Best route from Gloucester to Lechlade/Devizes

[magpie patrick]

6 minutes ago, 999 Neets said:

What else would you suggest? Did everyone on here have stacks of experience before buying their first boat? 

 

The short answer is that a lot of people buy boats with little or no experience - so in that regard you are right. The thing is though that this astonishes us old timers (a term based on how long we've been boating - not necessarily on our age) because (1) we didn't do it that way and (2) because the boats in question are a huge investment if people don't know what they are letting themselves in for. The zero-experience new owner is also often the person who buys a boat at the absolute limits of the size for the navigation, moors it where it's in the way and complains about both the state of the navigation and the other boats - they've never had to thread a boat through a bridge with a wide beam moored on a bend next to it so they don't see the problem until someone hits them with it, literally. Then they complain....

 

However, the wise newbie, as you seem to be, asks questions and listens to the answers - remember the only daft question is the one you didn't ask. 

 

If you work for the emergency services i guess that you work long shifts and then get bigger chunks of time off (3-4 days) so keeping up with CC wouldn't be as much of a problem. If I were planning a wide bean "near Swindon" I'd probably head for the upper reaches of the Thames rather than the K&A - it's significantly nearer Swindon and rather bigger so more accommodating of your craft  

[Tony Brooks]

5 minutes ago, 999 Neets said:

What else would you suggest? Did everyone on here have stacks of experience before buying their first boat? 

 

It seems that you may think that the Thames and the canal system are administered by the same authority and in the same way. They are not, you need different licences, although you can get a gold licence that covers both. The banks of the canals are basically owned by CaRT so their rules are what matters and they have minimum cruising distances that might make your plans re work difficult. Ignore these rules at your peril and be assured that if you do then your boat may well be taken from you.

 

On the Thames, every inch of the bank is owned by someone, who are free to impose any mooring conditions they feel like, so you get daily charges from £5 to £15+. Not all impose mooring fees, but those locations that do not are likely to be very full of others living on their boats. Some towns allow free mooring but strictly time limited and there are free Environment Agency 24 hour moorings, but they are not a lot of good when working.

 

The K&A around most "easy access" points with car parking and/or public transport are also likely to be full of people doing similar to what you plan and in the west CaRT seem to be getting a bit keen to enforcing their terms and conditions on distances moved etc.

 

All this has been rehearsed several times before on this forum, so your posts do suggest a certain naivety about matters pertaining to actual boating, rather than mooring. I suggest spending a few weekends visiting the areas where you think you would like to moor to see the conditions on the ground.

 

 

 

 

[dmr]

Continuous cruising on the Thames is difficult. Most moorings are 24 hours, maybe 48. You might find a few spots where the landowner lets you stay longer but will want maybe £10 per night. The Thames in winter is only suitable for really experienced boaters with extensive local knowledge.

The K&A is almost full and CC'ing a widebeam might not be much fun. The "1 mile every two weeks" is currently what some people say you can "get way with". All mooring spots within easy access to a road are likely to be very busy. It is possible that CRT might enforce "continuous not really cruising" much harder in the future. If you do not satisfy CRT that you are genuinely continuous cruising then your life might become very stressful.

[GUMPY]

45 minutes ago, 999 Neets said:

What else would you suggest? Did everyone on here have stacks of experience before buying their first boat? 

 I didn't have any experience* before buying my first canal boat but it wasn't a 60ftx12ft behemoth.

It was a 14ft marine ply cruiser and the canals and rivers were very different 50years ago.

 

 

 

 

 

* Not strictly true,  I had been sailing and into various things on the water for the previous ten years but it was my first canal boat.

 

 

 

[magpie patrick]

As a further comment I would note that Saul Junction is about an hours drive from Swindon - you could save yourself a lot of stress by staying where you are! That said CCing on the G&S has it's problems as it's not really long enough without venturing onto the Severn north of Gloucester

[Tracy D'arth]

On 29/07/2023 at 20:20, 999 Neets said:

Hi there, we’re about to buy a wide beam boat in Gloucester and are planning to live aboard her as a constant cruise around the Swindon area where I’ll be working. 
 

I’m going to be quite limited with the time I can help my partner drive the boat ‘home’ so to speak and I’m struggling to find a route….one website says 12 days?! 
 

Is this our only option or is there a shorter route?

 

Many thanks 

You want advice?

