E mail and Big Brother

[jenevers]

How is it possible to tell which country someone is emailing from? 

[rusty69]

It probably isn't for us mere mortals.

 

ETA Unless,of course, you ask them

Edited October 6, 2018 by rusty69

[Robbo]

You could look at the headers and see what servers the email used.

 

link on how to do...

http://www.emailaddressmanager.com/tips/header.html

Edited October 6, 2018 by Robbo

[Chewbacka]

If the sender is using web mail to ‘talk’ to their (for example) uk based mail server, then the mail will come to you from the uk server.  You can not tell where they are.

[Sea Dog]

I'm in the middle of a financial deal by email with a Nigerian Prince.  His email comes from Nigeria, obviously, but it's not easy to tell. Mind you, I think he takes precautions to hide their origin because British people keep trying to scam him.

[Señor Chris]

2 hours ago, Chewbacka said:

If the sender is using web mail to ‘talk’ to their (for example) uk based mail server, then the mail will come to you from the uk server.  You can not tell where they are.

Unless the web mail server includes the 'X-Originating-IP' header. Some do.

 

 

[WotEver]

1 hour ago, Sea Dog said:

I'm in the middle of a financial deal by email with a Nigerian Prince.  His email comes from Nigeria, obviously, but it's not easy to tell. Mind you, I think he takes precautions to hide their origin because British people keep trying to scam him.

I hope it’s not the prince I’m talking to because he promised ME the money. 

[rusty69]

11 minutes ago, WotEver said:

I hope it’s not the prince I’m talking to because he promised ME the money. 

If he owns  a bunch of car park meters, i wouldn't hold your breath! 

Edited October 6, 2018 by rusty69

[MtB]

2 hours ago, Sea Dog said:

I'm in the middle of a financial deal by email with a Nigerian Prince.  His email comes from Nigeria, obviously, but it's not easy to tell. Mind you, I think he takes precautions to hide their origin because British people keep trying to scam him.

 

Another Nigerian prince died recently and in desperation he left £30m to Battersea Dogs' Home. 

 

He tried to give it all away before he died, but unfortunately, nobody would answer his emails....

 

 

[Dr Bob]

7 hours ago, jenevers said:

How is it possible to tell which country someone is emailing from? 

.....and then if they are using a vpn, you ain't got a hope in hell.

If I was doin anything dodgey, I would use a vpn, but then I don't so I don't.?

[Robbo]

8 hours ago, Dr Bob said:

.....and then if they are using a vpn, you ain't got a hope in hell.

If I was doin anything dodgey, I would use a vpn, but then I don't so I don't.?

A VPN is just really another ISP so isn’t hiding you, it’s just hiding you from your current ISP.  TOR is better if you want to be hidden as it is multiple layers and multiple outlet IPs to the internet.

[rusty69]

23 minutes ago, Robbo said:

A VPN is just really another ISP so isn’t hiding you, it’s just hiding you from your current ISP.  TOR is better if you want to be hidden as it is multiple layers and multiple outlet IPs to the internet.

Won't a VPN mask which country you are in then? 

 

ETA. I don't like onions. 

Edited October 7, 2018 by rusty69

[Jennifer McM]

9 hours ago, Dr Bob said:

.....and then if they are using a vpn, you ain't got a hope in hell.

If I was doin anything dodgey, I would use a vpn, but then I don't so I don't.?

4

But you knew..... complicit I'd say..... ? ?

 

I've never tried it, but this page might help:

https://whatismyipaddress.com/trace-email

Edited October 7, 2018 by Jennifer McM

[Robbo]

1 hour ago, rusty69 said:

Won't a VPN mask which country you are in then? 

 

ETA. I don't like onions. 

Yes but it’s only a single provider, so if you were trying to hide something from the authorities, they just contact the VPN provider and ask who used that IP, just like they would with your ISP,  the only advantage is that you could use another country where our authorities don’t get on,  most use a VPN provider that is “unknown” so probably ran by the US authorities anyhow!

Edited October 7, 2018 by Robbo

[rusty69]

10 minutes ago, Robbo said:

Yes but it’s only a single provider, so if you were trying to hide something from the authorities, they just contact the VPN provider and ask who used that IP, just like they would with your ISP,  the only advantage is that you could use another country where our authorities don’t get on,  most use a VPN provider that is “unknown” so probably ran by the US authorities anyhow!

