57 60 feet

[Trilby Tim]

Hi there, myself and my girlfriend are looking at moving aboard a narrowboat. We're thinking of commissioning a bare shell and then doing all the fit out ourselves. I was originally thinking of 57ft since it would fit through all the locks in the country. However the boatbuilder I was talking to says that to go from 55ft to 57ft requires a whole extra panel of steel so would add £500 to the price of the shell, but 60ft would be the same price as 57ft. The extra 3ft would be quite useful, but will this restrict us on where we can go? I have heard that boats up to 61'6" can pass a 57' lock if they go diagonally - waterscape seems to back this up here.. Has anyone any experience of fitting a 60ft boat in a 57ft lock? What's the logistics of it?

Cheers

[Liam]

I can't answer your lock dimensions question, but if you want a 57ft boat then why scrimp on a £500 when your shell is going to be at least £18K or there abouts?

[Ex- Member]

I don't understnd this builders comment on the length of steel. You can order steel the lengths you require.

 

I'm not sure on the exact size boat that will cover the entire canal network, think 57 is right though.

 

We did what you are proposing but with a wide beam 60f/t It's alot of work and would require at least a competant diy'er to undertake a fit out, I'm guessing you have that covered though.

 

What I would advise is visit as many boatbuilders you can. Decide exactly what you require from a boat first, or you'll be sold all sorts of stuff you might not necessarily need or want. Basically draw up a design of the particular style boat you would like, then where you want particular rooms galley ect. You need to decide on what type water tank toilet system, bow thruster ETC ETC You need to know all these things first, then list all your requirements for the builder. This way you'll get a good comparison of price, and then you can decide which one to go for taking into account the quality of build. Boat builders will give you advice, some will try to sell you additional stuff and sell you their particular products, engines etc.

 

When you decide on a builder, make sure all your requirements are listed and fully understood, Also get a price list for extras, as if you change your minds on something, you'll know how much it will cost.

 

Finding a good boatbuilder is a minefield, do as much research as you can, and I mean proper research.

[steelaway]

Hi there, myself and my girlfriend are looking at moving aboard a narrowboat. We're thinking of commissioning a bare shell and then doing all the fit out ourselves. I was originally thinking of 57ft since it would fit through all the locks in the country. However the boatbuilder I was talking to says that to go from 55ft to 57ft requires a whole extra panel of steel so would add £500 to the price of the shell, but 60ft would be the same price as 57ft. The extra 3ft would be quite useful, but will this restrict us on where we can go? I have heard that boats up to 61'6" can pass a 57' lock if they go diagonally - waterscape seems to back this up here.. Has anyone any experience of fitting a 60ft boat in a 57ft lock? What's the logistics of it?

Cheers

 

 

Hi There

 

Where are you based ? It might help with recomedations.

58ft will just go through the northern locks - corner to corner but its a bit of a faff.

 

Alex

[interleaf2]

Hi there, myself and my girlfriend are looking at moving aboard a narrowboat. We're thinking of commissioning a bare shell and then doing all the fit out ourselves. I was originally thinking of 57ft since it would fit through all the locks in the country. However the boatbuilder I was talking to says that to go from 55ft to 57ft requires a whole extra panel of steel so would add £500 to the price of the shell, but 60ft would be the same price as 57ft. The extra 3ft would be quite useful, but will this restrict us on where we can go? I have heard that boats up to 61'6" can pass a 57' lock if they go diagonally - waterscape seems to back this up here.. Has anyone any experience of fitting a 60ft boat in a 57ft lock? What's the logistics of it?

Cheers

I can confirm a 60' boat that is less than 7' wide will usually be able to pass the 57' 6" locks on the Calder & Hebble & Huddersfield Broad canals if they are in full working order. Salterhebble has the shortest of all and you will need to lie diagonally and you may need to use the lock backwards, remove fenders, clear rubbish, etc.), but it can almost always be done with a little determination. It all adds to the fun. The cills and overhanging gate platforms are also hazardous on these waterways and the longer the boat the greater the hazard. It is very easy to damage or even snap your swan's neck with these overhanging platforms. This all assumes you have the normal round stern and pointed bow. A square stern may be more of a problem and may not fit even diagonally.

[Trilby Tim]

I can't answer your lock dimensions question, but if you want a 57ft boat then why scrimp on a £500 when your shell is going to be at least £18K or there abouts?

Exactly, I would go for 57ft over 55ft anyway, but 60ft is even better still, especially as it would cost no more than 57ft, assuming it can fit through the locks.

