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ivan&alice

Considering an upgrade!! What do you think?

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8 minutes ago, fatmanblue said:

Yes, absolutely agree - but on the boat being discussed the engine is right under your feet (not literally, but very close to).  

Ah, I hadn't spotted that, thank for for pointing it out.

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23 minutes ago, fatmanblue said:

Yes, absolutely agree - but on the boat being discussed the engine is right under your feet (not literally, but very close to).  

Even better in this configuration as you can hear it AND see it whilst you are journeying and the "drying room" is seperate from the rest of the boat so on hot days the boat doesn't get hot from engine use .

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6 minutes ago, Halsey said:

Even better in this configuration as you can hear it AND see it whilst you are journeying and the "drying room" is seperate from the rest of the boat so on hot days the boat doesn't get hot from engine use .

I don't agree with this. Having steered a few boats with traditional engines in the rear cabin it doesn't seem to work as well.  They somehow don't feel as balanced and the noise however pleasant is always better after a few days several feet away. 

Definitely try both before buying.

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3 hours ago, ivan&alice said:

 

I don't know anything about using trad controls, I can't see that being a particularly difficult thing. I am perhaps harping too much on the difference in driving her, I just wonder if it makes sense to go from the simplicity of our current boat.

I don't think you need to worry about handling her.   We sold the house and changed from a 42ft trad to a 70ft Hudson tug with JP3 in 1999 and took delivery at the end of the Braunston boat show.   The canal was solid with boats leaving, so I asked Steve to give me some tuition before I set off.   As we exited the marina entrance he stepped off and said you'll be alright now and we were lucky not to hit anything and avoid the trees.  

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Good to know that a cauliflower is possible. We also rely on this for our washing machine (because we don't want to use the lithiums for heating water) so I would be less than happy to give up the endless hot water that cruising provides. First prize would be if a new cauliflower could "pre-heat" the water and the Morco only "tops up" the heat if the water isn't hot enough yet. 45 mins is around twice as long as our calorifier takes to heat up but that could be a result of a smaller tank as much as a cooler engine.

 

 

Not allowed I'm afraid, its against the regs for using a gas instantaneous water heater, one or the other , not one after the other.

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29 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Good to know that a cauliflower is possible. We also rely on this for our washing machine (because we don't want to use the lithiums for heating water) so I would be less than happy to give up the endless hot water that cruising provides. First prize would be if a new cauliflower could "pre-heat" the water and the Morco only "tops up" the heat if the water isn't hot enough yet. 45 mins is around twice as long as our calorifier takes to heat up but that could be a result of a smaller tank as much as a cooler engine.

 

 

Not allowed I'm afraid, its against the regs for using a gas instantaneous water heater, one or the other , not one after the other.

I think what you mean is you can't use an instantaneous heater to heat a tank of water - you can and I certainly have use both on your boat as each is intended within the regs

 

Some people see "simple" as hard work I have always seen "simple" as basic and therefore less to go wrong/maintain/expense

 

As with this boat (and marmite) its down to personal choice 

47 minutes ago, noddyboater said:

I don't agree with this. Having steered a few boats with traditional engines in the rear cabin it doesn't seem to work as well.  They somehow don't feel as balanced and the noise however pleasant is always better after a few days several feet away. 

Definitely try both before buying.

Don't agree and nor does Malcolm Braine and/or Peter Nicholls to name a couple who know more than we ever will - the only difference can only be ballasting/weight distribution and its effects

Edited by Halsey

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1 minute ago, Halsey said:

I think what you mean is you can't use an instantaneous heater to heat a tank of water - you can and I certainly have use both on your boat as each is intended within the regs

 

Some people see "simple" as hard work I have always seen "simple" as basic and therefore less to go wrong/maintain/expense

 

As with this boat (and marmite) its down to personal choice 

No I did not.

 

The OP suggested using the calorifier as the primary heater and feeding its hot water output into a Morco gas heater to increase the temperature further, not allowed.

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2 hours ago, fatmanblue said:

- the lack of a walkway through the boat would leave the steerer rather lonely.  Even getting a cup of tea would be an exercise.  I'm often popping down into the cabin to put the kettle on/find something/use the loo whilst waiting for a lock or whatever.

 

- Vintage engines sound fantastic from a distance.  Not so great when right under your feet.

With a narrowboat there is always a tradeoff. For us the full size bed rather than the small double we currently have is what we'd be gaining, what we'd be losing is having to walk along the gunwale in order to pop down to the cabin. That's a tough choice, to be sure. 

 

1 hour ago, Athy said:

But they rarely are: they are most likely to be twelve feet in front of you, on the other side of at least one door. We can hear our [Gardner] engine from the steering position but it certainly isn't intrusive, in fact its steady beat is rather reassuring.