 

Do not buy a wide beam boat.  You will find it almost impossible to just moor it. You will find it impossible to continuously cruise it in that area without considerable expense or risking having it take from you by C&RT for infringing their regulations. 

[howardang]

57 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

It seems that you may think that the Thames and the canal system are administered by the same authority and in the same way. They are not, you need different licences, although you can get a gold licence that covers both. The banks of the canals are basically owned by CaRT so their rules are what matters and they have minimum cruising distances that might make your plans re work difficult. Ignore these rules at your peril and be assured that if you do then your boat may well be taken from you.

 

On the Thames, every inch of the bank is owned by someone, who are free to impose any mooring conditions they feel like, so you get daily charges from £5 to £15+. Not all impose mooring fees, but those locations that do not are likely to be very full of others living on their boats. Some towns allow free mooring but strictly time limited and there are free Environment Agency 24 hour moorings, but they are not a lot of good when working.

 

The K&A around most "easy access" points with car parking and/or public transport are also likely to be full of people doing similar to what you plan and in the west CaRT seem to be getting a bit keen to enforcing their terms and conditions on distances moved etc.

 

57 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

All this has been rehearsed several times before on this forum, so your posts do suggest a certain naivety about matters pertaining to actual boating, rather than mooring. I suggest spending a few weekends visiting the areas where you think you would like to moor to see the conditions on the ground. Unfortunately, there seems to be a growing trend of newcomers jumping in with both feet by buying a wide beam boat without realising that there are additional issues with them that a reasonable knowledge of navigating on waterways as suggested by hiring might help them to realise that these boats come with many additional issues. Please consider taking a couple of holidays on one of the many hire boats available before jumping in too prematurely. When you know a little of the issues involved it is even possible to hire a wide beam on certain canals - the Leeds and Liverpool for example ( Silsden Boats). One invaluable piece of boat owning lore is that you buy your first boat and find issues, buy the second and you get someway to satisfaction but it is the third boat that is really the one that will suit you. 

Good luck in your search for the one that will suit you.

 

Howard

57 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 1, 2023 by howardang

[Tony Brooks]

15 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

You want advice?

 

Do not buy a wide beam boat.  You will find it almost impossible to just moor it. You will find it impossible to continuously cruise it in that area without considerable expense or risking having it take from you by C&RT for infringing their regulations. 

 

I would add, look for a marina to moor it in, but good luck with that in that area even for a below the radar, wink, wink, live-aboard.

 

If you are serious about mooring on the Thames (or any other river) please get familiar with things like flood lines and the techniques needed to ensure the boat does not ride over the bank in a flood and get stranded as it falls. Also think about the safety implications of wading about in water of varying depths and travelling at speed as you tend your lines and flood defences.

 

Edited to add: or to wade across fields or down submerged towpaths to get your food, water and fuel during a winter flood. I think a youngster died around Oxford a few years ago doing that.

Edited August 1, 2023 by Tony Brooks

[Bacchus]

Reading to Swindon is an easy commute - somewhere like Thames and Kennet Marina might suit? A lot less hassle than trying to CC an aircraft carrier, but you could still take it out and annoy people at the weekends? Or for the whole summer?

[dmr]

I think the forum is a bit cynical because this happens again and again, potential new boaters done a bit of paper research but no real on the ground research, have a mate down the pub who says you only need to move a hundred yards every month (he has another mate who told him this but failed to mention he is in the enforcement process 😀), and its always a widebeam. A new owner with a widebeam is very often somebody who has no interest in/commitment to boating and just wants a cheap house on the water.

 

My advice...walk some of the K&A and Thames, talk to boaters, if you like it then buy a narrowboat. After two or three years move to a widebeam if you still think you want to.   

...and try to have a look at the Thames when its in flood.

 

[Tony Brooks]

4 minutes ago, Bacchus said:

Reading to Swindon is an easy commute - somewhere like Thames and Kennet Marina might suit? A lot less hassle than trying to CC an aircraft carrier, but you could still take it out and annoy people at the weekends? Or for the whole summer?

 

I think that depends upon how you commute and what Reading Council will do. The marina is on the opposite side of the river to the M4 so getting to the motorway to drive to Swindon will involve either driving through Reading town or a more circuitous route via Sonning and Woodley. Seeing how Reading seems to introduce anti-car measures each month and are talking about low emission zones, I think it needs careful consideration. The marina is also at the end of a long driveway, and I have doubts about the frequency of buses from there. If commuting by train, then one needs to factor in the potential for a low emission zone and the daily car parking charges. I am not saying it won't work, but it sounds expensive to me.

