Dispute at Pillings

[Dangerous Dave]

Goodness a rapid reply to that spat by Christopher Herbert..

 

Thank you all for coming to the response so quickly..

 

We have such a lovely "SPECIAL" community spirit on here..lol

[csh]

I'm glad you've found some 'virtual' friends Robin Stewart (aka Dangerous Dave).

 

Right, I'm off to lunch with some real people. Must dash. Perhaps I'll spend some of the embezzled money or book another trip to the Bahamas (both of course being unbridled nonsense - this was a reference to an earlier inaccurate post).

 

When I have actual information to post that will benefit the berthholders I will resume posting. Until then, there really is no point continuing this farcical dialogue.

 

Best wishes,

Chris

[SoosieQ]

exactly!

I know a bit about the finances surrounding running a marina, and if he really has 250 paying berth holders then there really shouldn't be a problem. Unless of course you are grossly incompetent and / or syphoning off a load of money.

Im sure ive read its capacity is around 320 so 250+ isnt bad

[Nightwatch]

I'm glad you've found some 'virtual' friends Robin Stewart (aka Dangerous Dave).

 

Right, I'm off to lunch with some real people. Must dash. Perhaps I'll spend some of the embezzled money or book another trip to the Bahamas (both of course being unbridled nonsense - this was a reference to an earlier inaccurate post).

 

When I have actual information to post that will benefit the berthholders I will resume posting. Until then, there really is no point continuing this farcical dialogue.

 

Best wishes,

Chris

I can't stop myself saying this, Chris.

 

Many a true word is said in jest!

 

Once again bitterness supersedes common sense and reason.

 

If not too impertanant, how old are you?

 

Martyn

[Woodstock]

I'm glad you've found some 'virtual' friends Robin Stewart (aka Dangerous Dave).

 

Right, I'm off to lunch with some real people. Must dash. Perhaps I'll spend some of the embezzled money or book another trip to the Bahamas (both of course being unbridled nonsense - this was a reference to an earlier inaccurate post).

 

When I have actual information to post that will benefit the berthholders I will resume posting. Until then, there really is no point continuing this farcical dialogue.

 

Best wishes,

Chris

Dont let that stop you- you havent said anything that benefits the berthholders yet

[csh]

Martyn, if you are actually implying with your remark 'many a true word said in jest' that I am guilty of what I was pointing fun at, I suggest you exercise some caution, as this IS libellous.

 

I am merely tired of the fabrications on here from people who are enjoying idle gossip. Do not manipulate what I say.

 

Updates will follow as and when we have information.

All the best,

Chris

[Dangerous Dave]

I'm glad you've found some 'virtual' friends Robin Stewart (aka Dangerous Dave).

 

Right, I'm off to lunch with some real people. Must dash. Perhaps I'll spend some of the embezzled money or book another trip to the Bahamas (both of course being unbridled nonsense - this was a reference to an earlier inaccurate post).

 

When I have actual information to post that will benefit the berthholders I will resume posting. Until then, there really is no point continuing this farcical dialogue.

 

Best wishes,

Chris

 

 

Going to lunch ay!..In the boat house to spread even more inaccurate nonsense to the berth holders...Remember "Don't drink & drive"!

 

Is it worth you contributing on here as you are either purposely misleading people or unable to identify facts..For example the identity of "Dangerous Dave",Shyster basher or the other bloke(? )you quoted.

 

I would suggest that berth holders will have a long wait to hear about any information of benefit from you two!

Im sure ive read its capacity is around 320 so 250+ isnt bad

 

 

Are you sure that you are not getting confused with Mercia Marina..

 

John Lillie ( a person of integrity ,but maybe a bit of a sod (?)) could confirm the potential capacity of PLM.

 

Perhaps CSH means the population of PLM not actual boats but i have never seen that many boats pre or post there!

[Nightwatch]

No, I am saying that you were jesting! Why so touchy?

 

Just a unwise choice of words from you considering the situation your partner finds himself. If indeed you are his partner. If I am to believe what has been written in this thread, you are a school teacher, I think this time of day is a little late to take lunch. Unless you help out during the lunchtime.

 

A subject that anyone in the management at Pilling Lock Marine is adverse to addressing is where has the NAA contributions from the moorers at Pilling Lock Marina gone to if not to the appropriate recipient.

