Navigating the Kingswood Arm

[John Brightley]

2 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Which side of the roof is 'left' ? (when looked at from which direction)

When you're coming down the flight, the left hand side of the bridge arch is very low. Cans should be moved over to the right (towpath) side. 

[Iain_S]

5 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Which side of the roof is 'left' ? (when looked at from which direction)

The advantage of knowing port from starboard 😄

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

I would think the bridge would have an off side and near side?

(in relation to the towpath)

 

[Alan de Enfield]

8 minutes ago, Iain_S said:

The advantage of knowing port from starboard 😄

 

Indeed, using the correct terminolgy can save a lot of unpleasantness.

[Richard10002]

5 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Which side of the roof is 'left' ? (when looked at from which direction)

Given the context, its fairly obvious. You are being pedantic yet again!

[Sea Dog]

3 hours ago, Goliath said:

I would think the bridge would have an off side and near side?

(in relation to the towpath)

 

Until you meet a turnover bridge...

[___]

58 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

Until you meet a turnover bridge...

 

Actually it doesn't matter. The towpath only goes through one side of a turnover bridge

 

4 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Indeed, using the correct terminolgy can save a lot of unpleasantness.

 

On inland waterways left and right is correct. And how can it make it more difficult than using port and starboard? They don't change if you happen to walk to the bow and look back at the boat. The description was quite clear; "when you're coming down the flight".

 

Edited December 8, 2022 by Captain Pegg

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

24 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

Actually it doesn't matter. The towpath only goes through one side of a turnover bridge

Very true!

I’ll reaward me greenie 🤓

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

And it raises a question, aren’t port and starboard traditionally sailing terms and until recently would not have been part of a boaters’ terminology?

 

 

[dmr]

4 hours ago, Iain_S said:

The advantage of knowing port from starboard 😄

port and stbd only work if you know whether you are going upstream or downstream which can be tricky on the cut 😀

[Rob-M]

4 minutes ago, Goliath said:

And it raises a question, aren’t port and starboard traditionally sailing terms and until recently would not have been part of a boaters’ terminology?

 

 

Bread and cheese were the terms the old working boatman I know used to learn to steer a motor.

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

6 minutes ago, Rob-M said:

Bread and cheese were the terms the old working boatman I know used to learn to steer a motor.

I think I’ve heard that..but you’ll have to explain

[Rob-M]

20 minutes ago, Goliath said:

I think I’ve heard that..but you’ll have to explain

A chunk of bread was placed one side of the cabin top and a piece of cheese the other and he was told to steer to the cheese or to the bread.

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

5 minutes ago, Rob-M said:

A chunk of bread was placed one side of the cabin top and a piece of cheese the other and he was told to steer to the cheese or to the bread.

that would work for me if the cheese was with the bottle of port on the left

 

and the bread I could throw off the other side 

 

👍

[David Mack]

11 hours ago, Rob-M said:

A chunk of bread was placed one side of the cabin top and a piece of cheese the other and he was told to steer to the cheese or to the bread.

But was that to steer the boat in the direction of the cheese/bread, or to move the tiller towards the cheese/bread?

[Sea Dog]

12 hours ago, Captain Pegg said:

Actually it doesn't matter. The towpath only goes through one side of a turnover bridge

I'm confused. Did I use the wrong term? Does the towpath not enter a turnover bridge (aka roving bridge) on one side of the canal and leave it on t'other, thus allowing for the towpath  switching sides?

[David Mack]

6 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

I'm confused. Did I use the wrong term? Does the towpath not enter a turnover bridge (aka roving bridge) on one side of the canal and leave it on t'other, thus allowing for the towpath  switching sides?

Of course. But it only passes under the bridge on one side (unless you are on one of those few sections with twin towpaths such as the BCN New Main Line).

[Rob-M]

29 minutes ago, David Mack said:

But was that to steer the boat in the direction of the cheese/bread, or to move the tiller towards the cheese/bread?

The way it was explained to me it was the direction to move the tillar.

[Sea Dog]

27 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Of course. But it only passes under the bridge on one side (unless you are on one of those few sections with twin towpaths such as the BCN New Main Line).

Ah, I see! Thanks David. Whilst transiting the bridge indeed there remains a towpath side. Once out though...  and hence still better to know Port and Starboard which was someone's original point.

Edited December 9, 2022 by Sea Dog
Autocorrect recorrect.

[___]

5 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

Ah, I see! Thanks David. Whilst transiting the bridge indeed there remains a towpath side. Once out though...  and hence still better to know Port and Starboard which was someone's original point.

I’m not getting why “port and starboard” is better than “left and right”.

 

The latter are understood by all, the former are niche terminology. On a boat they are both relative to the design of the boat which - in general - has a distinct front end and rear end and proceeds bow first. It only becomes confusing if you cruise stern first.

 

Bread and cheese was probably used because boat children were very young when they learnt to steer.

 

 

[Sea Dog]

1 minute ago, Captain Pegg said:

I’m not getting why “port and starboard” is better than “left and right”.

Perhaps it's just a sailor thing: yachties and the Royal Navy seem quite adamant that it's important. Perhaps it's cos they can go round in circles whereas on the canals that's somewhat rare?

[Alan de Enfield]

13 hours ago, dmr said:

port and stbd only work if you know whether you are going upstream or downstream which can be tricky on the cut 😀

 

Why ?

 

Are you suggesting that depending on if you are going upstream or downstream means you have to change the colour of your Nav lights on each side ?

Port and starboard are 'fixed' irrespective of where you stand in the boat, or whatever direction the boat is travelling.

 

 

[___]

36 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

Perhaps it's just a sailor thing: yachties and the Royal Navy seem quite adamant that it's important. Perhaps it's cos they can go round in circles whereas on the canals that's somewhat rare?

It seems it’s only important in that port and starboard are absolutely relative to a line from the stern to the bow of a vessel and therefore can’t be confused by the orientation of the observer.

 

On a large vessel that maybe matters more because crew may be stationed at various points around the vessel. On a narrowboat I’d naturally assume that direction is given from the view of the steerer. Hence left and right is probably only likely to cause confusion when going backwards.

 

It also seems quite hard to define port and starboard on a modern vessel other than by use of the terms “left” and “right”.

 

Edited December 9, 2022 by Captain Pegg

[Sea Dog]

3 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

It also seems quite hard to define port and starboard on a modern vessel other than by use of the terms “left” and “right”.

Hmm, that doesn't explain why, when I'm navigating in the car, "left" is often followed by "I meant the other left". My wife is now quite happy for me to use Port and Starboard which I never mix up. Horses for courses I guess. 

[___]

6 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

Hmm, that doesn't explain why, when I'm navigating in the car, "left" is often followed by "I meant the other left". My wife is now quite happy for me to use Port and Starboard which I never mix up. Horses for courses I guess. 

 

That’s sounds like an issue of memory rather than logic.