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Actual use of anchors in emergencies on UK canal/river network


IanD

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20 minutes ago, Jerra said:

I was thinking more of any action the relatives of the dead crew member might take.

Some people would count being on a river without an anchor as seriously negligent.

 

"Some people would count..." covers an awful lot of ground -- some people think that Elvis is still alive, or the Earth is flat, or 5G is frying their brains, or that aliens live amongst us, or that digital watches are really clever... 😉

 

If insurers (and the courts, and CART) thought that a narrowboat venturing out onto a river without an anchor was "seriously negligent", you can bet your boat that having one would be a legal requirement to get insurance cover and/or a license, like passing BSS.

 

They don't, which rather suggests it isn't... 😉

Edited by IanD
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2 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

"Some people would count..." covers an awful lot of ground -- some people think that Elvis is still alive, or the Earth is flat, or 5G is frying their brains, or that aliens live amongst us, or that digital watches are really clever... 😉

 

If insurers (and the courts, and CART) thought that a narrowboat venturing out onto a river without an anchor was "seriously negligent", you can bet your boat that having one would be a legal requirement to get insurance cover and/or a license, like passing BSS.

 

They don't, which rather suggests it isn't... 😉

Perhaps I should have been clearer.   Most people I know and it would seem many on here would consider going on a river without an anchor seriously negligent.

 

There is that better.

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2 minutes ago, Midnight said:

Seriously stupid!

I can't think of anyone who would consider going on a river without an anchor can you?

 

"P.P.S. Wouldn't it be nice just for once to have a reasoned discussion instead of descending to character assassination and name-calling? 😉 😉 😉"

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1 minute ago, IanD said:

 

"P.P.S. Wouldn't it be nice just for once to have a reasoned discussion instead of descending to character assassination and name-calling? 😉 😉 😉"

Are you kidding did you see how many reactions I got last time. 🤣 🤣🤣🤣 

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16 minutes ago, Jerra said:

Perhaps I should have been clearer.   Most people I know and it would seem many on here would consider going on a river without an anchor seriously negligent.

 

There is that better.

 

Some people might also consider that taking a diesel boat onto a river without draining/cleaning the fuel tank to remove any water/dirt and replacing all the fuel filters to be seriously negligent, since it seems that stirring up crap or water from the bottom of the tank is what has caused most of these problems leading to the boat losing power. Doing this would probably be a *much* bigger contribution to boat safety in these circumstances than carrying an anchor, by avoiding the problem happening in the first place.

 

So do you do that then? 😉

6 minutes ago, Midnight said:

Are you kidding did you see how many reactions I got last time. 🤣 🤣🤣🤣 

Troll.

 

It's hardly surprising that many people either don't bother posting on CWDF any more or give up after the name-calling starts, is it? 😞

Edited by IanD
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6 minutes ago, Midnight said:

Seriously stupid!

I can't think of anyone who would consider going on a river without an anchor can you?

 

I'm sure at least one could be found, but I very much doubt it would be from anyone who has actually spent much time on the Trent and had experience of the Rivers 'tantrums' in various conditions.

 

Maybe someone misguided individual who has 'tootalled' down the river in perfect conditions when it is very benign could be lulled into a false sense of security.

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2 minutes ago, Midnight said:

You just called me a "troll"

 

image.png.b6a44b4363d26306aff1d5334c463242.png

 

Does the truth hurt then? 😉

 

"Are you kidding did you see how many reactions I got last time." -- condemned by your own keyboard, go and read the dictionary.

 

Alternatively, grow up and debate like an adult instead of a toddler... 😉

Edited by IanD
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33 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

I'm sure at least one could be found, but I very much doubt it would be from anyone who has actually spent much time on the Trent and had experience of the Rivers 'tantrums' in various conditions.

 

Maybe someone misguided individual who has 'tootalled' down the river in perfect conditions when it is very benign could be lulled into a false sense of security.

Having pootled up and down both the tidal Ouse & Trent and the Ure, Calder, Aire, Severn and Avon in just about all conditions I'm sticking to my opinion (I have permission) - seriously stupid!

27 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

Does the truth hurt then? 😉

 

"Are you kidding did you see how many reactions I got last time." -- condemned by your own keyboard, go and read the dictionary.