6 minutes ago, dmr said:

...and try to have a look at the Thames when its in flood.

 

 

Amen to that. the fact the OP seems to be contemplating CCing on the Thames scares me.

[Bacchus]

I was thinking more train - I had a contract in Swindon when I lived in Henley and did the journey for a year or so. Maybe an eBike to get to the station? Or something like a Brompton to take to use at the other end?

3 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 sounds expensive to me.

 

Life is at the moment. I don't know many people who aren't suffering (apart from a handful of minted "boomers" who are relishing the interest rates on their vast savings...)

 

There are also good ("blind eye"?) moorings at Lechlade - I looked at a barge there earlier in the year. which is only half an hour's drive from Swindon. I am not going to repeat all the "don't CC on the Thames or K&A" arguments, but I strongly feel that the OP would be better off looking at a mooring for living and then cruising for pleasure. The area and choice of craft are simply not conducive to the CC lifestyle, and anyway it isn't cruising - he already said it's to live and work in a fixed area

[Jen-in-Wellies]

1 hour ago, dmr said:

My advice...walk some of the K&A and Thames, talk to boaters, if you like it then buy a narrowboat.

And if you do buy a narrowboat, you'll be able to use the original route that CanalPlan came up with through the narrow canals between Gloucester and Lechlade/Devizes. 😀

[dmr]

3 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

And if you do buy a narrowboat, you'll be able to use the original route that CanalPlan came up with through the narrow canals between Gloucester and Lechlade/Devizes. 😀

 

and take a holiday from work each year and explore some lovely narrow canals, the South Oxford joins directly onto the Thames.

but this assume the op is interested in boating rather than just (not so) cheap housing 😀

[MtB]

14 minutes ago, dmr said:

 

and take a holiday from work each year and explore some lovely narrow canals, the South Oxford joins directly onto the Thames.

but this assume the op is interested in boating rather than just (not so) cheap housing 😀

 

Yes we've discussed this before over a Westons or three, IIRC 

 

Ideally, live on a large-ish boat on a nice mooring, and have a second, smallish boat (possibly tied alongside) for mucking about on, exploring, CCing, holidays etc. 

 

 

[dmr]

29 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Yes we've discussed this before over a Westons or three, IIRC 

 

Ideally, live on a large-ish boat on a nice mooring, and have a second, smallish boat (possibly tied alongside) for mucking about on, exploring, CCing, holidays etc. 

 

 

Nah, as I get older I realise that just doing the maintenance on one boat is a lot of work, looking after two boats is just too much. Anybody who owns more than one boat must be quite mad 😀😀.

 

Sadly the rather nicer Thachers Vintage appears to have gone. I read that they have "improved" it and nobody appears to be selling the new version. I think they increased the alcohol content and made it more like Westons which is rather sad, might as well just drink the Westons.

 

We have escaped the Rochdale, currently in Stone, hope to do the Rally in Brum then probably head down the Oxford to the Thames. Are you about?

[Sea Dog]

3 hours ago, Bacchus said:

apart from a handful of minted "boomers" who are relishing the interest rates on their vast savings...

Anyone relishing an interest rate 4-6% less than inflation isn't very good at finance... 

[999 Neets]

2 hours ago, dmr said:

 

and take a holiday from work each year and explore some lovely narrow canals, the South Oxford joins directly onto the Thames.

but this assume the op is interested in boating rather than just (not so) cheap housing 😀

Ah, sadly I wish that was possible! I’ve hankered after living on a boat for around 7-8 years after a couple of narrowboat holidays. My other half wasn’t so convinced until a) he saw wide beams and b) saw how much our mortgage renewal will be. 
 

So yes, we are selling our house to buy a boat, not a decision we have taken lightly.

 

We know there will be a lot to learn, and won’t have the money to boat swap to try smaller ones first. 
 

We’ve seen a boat we love and ticks all the boxes and the bottom line is we don’t have the money to make mistakes or change our mind so am just trying to minimise risk. 

[GUMPY]

Another thing to consider is that unless you are really lucky (I was) it will be unlikely that you will be able to get back on the housing ladder on the same rung that you jumped off.

