effect on reducing.cillings or other incedent.

[Guest]

Funny 50 years ago I never heared of Narrowboats sinking in locks, But of course I didn't belong to CWF then.

Errr, yes that's probably true.

[MtB]

As said. Not simple at all.

 

What about if sensable level headed bloke and his tea total freinds want to do a weeks boating to celibrate his inpending marriage.

 

Or a group of 20 yo blokes, none of which are planning a marriage want to do a weeks hiring but are mistaken for a stag do.

 

 

Daniel

 

My blanket ban would mean they can't.

 

Like I said, simple!

 

MtB

[Guest]

My blanket ban would mean they can't.

 

Like I said, simple!

 

MtB

How many actual cillings across the system that occur involved all male or all female parties? I guess given your stance it must be a pretty substantial number.

[DHutch]

 

I agree with Ditchcrawler. These signs are as good as useless when they are behind you. When you go into a lock you are looking at the far end of the lock not above and beside you. These accidents will continue until Cart alter the signs

 

Cant see signs helping much.

[Sabcat]

How many actual cillings across the system that occur involved all male or all female parties? I guess given your stance it must be a pretty substantial number.

 

I'm not a fan of regulation but let's face it, groups of people with little or no experience of boating, hiring a boat with the intention of getting wasted on a weekend trip is pretty likely to end badly. I'm not sure it makes much difference if they're same sex or not except that stag/hen parties normally are.

[MtB]

How many actual cillings across the system that occur involved all male or all female parties? I guess given your stance it must be a pretty substantial number.

 

No idea. But banning them would be an excellent thing just because they are a bloody nuisance, mostly.

 

Ban EVERYTHING, I reckon...

 

MtB

[DHutch]

 

Ban EVERYTHING, I reckon...

 

 

Water?

Breathing?

Knee jerk reactions?

[MtB]

 

I'm not a fan of regulation but let's face it, groups of people with little or no experience of boating, hiring a boat with the intention of getting wasted on a weekend trip is pretty likely to end badly. I'm not sure it makes much difference if they're same sex or not except that stag/hen parties normally are.

 

 

The mixed groups tend to be less gung-ho than the all-male parties. The girls tend to be a restraining influence.

 

And I've never seen an all-girl boat totally wasted and abusing the boat and the infrastructure like the all-bloke parties tend to.

 

 

MtB

Water?

Breathing?

Knee jerk reactions?

 

 

Yes definitely. Knee jerk reactions especially ought to be banned.

 

MtB

[Guest]

No idea.

 

Eggsactly..........

 

But best ban em anyway eh.

[Sabcat]

 

 

The mixed groups tend to be less gung-ho than the all-male parties. The girls tend to be a restraining influence.

 

And I've never seen an all-girl boat totally wasted and abusing the boat and the infrastructure like the all-bloke parties tend to.

 

 

MtB

 

 

I think I've posted about it on here before but I had a run with a group of chaps "helping" work a lock, two of them racing each other opening the paddles to fill a lock with an old boy on his boat in the lock scared witless. No women with them. They thought it was hilarious.

[alan_fincher]

 

It's debatable whether the signs save ANY accidents, as aware boaters know to avoid the cill and gormless ones don't see the signs...

 

Yes, I agree.

 

I realie one example doesn't prove a point, but to show what you can be up against....

 

In a case where we managed to intervene in time to prevent a sinking, the crew involved told us they had been made quite aware of the cill by the hire base.

 

But they didn't think they were likely to stick out that far, (despite the fact the markers painted on the side of the lock that were in the correct place).

 

This was their second lock in a flight, so when they had got away with it in the first lock, they clearly hadn't looked back to see what a cill actually looks like, and how far they typically project.

[NickF]

I guess it all depends what is stipulated in the policy plus how they could prove that whoever was on the tiller at the time had been drinking. Plenty of boats seem to manage to get cilled where seemingly no alcohol appears to have been involved.We have encountered the occasional stag party boating where one of them has opted not to get drunk, a bit like a 'designated driver' if you like.

 

 

 

When I hired from ABC this year they stipulated that two people must be sober when moving the boat.

[MHS]

When I hired from ABC this year they stipulated that two people must be sober when moving the boat.