 

Alternatively, grow up and debate like an adult instead of a toddler... 😉

Impossible to debate with 'seriously stupid' people.

Edited by Midnight
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4 minutes ago, Midnight said:

Having pootled up and down both the tidal Ouse & Trent and the Ure, Calder, Aire, Severn and Avon in just about all conditions I'm sticking to my opinion (I have permission) - seriously stupid!

 

But you don't clean your tank and filters before every trip -- that's seriously stupider! 😉

 

(my equally valid opinion, purely for the sake of argument...)

4 minutes ago, Midnight said:

Having pootled up and down both the tidal Ouse & Trent and the Ure, Calder, Aire, Severn and Avon in just about all conditions I'm sticking to my opinion (I have permission) - seriously stupid!

Impossible to debate with 'seriousy stupid' people.

Like you? 😉

 

CBA any more, going for a G&T and a curry...

Edited by IanD
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1 minute ago, IanD said:

 

But you don't clean your tank and filters before every trip -- that's seriously stupider! 😉

 

(my equally valid opinion, for the sake of argument...)

Actually I do we have our own Club diesel polisher. 😜😜😜😜

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31 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

Some people might also consider that taking a diesel boat onto a river without draining/cleaning the fuel tank to remove any water/dirt and replacing all the fuel filters to be seriously negligent, since it seems that stirring up crap or water from the bottom of the tank is what has caused most of these problems leading to the boat losing power. Doing this would probably be a *much* bigger contribution to boat safety in these circumstances than carrying an anchor, by avoiding the problem happening in the first place.

 

So do you do that then? 😉

Troll.

 

It's hardly surprising that many people either don't bother posting on CWDF any more or give up after the name-calling starts, is it? 😞

 

So hang on.

 

You call somebody a troll and in the same post complain about name calling.

 

You really are priceless Ian. Priceless.

20 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

Does the truth hurt then? 😉

 

"Are you kidding did you see how many reactions I got last time." -- condemned by your own keyboard, go and read the dictionary.

 

Alternatively, grow up and debate like an adult instead of a toddler... 😉

 

Why dont you just put everybody you disagree with on your renowned 'naughty step' and give your blood pressure a chance.

 

🤣🤣🤣🤣

 

 

Edited by M_JG
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2 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Anyone who actualy knows anything about boating would always carry an anchor, a fool may not. Speaking as someone who holds 3 different boatmasters licence I can say in full knowledge that, had I taken the Nottingham Princess out without BOTH its anchors I could have been prosecuted, they were part of the very strict regulations pertaining to that particular boat. Yes, i fully understand we are talking leisure boats here so there is no requirement in law but if an anchor is deemed necessary on an inland waterway such as the Trent for a commercial passenger boat, then anyone who knows anything about boating would have the sense to realise that an anchor makes sense. Anchors cost diddly squat,  if say I was mug enough to pay well over the odds for a narrowboat and then not pay a few hundred pounds for an anchor that would make me stupid. Problem is some people know better than all the proffesionals. 

 

You do know that none of that will 'cut the mustard' with Cap'n IanD dont you?

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3 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Anyone who actualy knows anything about boating would always carry an anchor, a fool may not. Speaking as someone who holds 3 different boatmasters licence I can say in full knowledge that, had I taken the Nottingham Princess out without BOTH its anchors I could have been prosecuted, they were part of the very strict regulations pertaining to that particular boat. Yes, i fully understand we are talking leisure boats here so there is no requirement in law but if an anchor is deemed necessary on an inland waterway such as the Trent for a commercial passenger boat, then anyone who knows anything about boating would have the sense to realise that an anchor makes sense. Anchors cost diddly squat,  if say I was mug enough to pay well over the odds for a narrowboat and then not pay a few hundred pounds for an anchor that would make me stupid. Problem is some people know better than all the proffesionals. 

Anchors aside, having seen the standard of some of the Boatmaster Licence Holders on both the Thames and the Trent, I'm unsure of how much of a recommendation that is in reality.:unsure: I was well impressed by the standard of the Tug Skippers on the Thames, but they were just pulling rubbish barges, now  after the Marchioness disaster I was expecting the passenger boat skippers to be absolutely First Class, sadly I was very disappointed, they were crap.