 

Finding a good boatbuilder is a minefield, do as much research as you can, and I mean proper research.

What are the particular things I need to be looking out for? I've just been to the workshop of one in Boston, Lincs. He seems a friendly guy, prepared to adapt his standard spec to suit me. They build two at a time and there was an almost finished 55ft narrowboat there. It looked nicely built. 10mm floor plate and 10mm counter all the plate and the welders are certified and the welding looked nice and neat. Diesel tank is tested to an ISO standard. All seems good.

 

 

Yep, it'll be a standard pointed bow and round stern. Myself and my girlfriend both currently live in Sheffield, hence my interest in the South Yorkshire navigation. However, we may well move around and work in other areas of the country, it's part of the appeal of living afloat that we can move our home to a different city. How avoidable are the shorter locks if we needed to move for example from Sheffield down south?

[Gary Peacock]

I would stick at 58ft no bigger, while 60ft is possible but can get interesting in Yorkshire!

[bottle]

Hi Tim

 

Posted recently in another thread, http://www.waterwaysworld.com/questionspost.cgi?post=1

 

It shows the canals that can be a 'problem' but not impossible.

 

Also this site has some good advice. http://www.penninewaterways.co.uk/index.htm

[Trilby Tim]

Brilliant, thanks.

 

Hi Tim

 

Posted recently in another thread, http://www.waterwaysworld.com/questionspost.cgi?post=1

 

It shows the canals that can be a 'problem' but not impossible.

 

Also this site has some good advice. http://www.penninewaterways.co.uk/index.htm

[stewey]

And another useful page on lock lengths:

 

http://www.abnb.co.uk/submenupages/length.htm

 

Stewey

[MartinClark]

Also this site has some good advice. http://www.penninewaterways.co.uk/index.htm

 

The specific page that deals with getting narrowboats up to 60 ft through locks on the Calder & Hebble and Huddersfile Broad is here: http://www.penninewaterways.co.uk/calder/locks.htm

 

60 ft is the absolute maximum length that will fit through Salterhebble top lock. Half an inch longer and you woin't be able to get the bottom gates shut (or open if going downhill).

[Ex- Member]

What are the particular things I need to be looking out for? I've just been to the workshop of one in Boston, Lincs. He seems a friendly guy, prepared to adapt his standard spec to suit me. They build two at a time and there was an almost finished 55ft narrowboat there. It looked nicely built. 10mm floor plate and 10mm counter all the plate and the welders are certified and the welding looked nice and neat. Diesel tank is tested to an ISO standard. All seems good.

 

 

 

I posted this sometime ago, my take and experience of looking for a boat builder.

 

 

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php...c=14159&hl=

[denboy]

have a look at boughton camp near ollerton used to be 3 boat builders there Dave Clarke, R&D, and the other name escapes me at the min only 25 miles from sheffield

 

have a look at boughton camp near ollerton used to be 3 boat builders there Dave Clarke, R&D, and the other name escapes me at the min only 25 miles from sheffield

[Ex- Member]

have a look at boughton camp near ollerton used to be 3 boat builders there Dave Clarke, R&D, and the other name escapes me at the min only 25 miles from sheffield

 

have a look at boughton camp near ollerton used to be 3 boat builders there Dave Clarke, R&D, and the other name escapes me at the min only 25 miles from sheffield

 

That's where our boat was built, and my brothers Blackdog. R&D fabrications have gone through a few new owners in the past couple of years, not sure who runs it today. The actual guy who built/constructed our boats is a chap called Abdul Polar, when he worked for R&D. He has now started out on his own in a unit on the same site, Boughton IND EST I put a link for him on the boatbuilders list here.

 

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=14606

[bridgit]

Hi there, myself and my girlfriend are looking at moving aboard a narrowboat. We're thinking of commissioning a bare shell and then doing all the fit out ourselves. I was originally thinking of 57ft since it would fit through all the locks in the country. However the boatbuilder I was talking to says that to go from 55ft to 57ft requires a whole extra panel of steel so would add £500 to the price of the shell, but 60ft would be the same price as 57ft. The extra 3ft would be quite useful, but will this restrict us on where we can go? I have heard that boats up to 61'6" can pass a 57' lock if they go diagonally - waterscape seems to back this up here.. Has anyone any experience of fitting a 60ft boat in a 57ft lock? What's the logistics of it?

Cheers

Had a 60' no problem. oh and 3"

[RLWP]

Hi there, myself and my girlfriend are looking at moving aboard a narrowboat. We're thinking of commissioning a bare shell and then doing all the fit out ourselves.