 

Another feature of older engines which (as far as I noticed) hasn't yet been mentioned is that they inhabit an engine room which provides   storage space for oil and diesel cans etc and, because the engine produces dry heat, is an ideal drying room for towels, clothes, and shoes (which you put on top of the engine, that's why the top is flat), 

 

1 hour ago, fatmanblue said:

Yes, absolutely agree - but on the boat being discussed the engine is right under your feet (not literally, but very close to).  

I'm getting very nervous about the noise now. I think I will simply have to go and listen to it and judge whether it's something I can handle. As a newish boater I don't have any sentimentality for the traditional engine sound so maybe I'm just going to find it spoils my peaceful cruise :( I might have to leave this one for a boater who would appreciate it more than me. 

 

 

1 hour ago, TheBiscuits said:

How does the original infamous spreadsheet of Ivan stack up for this one?

 

Now you are boaters and not wannabees, does the original shopping list still make sense?

I won't ever live that down :P The spreadsheet got us the right boat, one we could afford and what has served us very very well. But yes of course, with a couple of years' experience my priorities have all changed. We still love this boat - but I think maintaining a boat while living aboard is a lot of work even when starting from a place of near-completeness, and this boat had a lot needing doing when we moved on and has a long way still to go. 

 

 

12 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

The OP suggested using the calorifier as the primary heater and feeding its hot water output into a Morco gas heater to increase the temperature further, not allowed.

Thanks for clarifying, makes sense that it would not be, if the Morco isn't smart enough to know hot water when it feels it. 

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28 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

No I did not.

 

The OP suggested using the calorifier as the primary heater and feeding its hot water output into a Morco gas heater to increase the temperature further, not allowed.

OK my mistake I see what you mean now................

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30 minutes ago, Halsey said:

 

Don't agree and nor does Malcolm Braine and/or Peter Nicholls to name a couple who know more than we ever will - the only difference can only be ballasting/weight distribution and its effects

I'm not saying it's a physical weight thing,  but the feel of the boat is definitely different with the lump in the arse end. I'm sure plenty are put there, but it doesn't do anything for me. 

 

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Just now, Halsey said:

OK my mistake I see what you mean now................

Thanks, the problem is that a gas heater works on the flow of water through it, so if the water is already hot it will add the same amount of heat to it as if it were cold, causing flash steam generation in the heat exchanger. Its a bit very dangerous!

  • Greenie 2

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6 minutes ago, ivan&alice said:

this boat had a lot needing doing when we moved on and has a long way still to go. 

... excellent scope for the next owner to put their own stamp on it.

 

Don't talk it down if you're about to sell it!

  • Haha 2

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as you say - go and "see, touch and feel" it!

 

as with all boats 30secs is all you need to make that connection - just don't let the buyer see it on your face!

  • Haha 1

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11 minutes ago, ivan&alice said:

  

 

 

 

I'm getting very nervous about the noise now.

Think of it as a sound rather than a noise! Like the sound of a heartbeat.

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13 minutes ago, ivan&alice said:

 

 

 

I won't ever live that down :P The spreadsheet got us the right boat

There's nothing to live down. You approached boat purchase with a commendable mixture of head and heart. Perhaps "head" took the lead that time; now could be the time to let "heart" take priority.

Go and see the boat!

 

 

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17 minutes ago, Athy said:

Think of it as a sound rather than a noise! Like the sound of a heartbeat.

Totally agree if you think its a noise then its not for you ............

13 minutes ago, Athy said:

There's nothing to live down. You approached boat purchase with a commendable mixture of head and heart. Perhaps "head" took the lead that time; now could be the time to let "heart" take priority.

Go and see the boat!

 

 

Go and see it - you cant judge romance/emotion from a distance

  • Greenie 1

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I’ve known Malcolm since I was a kid in the 60s, I remember him starting the yard on the site of Yates Brothers in the mid 60s. I regard him as one of the few boatbuilders on the system, he had an eye for shape and proportion which looked right. His successor, Graham Edgson, took Malcolm’s designs on further and in steel and produced, to my eye, some of the nicest looking boats on the system. I should remember the re-skin, a process developed by Graham, this one has slipped my memory, unless it was done elsewhere. The RN has more than enough grunt to cope with situations likely to be encountered, and with a much nicer sound than a aJapanese buzzbox. Yes, go and look. Do.....

  • Greenie 1

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The RN two pot engine has a very soothing, lazy almost subtle beat. Very desirable.

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Our 18 hp lister never gets warm enough and never works hard enough on modern canals.

it needs a full load and a loaded butty to tow to do any work.

Grand Unions were fitted from russels from new and designed for 6 mph. So if anything you are over powered.

  • Happy 1

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On 21/09/2020 at 15:47, fatmanblue said:

Yes, absolutely agree - but on the boat being discussed the engine is right under your feet (not literally, but very close to).  

Just inside the back door where the shove should be

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Just to close off this topic, the boat was sold so that's that. Thanks for humouring me with the discussion though - and re-inspired to finish the boat I've got. A boat in the hand is worth two on the Duck, after all!

  • Happy 1

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