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3 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

Anchors aside, having seen the standard of some of the Boatmaster Licence Holders on both the Thames and the Trent, I'm unsure of how much of a recommendation that is in reality.:unsure: I was well impressed by the standard of the Tug Skippers on the Thames, but they were just pulling rubbish barges, now  after the Marchioness disaster I was expecting the passenger boat skippers to be absolutely First Class, sadly I was very disappointed, they were crap.

 

I guess its much like all professions/jobs.

 

Some coppers are clearly crap, but they tend to be in the minority. Same as my old profession, not all nurses are 'angels'.

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4 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

Anchors aside, having seen the standard of some of the Boatmaster Licence Holders on both the Thames and the Trent, I'm unsure of how much of a recommendation that is in reality.:unsure: I was well impressed by the standard of the Tug Skippers on the Thames, but they were just pulling rubbish barges, now  after the Marchioness disaster I was expecting the passenger boat skippers to be absolutely First Class, sadly I was very disappointed, they were crap.

Well I wasnt, Ive heard twaddle like your post here over the years, there are good and bad in every job/qualification. To make it easy for those with less " Gumption " There are safety measures in many walks of life, some compulsory, some not. Take an easy one so its not too taxing for you, a motorcycle. Its compulsory to use one piece of safety equipment, the crash helmet, its not compulsory to wear decent safety clothing, so we have all seen the total numpties in shorts and a T shirt. Same with boats realy.

2 minutes ago, M_JG said:

 

I guess its much like all professions/jobs.

 

Some coppers are clearly crap, but they tend to be in the minority. Same as my old profession, not all nurses are 'angels'.

Is your head staring to hurt as well :banghead:

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4 minutes ago, M_JG said:

 

I guess its much like all professions/jobs.

 

Some coppers are clearly crap, but they tend to be in the minority. Same as my old profession, not all nurses are 'angels'.

Following the Marchioness disaster I would have expected to see a severe clamp down on standards of Thames Passenger Boat Skippers, from my anecdotal experience, they still aren't that good. So if muppets such as they can get a Boatmaster Licence, it rather undermines holding it up as some sort of 'Gold Standard'. I wouldn't expect any airline pilots to be 'a bit crap' and I don't expect passenger boat skippers to be either. The way they performed endangered both me and their own paying customers.

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7 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

Following the Marchioness disaster I would have expected to see a severe clamp down on standards of Thames Passenger Boat Skippers, from my anecdotal experience, they still aren't that good. So if muppets such as they can get a Boatmaster Licence, it rather undermines holding it up as some sort of 'Gold Standard'. I wouldn't expect any airline pilots to be 'a bit crap' and I don't expect passenger boat skippers to be either. The way they performed endangered both me and their own paying customers.

 

Perhaps IanD could give them some training.?

🤣

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1 hour ago, IanD said:

 

Some people might also consider that taking a diesel boat onto a river without draining/cleaning the fuel tank to remove any water/dirt and replacing all the fuel filters to be seriously negligent, since it seems that stirring up crap or water from the bottom of the tank is what has caused most of these problems leading to the boat losing power. Doing this would probably be a *much* bigger contribution to boat safety in these circumstances than carrying an anchor, by avoiding the problem happening in the first place.

 

So do you do that then? 😉

 

It is many years since I last took a boat on a river and yes the fuel and tank were clean and I was carrying an anchor.

 

Incidentally dirty fuel and or lack of maintenance aren't the only reasons for a boat losing power, it is impossible to totally ensure nothing will go wrong.   For the cost, size and weight of an anchor it seems IMO to be "spoiling the ship for a hap'orth of tar" to not have one.

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1 hour ago, Jerra said:

Perhaps I should have been clearer.   Most people I know and it would seem many on here would consider going on a river without an anchor seriously negligent.

 

There is that better.

I would not say seriously negligent, I would say that the boat should be well maintained, have plenty of clean fuel in a clean tank, and a competent crew plus charts. The carrying of the anchor would be complimentary.

Ignoring all the above and going on to an unpredictable river in anything other than ideal conditions is foolhardy, but just not carrying this imaginary anchor is not seriously negligent, however that is defined.

Personally I would not take my own boat on any river without good ground tackle.

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