 

Could you ask Paul to enlighten the forum or any other interested parties.?

 

I'm not holding my breath.

 

Martyn

[SoosieQ]

Going to lunch ay!..In the boat house to spread even more inaccurate nonsense to the berth holders...Remember "Don't drink & drive"!

 

Is it worth you contributing on here as you are either purposely misleading people or unable to identify facts..For example the identity of "Dangerous Dave",Shyster basher or the other bloke(? )you quoted.

 

I would suggest that berth holders will have a long wait to hear about any information of benefit from you two!

 

 

Are you sure that you are not getting confused with Mercia Marina..

 

John Lillie ( a person of integrity ,but maybe a bit of a sod (?)) could confirm the potential capacity of PLM.

 

Perhaps CSH means the population of PLM not actual boats but i have never seen that many boats pre or post there!

I was sure i had seen an advertisement for PLM being a300 plus berth marina,my point was,if as csh posted,the marina is at 250+......why is there any issue paying whats owed as thats nigh on full occupancy

Edited February 28, 2014 by SoosieQ

[Ronniesonic]

Martyn, if you are actually implying with your remark 'many a true word said in jest' that I am guilty of what I was pointing fun at, I suggest you exercise some caution, as this IS libellous.

 

I am merely tired of the fabrications on here from people who are enjoying idle gossip. Do not manipulate what I say.

 

Updates will follow as and when we have information.

All the best,

Chris

 

I thought it was 'din dins' time?

[tupperware]

Firstly, I wish to apologise for some of my earlier posts which quoted a High Court ruling in respect of declaimed commercial leases, a point raised by "CarpetWallah" a couple of pages back. I have been unable to find the original page I read and must hold my hand up and concede that I may have inadvertently misquoted a case in another country. For this I most humbly apologise for having mislead anyone here.

 

Since my self-exile, however, I have been following events which seem to have broken out into open warfare. If CRT, as was suggested previously, are indeed taking an interest in this forum then quite how they are going to view some of the material emanating from "csh", who appears to have no official role in this business, is an interesting point to consider. I did suggest some pages back that sometimes it was better to remain silent, a notion which seems to have escaped the gentleman concerned.

 

I do not think it improbable that "csh" has compromised the chances of a new NAA being arranged with CRT.

"Martyn, if you are actually implying with your remark 'many a true word said in jest' that I am guilty of what I was pointing fun at, I suggest you exercise some caution, as this IS libellous."

 

In what way has Martyn libelled you?

Edited February 28, 2014 by tupperware

[Dangerous Dave]

I was sure i had seen an advertisement for PLM being a300 plus berth marina,my point was,if as csh posted,the marina is at 250+......why is there any issue paying whats owed as thats nigh on full occupancy

 

 

 

Better not make any speculations as we may be cited as being libius ..lol

[Kwacker]

Reading this thread, the words of Oscar Wilde come to mind ....

"The unspeakable in pursuit of the inedible"

[Paul G2]

The issue is the NAA and this is being discussed with CaRT.

The welfare of the berth holders and their freedom to access the network is paramount.

 

Everything else is personal nonsense not relevant to the thread.

 

When there any new developments, these will be conveyed. For now, there is nothing new to report in this circular argument.

 

Regards,

Chris

 

Hi Chris,

 

You were going to get me a list of the date and amount of all NAA payments Lillie/Steadman made. Did you forget about that?

 

Remember, Chris, you stated outright that payments were made to CRT for the NAA. Unless you can come forward here and now and substantiate that claim, as you said you would, then everything you say here is suspect and your words have no validity whatsoever. Unless you provide that proof, you have shown that you are nothing but a shill for PL.

[PaulG]

I addressed the issue of the money owed to CaRT - we have always made payment to them. The bill was never amended to take into account the reduced mooring or reduced fees, so the amount owed is incorrect. With reduced fees there was reduced money in the pot to pay them. Money has not been diverted else where. They then stopped accepting our part payments and demanded full and final settlement, knowing full well that we simply did not have the funds.

 

To say we don't care couldn't be further from the truth. We are passionate about the community we have helped to create. Many of the customers are also our friends. We will be doing everything in our power to resolve this issue, with the considerable support of Mr and Mrs Steadman.

