Gas prices

[Gareth E]

Just now, Alan de Enfield said:

Ooops :

 

As I showed further down the post - indeed 1 litre = 0.51 Kgs.

So 13kg gas cylinder contains 26 litres of propane.

Going to have to start seriously thinking about refilling my own, and work out a way to carry them on my motor bike.

Just now, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Yes so not quite the 'foaming at the mouth' rip-off some here originally thought eh!

 

Especially not once refilling costs, bottle testing and marking costs and transport costs are also added in.

 

No, but around 15 quid to around 34 is still a rip off, just not one that makes one foam at the mouth.

[BWM]

10 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Which is clearly unacceptable. I expect for the extortionate price Calor charge, they check the integrity/safety of each returned bottle and valve prior to refilling it.

They most certainly do not, i worked for them for a number of years. There were many we returned with faulty valves and one in particular that had been filled with water that came back to our depot again and again, despite being labelled. One particularly entertaining event concerned one that had been adapted for smuggling, my supervisor dragged it off the trailer and let it fall, as was normal when shifting hundreds per day, at which point the base fell off!

 His expression was of someone resigned to meeting his maker for a split second. A clever arrangement, with a small reservoir of gas in the top to foil customs i presume-all completely undetected by the bottling plant. 

[Alan de Enfield]

1 minute ago, Gareth E said:

Going to have to start seriously thinking about refilling my own, and work out a way to carry them on my motor bike.

Stand by for incoming …………………………...

 

I re-fill my own Camping gas cartridges, from larger cartridges. It is quite widely accepted amongst walkers / hikers (but from a previous thread - apparently not in Scotland, which surprises me.

[MtB]

34 minutes ago, Gareth E said:

Going to have to start seriously thinking about refilling my own, and work out a way to carry them on my motor bike.

No, but around 15 quid to around 34 is still a rip off, just not one that makes one foam at the mouth.

 

How many a month do you use then? Is it really worth the considerable extra effort and twarting about Vs the increased risk and higher cost? 

 

How much value do you put on your time? How much will you have to 'invest' in gadgets? Where will you get the gas from at £15 for 26 litres? All to save £19, once a month, or six weeks?

 

 

Edited November 20, 2018 by Mike the Boilerman

[Mike Tee]

I run my car on lpg so this thread is interesting for me (gas guzzling 2.4 litres 4x4 and on a value basis get 40mpg round town)

There must be a tech guru who can adapt the content of this video for boats. Although I suspect the sticking point will be the garage where you try to fill a loose tank.

 

[MtB]

7 minutes ago, Mike Tee said:

Although I suspect the sticking point will be the garage where you try to fill a loose tank.

 

Well yes, this is it. And buying only £15 of LPG at the car LPG pump will flag you up as being a self filler.

 

Peter, where do your motorhome fixed installations fill up? In LPG garages? Are the garages ok with this?

 

[MtB]

Ok I've watched the video now. Very illuminating, thanks!

 

 

[Alan de Enfield]

19 minutes ago, Mike Tee said:

There must be a tech guru who can adapt the content of this video for boats. Although I suspect the sticking point will be the garage where you try to fill a loose tank.

No problem , the equipment is available and many garages support it.

 

http://www.safefill.co.uk/refilling-retailers.html

 

Gives a list of about 300 filling stations.

 

Safefill joined the APEA and PEIMF and through these associations was introduced to members of the PRA who, in turn, greeted the new, innovative product with enthusiasm and acceptance. The PRA could see the benefits of Safefill and how, by customers using Safefill, LPG sales would increase as would footfall to the forecourts. Safefill may even reduce the amount of illegal and unsafe filling of rented steel cylinders with adaptors. This change in policy will enable forecourt operators with LPG dispensing facilities to tap into another market, as Safefill’s portable solution is convenient for customers and that convenience can only translate into increased footfall on the forecourt. The PRA, from the onset, have guided, advised and supported Safefill in its push for change and are instrumental in the change in policy for the filling of user-owned refillable cylinders on forecourts .

 

“We are delighted that, at the recent meeting of the Petroleum Equipment Liaison Group (PELG), there was a unanimous agreement to permit the refilling of LPG cylinders, which are designed to be refilled, from Autogas dispensers.”

 

Safefill cylinders comply with international standards and approvals and do not BLEVE (Boiling Liquid Expanding Vapour Explosion). Also, a Safefill risk assessment is available for forecourt filling. This is intended for use in conjunction with the site assessments already required for the operation of LPG-only and LPG+ petroleum dispensing sites. Following the change in The Red Guide and the updating of User Information Sheet 26, to include the refilling of portable cylinders such as Safefill, Safefill looks forward to an acceptance, by all forecourts, to allow the refilling of cylinders specifically designed to be refilled.