 

Hi Tim,

 

I'm not sure how many of the old posts you have read on here, so I may as well ask. How much research and thought have you put into this so far? What plans do you have for a mooring? How long are you planning to spend on your build and at what budget?

 

Just curious.

 

Richard

[blackrose]

Hi there, myself and my girlfriend are looking at moving aboard a narrowboat. We're thinking of commissioning a bare shell and then doing all the fit out ourselves. I was originally thinking of 57ft since it would fit through all the locks in the country. However the boatbuilder I was talking to says that to go from 55ft to 57ft requires a whole extra panel of steel so would add £500 to the price of the shell, but 60ft would be the same price as 57ft. The extra 3ft would be quite useful, but will this restrict us on where we can go? I have heard that boats up to 61'6" can pass a 57' lock if they go diagonally - waterscape seems to back this up here.. Has anyone any experience of fitting a 60ft boat in a 57ft lock? What's the logistics of it?

Cheers

 

Is this your first boat? The reason I ask is that many people new to boating buy boats to live on with the premise that they want to be able to cruise the entire system.

 

However, few actually fulfil this dream and many just end up living at their mooring, in which case that extra 3ft would come in mighty handy. Of course after fitting out your boat you and your girlfriend may find yourselves somewhere in between those two extremes, but a 60ft narrow boat can still do a fair amount of cruising.

[Ally]

have a look at boughton camp near ollerton used to be 3 boat builders there Dave Clarke, R&D, and the other name escapes me at the min only 25 miles from sheffield

 

have a look at boughton camp near ollerton used to be 3 boat builders there Dave Clarke, R&D, and the other name escapes me at the min only 25 miles from sheffield

 

Just a pointer.........R&D are now "XR&D" and I can thoroughly recommend them as good guys, and superb steelwork, and they'll build the hull YOU want. The builder you talked to about lengths has some "interesting" thoughts!?! XR&D have a web site for you to find.

 

have a look at boughton camp near ollerton used to be 3 boat builders there Dave Clarke, R&D, and the other name escapes me at the min only 25 miles from sheffield

 

have a look at boughton camp near ollerton used to be 3 boat builders there Dave Clarke, R&D, and the other name escapes me at the min only 25 miles from sheffield

 

Just a pointer.........R&D are now "XR&D" and I can thoroughly recommend them as good guys, and superb steelwork, and they'll build the hull YOU want. The builder you talked to about lengths has some "interesting" thoughts!?! XR&D have a web site for you to find.

[Lady Muck]

Is this your first boat? The reason I ask is that many people new to boating buy boats to live on with the premise that they want to be able to cruise the entire system.

 

However, few actually fulfil this dream and many just end up living at their mooring, in which case that extra 3ft would come in mighty handy. Of course after fitting out your boat you and your girlfriend may find yourselves somewhere in between those two extremes, but a 60ft narrow boat can still do a fair amount of cruising.

 

This is so true - I've not gone North of Watford yet. I was going to go to my mums (she's on on the Aire and Calder)

 

 

I think 57 is a good length for us though. We cruise the Lee and the Stort most of the time, we can wind pretty much anywhere on the Lee - a longer boat would be a plain in the butt. Just hoard less cr*p onboard.

[Trilby Tim]

I've been looking around quite a few builders now, and there's very big differences between the shells. I'm deciding between a cheap and basic shell from ABC or a more expensive more quality shell from Paul Widdowson (used to work for R&D in the past). The difference in price is £14500 inc VAT for the ABC shell or £21150 inc VAT for the PW shell. Now I can see to an extent where the money has gone, the PW shell had better detailing, upsweep on the rear deck, arrow motifs on the rubbing strakes and hatch hinges, double skinned over hangs on the cabins with built in grab handles, recessed deck hatch on the foredeck, brass runners on the sliding hatch etc, etc. The ABC shell is much more basic with none of those features and only flat panel doors. However on the day I visited ABC there was a nearly finished shell, so I could have a good look at the quality of the workmanship and I have to say it was pretty good. The welding was good, all the welds were to be ground down before painting, the structure was 10/6/4mm, including 10mm counter, rubbing strakes were fully welded top and bottom, steel was certified 43A, the workshop was fairly tidy. The superstructure was fully reinforced internally and the boat appeared perfectly straight and true without ripples. Overall much better than another "budget" builder I looked at (although that one actually charged more than ABC!).