Would I give up my house for a boat now?

Not a kin chance.

[999 Neets]

4 minutes ago, GUMPY said:

Another thing to consider is that unless you are really lucky (I was) it will be unlikely that you will be able to get back on the housing ladder on the same rung that you jumped off.

Would I give up my house for a boat now?

Not a kin chance.

Yes, we realise that, both our folks think we’re crazy for giving up bricks and mortar but we’re 50 and certainly not going in with rose tinted glasses. 

 

We know it’ll be stressful, hard work, a lot of maintenance (thankfully my partner is great with engines, electrics, plumbing etc) and not the romantic lifestyle thst a lot of people assume it is. 

[IanD]

46 minutes ago, GUMPY said:

Another thing to consider is that unless you are really lucky (I was) it will be unlikely that you will be able to get back on the housing ladder on the same rung that you jumped off.

Would I give up my house for a boat now?

Not a kin chance.

 

With the way UK house prices seem to be going and are predicted to go in the next few years, getting out now (and re-entering later) might even be a good thing not a bad one... 😉

[MtB]

29 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

With the way UK house prices seem to be going and are predicted to go in the next few years, getting out now (and re-entering later) might even be a good thing not a bad one... 😉

 

 

I think it's a bit late for that. The time to get out was this time last year. They were saying on the R4 today that prices have slipped 3.4% in the last year. I think that's rubbish, I'd have put it more like 20% around here. Reading/Newbury way. 

 

I think one more BR rise will see us at bobbling along at the bottom for a couple of years, another 5% down perhaps. Then a decade of creeping up again (much to my annoyance).

 

 

[dmr]

1 hour ago, 999 Neets said:

Yes, we realise that, both our folks think we’re crazy for giving up bricks and mortar but we’re 50 and certainly not going in with rose tinted glasses. 

 

We know it’ll be stressful, hard work, a lot of maintenance (thankfully my partner is great with engines, electrics, plumbing etc) and not the romantic lifestyle thst a lot of people assume it is. 

 

If you really want to live on a boat then do it, and 50 is a good age to do it. But 65 will come round in no time at all (I know this) and if you get unwell, or just a bad back, then you might need to move back to the land. Don't expect the government to house you.

Is there any way you can get a smaller house to rent out and a boat?

All the boat builders are churning out widebeams for wannabe liveaboards lately and many will not get on with the boaty life. I do wonder if (when) the widebeam bubble will burst and prices will drop like a stone? I am not sure they are a good investment just now.

If you want to make a go of boaty life then both of you must really want it, and I fear from what I have heard the K&A is not the idyllic place it used to be when we were there.

 

Do consider a good second hand narrowboat, maybe even 70 foot, and also could you possibly relocate your jobs to the North where the canals are not turning into overcrowded shanty towns?

[GUMPY]

57 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

With the way UK house prices seem to be going and are predicted to go in the next few years, getting out now (and re-entering later) might even be a good thing not a bad one... 😉

One can but hope but timing is all and very few of us get that right.

[999 Neets]

35 minutes ago, dmr said:

 

If you really want to live on a boat then do it, and 50 is a good age to do it. But 65 will come round in no time at all (I know this) and if you get unwell, or just a bad back, then you might need to move back to the land. Don't expect the government to house you.

Is there any way you can get a smaller house to rent out and a boat?

All the boat builders are churning out widebeams for wannabe liveaboards lately and many will not get on with the boaty life. I do wonder if (when) the widebeam bubble will burst and prices will drop like a stone? I am not sure they are a good investment just now.

If you want to make a go of boaty life then both of you must really want it, and I fear from what I have heard the K&A is not the idyllic place it used to be when we were there.

 

Do consider a good second hand narrowboat, maybe even 70 foot, and also could you possibly relocate your jobs to the North where the canals are not turning into overcrowded shanty towns?

I think that’s a fair point, and you’re not the first to raise. (My dad is convinced it’s all going to go pear shaped and we’ll be living in a shop doorway 😂) 

 

We’ve talked about it, and to be fair we’ve decided it’s ride or die. If it all goes to 💩 then we sell up (and take the hit if need be) and then rent. We may have regrets but I’d rather regret doing it than not. 
 

Moving North may be a good idea, I work for the Ambulance Service so could potentially move to a different trust