 

Regards,

Chris

So Pl has already stated on this forum (see post #161) "Of the £185k judgement obtained by CRT on 6th December 2013, £24k of the sum is legal fees".

So the unpaid NAA fees that C&RT were seeking to recover would have been £161K.

He also states that the NAA is £38k plus VAT per year, which is £46K per annum, in round numbers.

 

The marina opened in March 2008, so the amounts payable to BW/CRT would have been as follows:

March 2008 to March 2009 - 100% discount = £0K

March 2009 to March 2010 - 50% discount = £23K

March 2010 to March 2011 - nil discount = £46K

March 2011 to March 2012 - nil discount = £46K

March 2012 to March 2013 - nil discount = £46K

Total payment due = £161K

 

Since judgement was made in December 2013, I am assuming that C&RT must have made up their figures for the court much earlier in the year - perhaps in March?

 

So if the amount due from "day one" was £161K, and C&RT claimed for unpaid NAA fees of £161K, then how does this equate with your statement that you "always paid CART"?

 

Clarification: When I said "made up their figures" above I meant "made up" in the accounting sense, as in "making up the accounts". I was not suggesting that they fabricated them!

 

Edit by G&F

 

"The numbers above are for illustrative purposes only, they cannot be accurate without sight of the relevant documentation, and are made on a 'best guess' basis"

Edited February 28, 2014 by Grace & Favour

[Dangerous Dave]

Firstly, I wish to apologise for some of my earlier posts which quoted a High Court ruling in respect of declaimed commercial leases, a point raised by "CarpetWallah" a couple of pages back. I have been unable to find the original page I read and must hold my hand up and concede that I may have inadvertently misquoted a case in another country. For this I most humbly apologise for having mislead anyone here.

 

Since my self-exile, however, I have been following events which seem to have broken out into open warfare. If CRT, as was suggested previously, are indeed taking an interest in this forum then quite how they are going to view some of the material emanating from "csh", who appears to have no official role in this business, is an interesting point to consider. I did suggest some pages back that sometimes it was better to remain silent, a notion which seems to have escaped the gentleman concerned.

 

I do not think it improbable that "csh" has compromised the chances of a new NAA being arranged with CRT.

"Martyn, if you are actually implying with your remark 'many a true word said in jest' that I am guilty of what I was pointing fun at, I suggest you exercise some caution, as this IS libellous."

 

In what way has Martyn libelled you?

 

 

 

From what i know of Christopher Herbert he does really get a bit excited sometimes..Especially after a drink ..Hence my remark of "don't drink & drive".

 

He may make that remark libius but he does actually have a drink drive conviction-Fact!

 

I thought it was 'din dins' time?

 

 

lololol

[tupperware]

It's a good job that what you "think" and what is actually happening are two very different things Mike.

If this is your understanding of how business works (and how to make a good impression with people on the waterways) I'd hate to have you try and fix one of our boilers! :-)

 

Real businesses work by having in place financial controls to ensure that when bills arrive there is sufficient accrued to cover the liability. Real businesses whose offering is inexorably tied in with a major supplier endeavour not to alienate that supplier and certainly not by failing to pay their bills over a considerable period. Real businesses do not engage in public spats with their past customers and they certainly do not post to Facebook in the manner quoted on page 3 of this forum

 

Finally, real businesses do not send in the partner of a board member, who has no formal authority whatsoever, to "bat" on the latter's behalf.

Edited February 28, 2014 by tupperware

[Paul G2]

Im sure ive read its capacity is around 320 so 250+ isnt bad

 

A week or so ago, the PLM website advertised 72 vacancies. Some quick math shows then that 250 is about right.

[tupperware]

 

 

From what i know of Christopher Herbert he does really get a bit excited sometimes..Especially after a drink ..Hence my remark of "don't drink & drive".

 

He may make that remark libius but he does actually have a drink drive conviction-Fact!

 

 

lololol

 

I see. I do find it somewhat bizarre, however, that someone who is I understand a schoolteacher, a highly responsible job, can so apparent lack the understanding that silence is sometimes golden.

So Pl has already stated on this forum (see post #161) "Of the £185k judgement obtained by CRT on 6th December 2013, £24k of the sum is legal fees".