It seems to me that the ABC boat would be perfectly solid and suitable, just without all the nice touches of the more expensive shell. If it was just me I'd be inclined to save the £6650 and instead spend it on better fixtures and fittings and bits of kit inside the boat. But if I come to sell the boat in the future will the better shell get me the six and a half grand back in better resale price? Also does anyone have any personal experiences of either of the two I've mentioned here?

The other issue for me is distance. I plan to fit out the boat (at least the initial fit out) at the boat-builders yard. ABC is about an hour and half's drive, so I'd have to do full weekends and camp over. PW is only half an hour away, so I could go for evenings and odd days. Decisions decisions.

[bottle]

Whether the £6000 difference is worth it, is a decision that only you can make.

 

ABC are Alvechurch (hire company) check out their hire boats and you will probably notice a family resemblance.

[Eastern]

I've been looking around quite a few builders now, and there's very big differences between the shells. I'm deciding between a cheap and basic shell from ABC or a more expensive more quality shell from Paul Widdowson (used to work for R&D in the past). The difference in price is £14500 inc VAT for the ABC shell or £21150 inc VAT for the PW shell. Now I can see to an extent where the money has gone, the PW shell had better detailing, upsweep on the rear deck, arrow motifs on the rubbing strakes and hatch hinges, double skinned over hangs on the cabins with built in grab handles, recessed deck hatch on the foredeck, brass runners on the sliding hatch etc, etc. The ABC shell is much more basic with none of those features and only flat panel doors. However on the day I visited ABC there was a nearly finished shell, so I could have a good look at the quality of the workmanship and I have to say it was pretty good. The welding was good, all the welds were to be ground down before painting, the structure was 10/6/4mm, including 10mm counter, rubbing strakes were fully welded top and bottom, steel was certified 43A, the workshop was fairly tidy. The superstructure was fully reinforced internally and the boat appeared perfectly straight and true without ripples. Overall much better than another "budget" builder I looked at (although that one actually charged more than ABC!).

It seems to me that the ABC boat would be perfectly solid and suitable, just without all the nice touches of the more expensive shell. If it was just me I'd be inclined to save the £6650 and instead spend it on better fixtures and fittings and bits of kit inside the boat. But if I come to sell the boat in the future will the better shell get me the six and a half grand back in better resale price? Also does anyone have any personal experiences of either of the two I've mentioned here?

The other issue for me is distance. I plan to fit out the boat (at least the initial fit out) at the boat-builders yard. ABC is about an hour and half's drive, so I'd have to do full weekends and camp over. PW is only half an hour away, so I could go for evenings and odd days. Decisions decisions.

 

The advice from them who know, is do not skimp on the shell. A great fit out in a mediocre shell will never have a decent second hand value, but a good shell with an indifferent fit out can be re-fitted.

 

If I were you, and in your price range, I would look at the Polish production boats. Amber Boats and Aqualine are really well produced boats and well fitted out.

 

You really need to do some hard thinking if you wish to live on a boat away from a mains hook up. Either change to a low energy lifestyle or get an onboard generator, would be my advice.

 

And remember, like a car and unlike property over the medium and longer term, you are buying a depreciating asset.

 

Pip Pip

[bargeeboy]

The advice from them who know, is do not skimp on the shell. A great fit out in a mediocre shell will never have a decent second hand value, but a good shell with an indifferent fit out can be re-fitted.

 

If I were you, and in your price range, I would look at the Polish production boats. Amber Boats and Aqualine are really well produced boats and well fitted out.

 

You really need to do some hard thinking if you wish to live on a boat away from a mains hook up. Either change to a low energy lifestyle or get an onboard generator, would be my advice.

 

And remember, like a car and unlike property over the medium and longer term, you are buying a depreciating asset.

 

Pip Pip

 

And don't forget Narrowcraft !!

[sueb]

The advice from them who know, is do not skimp on the shell. A great fit out in a mediocre shell will never have a decent second hand value, but a good shell with an indifferent fit out can be re-fitted.

 

If I were you, and in your price range, I would look at the Polish production boats. Amber Boats and Aqualine are really well produced boats and well fitted out.

 

You really need to do some hard thinking if you wish to live on a boat away from a mains hook up. Either change to a low energy lifestyle or get an onboard generator, would be my advice.

 

And remember, like a car and unlike property over the medium and longer term, you are buying a depreciating asset.

 

Pip Pip

With ref to a low energy lifestyle it doesn't mean going without. We have everything we need on 12v just using 240v for hoovering.

We didn't run the engine at all whilst at the Saul festival so less diesel- hooray

Sue