Edited November 20, 2018 by Alan de Enfield

[Momac]

41 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

I re-fill my own Camping gas cartridges, from larger cartridges. It is quite widely accepted amongst walkers / hikers 

Do you provide a campingaz refilling service for 907 cylinders?

 

 

[Mike Tee]

Bit of a slog reading through this, but anybody really interested in filling their own tank should have a look

 

http://www.safefill.co.uk/pdf/petrol-heads-up-2017.pdf

 

eta - beaten to it by alan de E (took me a while to find the article!)

Edited November 20, 2018 by Mike Tee

[Alan de Enfield]

5 minutes ago, MartynG said:

Do you provide a campingaz refilling service for 907 cylinders?

 

 

No, I do cartridges not cylinders (haven't we had this discussion previously ?)

 

 

[Momac]

3 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

No, I do cartridges not cylinders (haven't we had this discussion previously ?)

 

 

Don't think so but apologies if we have

Always looking for cheaper way to refill the gas but rarely finding anything that is viable.

I did find one source but when  he realised the normal retail price there was some instant inflation !

[rasputin]

Yes, I brought it up recently, but worth a second look, there is already more info in this thread 

[Momac]

Looking on the interweb the prices for campingaz 907  refills doesn't seem to have gone up recently but the price is already  ridiculously high at £35 for 2.7kg of gas   . I think they charge whatever they think they can get away with.

Any more and it may be cheaper to eat out !

 

[Wanderer Vagabond]

Does anyone know if Capital Gas alongside the canal is Stoke on Trent is still selling at substantially below the normal price? Every time I've been past they've always been the cheapest on the cut. There is another place at Castleford that sells cheap gas but, since the bottle ran out about 10 before we expected it to (they last us 8 weeks), I suspect that they rather underfill the bottle.

[cuthound]

3 hours ago, rusty69 said:

They probably are now.So I made a mistake, It is actually £36 quid  bottle!

No.Cos.I Assumed it was the going rate.

 

And there was me thinking you have been using your time machine again. ?

[rusty69]

1 minute ago, cuthound said:

 

And there was me thinking you have been using your time machine again. ?

It doesn't go back thatttt far.When we first moved aboard, a 13kg bottle was about 13 quid iirc.

[cuthound]

4 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

It doesn't go back thatttt far.When we first moved aboard, a 13kg bottle was about 13 quid iirc.

 

I can remember hiring a portable catalytic gas heater and bottle from UCC at Braunston, to heat our camping boat for a week. It cost 50p. That was back in October 1974.

[J R ALSOP]

I got two bottles at Eturia last year, £19:00 each. only to boats, tradesman in van pays full price.

[Wanderer Vagabond]

4 hours ago, J R ALSOP said:

I got two bottles at Eturia last year, £19:00 each. only to boats, tradesman in van pays full price.

Was that at Capital Gas on the towpath about a couple of hundred metres North from Etruria Junction?

[MtB]

10 hours ago, MartynG said:

Looking on the interweb the prices for campingaz 907  refills doesn't seem to have gone up recently but the price is already  ridiculously high at £35 for 2.7kg of gas   . I think they charge whatever they think they can get away with.

Any more and it may be cheaper to eat out !

 

 

Well the gas is free as any fule kno. Its the getting of it out the ground, filling and supply chain to you that costs the £35.

 

Nothing stopping you going and getting it out of the north sea yourself, is there, if you resent paying someone else to do it?

[Alan de Enfield]

8 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Well the gas is free as any fule kno. Its the getting of it out the ground, filling and supply chain to you that costs the £35.

 

Nothing stopping you going and getting it out of the north sea yourself, is there, if you resent paying someone else to do it?

It is a discretionary purchase - no one is making anyone buy it.

There are other 'brands' available and alternative sources of energy at lower costs.

 

You pay for convenience, cleanliness, and energy stored.

 

It is interesting to look at the 'energy' of alternative fuel sources (here is part of a presentation I did for another forum)

 

Hexamine = 8 Wh / gram

Chafing Gel = 7.44 Wh / gram

Propane LPG = 13.6Wh / gram

Mixed Camping Gas = 14.2 Wh / gram

Seasoned Dry Wood = 4.2 Wh / gram

Methylated Spirit = 7.22 Wh/Gram

Petrol / Diesel = 12.5Wh / gram

Anthracite = 8.6 Wh / gram

 

 

LPG has getting on for twice the energy of Smokeless fuel, three times the energy of wood and about 10% more than diesel.

 

 

[Graham Davis]

You can fill Safefill containers at Morrisson's supermarket.
They have an agreement.

[Alan de Enfield]

1 minute ago, Graham Davis said:

You can fill Safefill containers at Morrisson's supermarket.
They have an agreement.

I know - it was highlighted in the link I posted 10 hours ago,

[Mike Tee]

Interesting that lpg has, per above list, more energy than petrol, yet gives slightly less (about 8% to 10%) mpg in a vehicle