Smoke Free Zones

[wandering snail]

This response from DEFRA in reply to questions from the NBTA. This will however apply to any boat who happens to moor up in a Smoke Free Zone but is it only me who finds it a bit of a muddle??

"With regard to boats in particular, the Act will enable local authorities to bring moored inland waterway vessels such as canal boats, into the scope of smoke control areas should they have a specific issue in their area. However, they will need to consult publicly before using this power. This has the potential to apply to boats burning diesel or other fuels if they are emitting smoke, for example because an appliance has not been properly maintained, but only while they are moored or stationary at a mooring place. As such, boat dwellers could not be fined for emitting smoke while entering a smoke control area as they would not be moored.

It is also important to note that in cases where moored vessels have been brought into scope of a smoke control area, the local authorities are required to reimburse owners or occupiers of vessels for works carried out to avoid incurring a financial penalty. The Environment Act sets out the criteria an owner or occupier of a vessel must meet in order to be eligible for reimbursement. For example, the vessel must have the right to moor at a single mooring place for the qualifying period, the owner or occupier must complete the adaptations prior to the coming into operation of the order, and the owner or occupier must not have access to mains gas or electricity.

We are in the process of developing guidance on the new smoke control area rules, which will be available once the legislation comes into force in May.”

[Alan de Enfield]

3 minutes ago, wandering snail said:

The Environment Act sets out the criteria an owner or occupier of a vessel must meet in order to be eligible for reimbursement. For example, the vessel must have the right to moor at a single mooring place for the qualifying period,

 

I bet the qualifying period is over 14 days.

[TheBiscuits]

1 minute ago, wandering snail said:

is it only me who finds it a bit of a muddle?

 

No, it is a muddle.  Don't produce large amounts of smoke and nobody will really care though.

 

We don't fret about the smoke control zones because we try not to run smoky - get the stove burning hot and clean before throttling back, use approved smokeless fuels or seasoned wood, service the engine.  

 

Some boats smell and look like they are burning old tyres as fuel, which tends to be either unseasoned wood or non-smokeless fuel throttled back on the stove.  Or running a knackered diesel engine that creates a smokescreen for hours on end outside somebody's house.

4 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

I bet the qualifying period is over 14 days.

 

So it's not the CCers then, it's boats with permanent moorings that will have the most trouble ...

[David Mack]

21 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

So it's not the CCers then, it's boats with permanent moorings that will have the most trouble ...

The rules will apply to all boats mooring at a "mooring place", but only those with a qualifying permanent mooring will be eligible for reimbursement of the costs of making the boat compliant.

It's less clear whether "mooring place" refers only to designated moorings, or anywhere where mooring is permitted i.e. basically everywhere except where mooring is specifically not permitted.

[Alan de Enfield]

 

37 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

So it's not the CCers then, it's boats with permanent moorings that will have the most trouble ...

 

What's the 'trouble' when someone else pays to have your boat modified.

Better than a go-fund-me page, you don't even have to ask for the money.

[dmr]

My engine is getting a big smokey, I think its because its done 13000 hours. Might it be worth taking a mooring for a year so the council can fit a new set of pistons, rings and liners for me?   or if they don't have a man who rebuilds engines maybe just go for a complete new one? 😀

[LadyG]

50 minutes ago, dmr said:

My engine is getting a big smokey, I think its because its done 13000 hours. Might it be worth taking a mooring for a year so the council can fit a new set of pistons, rings and liners for me?   or if they don't have a man who rebuilds engines maybe just go for a complete new one? 😀

Don't be silly, you need an electric boat, that's the only way forward, plug in to power, and top up with your new solar panels. 💪

There used to be scrsppage scheme for old cars, I expect a similar scheme will be introduced soon enough for old boats. 

Edited March 16, 2022 by LadyG

[Tacet]

I suspect that some of this harks back to smoke control area or zone made under the Clean Air Act 1956 which began to bite in the mid 1960s.  Householders in an area subject to a new order could claim a grant (maybe 70%) of the cost of adapting fire places to burn smokeless fuels.   Young as I was, I recall the opportunity was taken by a good number to install central heating (solid fuel, oil or gas fired) as a good fix - but no doubt the grant was based on the cheapest solution such as new grate.

 

If I am on the right lines, bringing boats under the same controls might still trigger the same provisions.

 

[magnetman]

I will never stop burning road cones and old tyres on my fire in inner east London. I do get quite a good stock if these and the latest thing seems to be throwing those plastic roadworks barriers in the cut.

 

Easily dealt with by the jigsaw. 

 

The main thing is having a good relationship with the neighbours "don't worry the squatters over the other side running their engines and being a nuisance will be legislated out of existence before too long" 

 

Also the electric has gone up by almost as much as Putin's grads which makes it even more cost effective to burn the rubber. 

 

It's going to be an interesting one to watch. 

 

[LadyG]

13 hours ago, magnetman said:

I will never stop burning road cones and old tyres on my fire in inner east London. I do get quite a good stock if these and the latest thing seems to be throwing those plastic roadworks barriers in the cut.

 

Easily dealt with by the jigsaw. 

 

The main thing is having a good relationship with the neighbours "don't worry the squatters over the other side running their engines and being a nuisance will be legislated out of existence before too long" 

 

Also the electric has gone up by almost as much as Putin's grads which makes it even more cost effective to burn the rubber. 

 

It's going to be an interesting one to watch. 

 

Why don't you connect up to the mains electric? Just borrow one of those little striped tents, set it up on towpath and start digging, you'll soon find electricity, maybe gas if your lucky 😊

[Cheshire cat]

There was a stoppage on the Northampton arm of the GU a few years ago because someone had tapped in to a fuel pipe where it arched over the canal.

[Iain_S]

18 hours ago, Tacet said:

I suspect that some of this harks back to smoke control area or zone made under the Clean Air Act 1956 which began to bite in the mid 1960s.  Householders in an area subject to a new order could claim a grant (maybe 70%) of the cost of adapting fire places to burn smokeless fuels.   Young as I was, I recall the opportunity was taken by a good number to install central heating (solid fuel, oil or gas fired) as a good fix - but no doubt the grant was based on the cheapest solution such as new grate.

 

If I am on the right lines, bringing boats under the same controls might still trigger the same provisions.

 

The grant was certainly not enough to install central heating! In my parents' case, the grant went part way to installing one gas fire (relatively simple, as the pipe was there for a gas poker) and one multifuel stove. That was in a fairly large (5 rooms plus bathroom, plus attic room) terraced house. The remaining three fireplaces were just blocked off.