Yes, but as a mere mortal ,not an authority,if someone was sending e-mails through a VPN would it not be difficult to determine the country of origin?

[Robbo]

5 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Yes, but as a mere mortal ,not an authority,if someone was sending e-mails through a VPN would it not be difficult to determine the country of origin?

Depends how you sent the email.

[Chewbacka]

46 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Yes, but as a mere mortal ,not an authority,if someone was sending e-mails through a VPN would it not be difficult to determine the country of origin?

Headers can also be forged, so even if you think you probably know where the sender was you can NEVER be certain as you don't know what methods to shield their location were used.  So the short answer to the op is it is not possible to be certain to know where the sender of an email was when the email was sent.  This excludes GCHQ, CIA etc.  As I am certain they will also run torr relays, vpn points etc but then they have no interest or time to waste on me as I am no threat to them.

[Señor Chris]

2 hours ago, Robbo said:

A VPN is just really another ISP so isn’t hiding you, it’s just hiding you from your current ISP.

VPNs are not ISPs - you connect to a VPN through an ISP.  Your current ISP allocates your IP address so will always know where you are but will not be able to read what is sent due to encryption by the VPN.

 

1 hour ago, Robbo said:

if you were trying to hide something from the authorities, they just contact the VPN provider and ask who used that IP, just like they would with your ISP

Which is why VPN servers are located in countries where they are not required to keep logs. They couldn't provide that information even if they wanted to.

 

[Señor Chris]

1 hour ago, rusty69 said:

Yes, but as a mere mortal ,not an authority,if someone was sending e-mails through a VPN would it not be difficult to determine the country of origin?

It would be impossible. The email would go from sender->isp->vpn->mail system->you, so as far as the mail system is concerned, the email originated from wherever the vpn is located.

[Robbo]

15 minutes ago, Señor Chris said:

VPNs are not ISPs - you connect to a VPN through an ISP.  Your current ISP allocates your IP address so will always know where you are but will not be able to read what is sent due to encryption by the VPN.

 The VPN firm can still read all the traffic as it’s only encrypted to them.  Your only hiding it from one firm to another firm, which by the very nature of selling VPN for dodgy practises is probably dodgy or a government anyhow!

 

VPN’s are mainly used for getting two networks together, like your PC to your work network, that’s not what I’m on about here of course,  but the firms that sell you a VPN for internet use for looking like your in another country.   Your machine leaks so much when browsing and using that a lot of VPN software don’t “hide” you or your browsing habits.

 

Edited October 7, 2018 by Robbo

[Señor Chris]

10 minutes ago, Robbo said:

 The VPN firm can still read all the traffic as it’s only encrypted to them.

And then forwards it to the mail system so that it appears to have come from the vpn - not the actual sender.

 

[Robbo]

 

34 minutes ago, Señor Chris said:

 

Which is why VPN servers are located in countries where they are not required to keep logs. They couldn't provide that information even if they wanted to.

 

Your just trusting the firm that they do that.  The firm could be the ones your trying to hide your data from where they are actually monitoring you more!

4 minutes ago, Señor Chris said:

And then forwards it to the mail system so that it appears to have come from the vpn - not the actual sender.

 

Depends how the email is sent, if you knew what you were doing yes, but if you didn’t you would probably just make mistakes.

Edited October 7, 2018 by Robbo

[Señor Chris]

14 minutes ago, Robbo said:

Your just trusting the firm that they do that.

No more than you're trusting your ISP, your operating system supplier, your computer manufacturer - all of whom could be monitoring everything you do.

 

Edited October 7, 2018 by Señor Chris

[rusty69]

Yay, we are in agreement. If your doing anything dodgy, don't trust :-

 

ISP, VPN,MSN,IBM,GCHQ,FBI,CIA,DEA,FSB,MSS,TOR,NHS,or BOB.

Edited October 7, 2018 by rusty69

[Robbo]

Just now, Señor Chris said:

No more than you're trusting your ISP, your operating system supplier, your computer manufacturer - all of whom could me monitoring everything you do.

 

Exactly!    But if the authorities want to monitor you doing dodgy stuff on the Internet then providing a product to do that so can monitor you more.   Do you really believe that certain governments wouldn’t do that?