So the unpaid NAA fees that C&RT were seeking to recover would have been £161K.

He also states that the NAA is £38k plus VAT per year, which is £46K per annum, in round numbers.

 

The marina opened in March 2008, so the amounts payable to BW/CRT would have been as follows:

March 2008 to March 2009 - 100% discount = £0K

March 2009 to March 2010 - 50% discount = £23K

March 2010 to March 2011 - nil discount = £46K

March 2011 to March 2012 - nil discount = £46K

March 2012 to March 2013 - nil discount = £46K

Total payment due = £161K

 

Since judgement was made in December 2013, I am assuming that C&RT must have made up their figures for the court much earlier in the year - perhaps in March?

 

So if the amount due from "day one" was £161K, and C&RT claimed for unpaid NAA fees of £161K, then how does this equate with your statement that you "always paid CART"?

 

PaulG. I did a similar calculation some pages back and arrived at figures not dissimilar to your own. Like you, I also concluded that the figures left little room for any substantial payment to CRT and despite "csh" having offered some time ago to post details of these payments, there has been no information posted in this regard whatsoever. The uncharitable will, of course, regard such claims as bordering on fantasy.

Edited February 28, 2014 by tupperware

[Swallowman]

Perhaps csh believed what his partner told him........

[Dangerous Dave]

Perhaps csh believed what his partner told him........

 

lolololo again!!

 

No doubt we will be accused of being unreasonable and having no feeling for the 250(?) moorers there..

 

You know the the 250 moorers that were glad to see the back of me and Robin..

 

Bizarre is the word indeed of LE12 8FE !

Edited February 28, 2014 by Dangerous Dave

[carlt]

Martyn, if you are actually implying with your remark 'many a true word said in jest' that I am guilty of what I was pointing fun at, I suggest you exercise some caution, as this IS libellous.

 

perhaps he should have put it in inverted commas then he would have just been "ironic" (or perhaps "sarcastic")

 

 

Thinking about it, if you put something potentially libellous in inverted commas are you being liticaphobic?

Edited February 28, 2014 by carlt

[Paul G2]

perhaps he should have put it in inverted commas then he would have just been "ironic" (or perhaps "sarcastic")

 

 

Thinking about it, if you put something potentially libellous in inverted commas are you being liticaphobic?

 

I do believe he was being sardonic.

[magnetman]

Phantasm.

 

This was one of the first '18' films I watched when I was about 14 because a friend was allowed to get films out even though he was still at school.

 

A horror film with quite good effects. About '88 I suppose

[Peter X]

tupperware and carpet wallah, thanks for your efforts to help me resolve the question of whether the QMP liquidator could disclaim PLM's lease on the marina. I'd seen a different article somewhere referring to the Willmott case in Australia but found your link http://www.allens.co...insol5dec13.htm explained that better. Although precedents from the US and Commonwealth countries whose legal systems are based upon English common law can I think be used sometimes in English courts, in general they probably won't carry much weight, especially against a decision in England or Wales. Also, the Willmott ruling was based upon a very specifically Australian Act, the Corporations Act 2001 (Cth), so I can't see it being useful to QMP.

 

Unfortunately I have yet to find anything more relevant to a landlord being liquidated in England or to clarify our s178 Insolvency Act 1986, except to say that as there are definitely businesses here who pay up front for long leases, they must be confident that they won't lose out badly in the event of their landlord being liquidated.

 

I'm only an amateur lawyer, and it would be a goldmine for the professionals but good for the CRT if I could be disproved, but meanwhile I'll restate the main conclusions of my post #3565 as a basis to argue with or build upon:

We can be confident that PLM has a lease and that the lease is very advantageous to PLM.

The lease is not the landlord's property and therefore cannot be disclaimed.

A very cheap lease might just mean that PLM could survive with very low mooring income, IF the cafe and letting the flat makes enough money to cover other costs such as staff and litigation.

Here I'm talking about the scenario that CRT blockade the marina, and Mr Steadman has recovered the freehold and compensated the QMP 20 (I think he'd have to) and is content for a while to have little or no income from the land.

Does anyone know how well the cafe is doing recently? Is it the in place to visit for the high society of Leicestershire, or somewhat less busy? The reviews on Trip Advisor make it sound not too shabby.