Which makes me think that ABC accept it's ok for other 5 or 6 crew to be completely blathered, so they can fall into locks, or help sink the boat!!

[Alf Roberts]

I have seen the arse ends pulled out with a rope on the stern cleat, a lot were wooden then.

 

So therefore you don't need them,

The only time I really notice the sign is when going up and its in front of me. I know my boat is only 57 feet and I am usually against the gate but I don't wear my glasses when boating.

Sorry but you are wrong. As one comes into a lock one looks to the side to gauge ones position and speed. At that time one sees a notice on the open gate directly above ( usually ) a cill marker.

 

Exactly the logical place to put it.

 

Even if unaware of notices I would contend something yellow and black ( international colours for warning) in the side of your vision would attract the attention of someone neither blind nor stupid.

[bigray]

A few years ago I was part of a single sex group on a hire boat on the broads. You do get people giving you a certain look when you moor near their very expensive cruiser which I can understand. However the slightly dissapointing part was that at no point were we rowdy. Of the 7 people aboard one owns their own narrow boat and 3 others have some boating experience. Yes we did drink but not to a point of loutish drunkeness. I know it may be the exception to the rule but would it be fair to ban single sex parties because of the bad examples?

 

More importantly i'm in the without water camp.

[colmac]

As with a lot of our towns alcohol seems to be one of the root causes of a lot of the anti-social behaviour that happens. I am as fond of a sherbert as the next man but I like to think that, even when I was young and daft matelot, I knew when to stop. This is apart from the technical stuff at locks etc. Last year we were moored in Hanbury, went for walk up past the Black Prince base at Stoke Prior. To our surprise there was a group of lads being shown how to work the lock by the yard and they were all necking cans of Stella and paying no attention to the Black Prince guy whatsoever. Sure enough, an hour later they all went by at a rate of knots with 3 of them stood on the roof with their lagers. I did contact the boatyard but all I got was an answering service. Guess the boatyard guy was just going through the motions regardless of whether the lads were interested or not. rant over, than you.

[sueb]

Really? I tend to keep a good look in all directions when in a lock.

 

These accidents will continue as long as some boaters don't accept some responsibility for their own safety.

 

CRT are not our nannies they are a navigation authority, we could have all manner of rails and signs installed by which time they will have created a whole new set of of hazards to trip over.

 

Perhaps some boaters would be happy if the whole system was governed by Disney, with guided rails to move their boats gently along, never veering off course and with automated locks that gently and in total safety elevated their boats up wards.

I am not advocating more signs, just signs so you can see them at all times when you are in the lock. If BW as it was then are putting up signs they should be in the place that does the most good.

[cotswoldsman]

I believe you need a minimum of two people who are sober, for the reason I have explained.

Ah well that's me not moving anymore. No chance now that I am ever going to make any friends

[haggis]

I am not advocating more signs, just signs so you can see them at all times when you are in the lock. If BW as it was then are putting up signs they should be in the place that does the most good.

I agree that signs should be where they will most easily be seen and I can't think of anywhere other than on the lock gate. As you cruise into the lock, the beam will be beside you, not above and most boaters will be keeping an eye on the side of their boat as well as the front. The signs are large and eye catching and I don't think they could be in a more obvious position. No matter where you put them, even if the signs were six feet square and hung over the lock, there would be folk who don't see them.

 

Haggis

[mango]

It may not be long before we see boats fitted with proximity sensors to warn that the stern is getting too near the top gates, just like the parking sensors on cars.

[Guest]

I agree that signs should be where they will most easily be seen and I can't think of anywhere other than on the lock gate. As you cruise into the lock, the beam will be beside you, not above and most boaters will be keeping an eye on the side of their boat as well as the front. The signs are large and eye catching and I don't think they could be in a more obvious position. No matter where you put them, even if the signs were six feet square and hung over the lock, there would be folk who don't see them.Haggis

Exactly.

 

I think of it in the same way as people who ignore road signs. You can make 'Give way' sign as big as you like mount them full on in your line of sight and even paint a big give way sign in white on the road surface, however not everybody will take notice and some will drive straight through the junction as if it wasn't there completely oblivious.

 

There is only so much CRT can be expected to do.

[Murflynn]

The amount of hot air generated in this thread so far could have been harnessed to lift the boat out.