C&RT Seize Pensioners Boat 27th March

[Alan de Enfield]

From the NBTA (who else ?)

Canal & River Trust seized the boat of a 67 year old pensioner on 27th March 2018, leaving the man and his dog homeless. The charity towed the man’s home away from the River Lea in East London. The boat is likely to be destroyed.

Canal & River Trust is currently attempting to re-brand itself as an organisation promoting well-being. However this incident demonstrates the charity’s total failure to safeguard the well-being of vulnerable boat dwellers. In contrast, the boating community in London have rallied round to lend another boat for the evicted pensioner to stay on temporarily; found storage space for his tools; and started an online appeal to buy him another boat which has raised £1,600 so far.

The appeal to buy Tony a replacement boat is online here:

https://www.youcaring.com/slowtony-1146108

The evicted boater, known as ‘Slow Tony’, is described as a “mechanical wizard” who has helped many other boaters with repairs and maintenance. His own boat required alterations to pass the Boat Safety Scheme examination in order to renew the licence. He was trying to earn the money to pay for the examination and alterations by working on other people’s boats. He did not manage to earn the required sum quickly enough to prevent the charity seizing his home.

“It is appalling that a vulnerable pensioner, who should be retired, was put in a position where he has to go out to work to try to avoid being evicted, and that he was made homeless despite trying very hard to avoid his boat being taken” said Pamela Smith, Chair of the National Bargee Travellers Association (NBTA). “The conduct of Canal & River Trust’s enforcement staff is a disgrace” she continued.

What is not widely published is that he had neither BSSC, Insurance or a licence, he had been notified several times that his boat would be seized but he had made no efforts to comply.

 

Is this another case of the NBTA stirring the pot, or is this the new 'caring wellbeing trust' in action ?

Edited April 1, 2018 by Alan de Enfield

[Boater Sam]

No sympathy at all, and I mean me not CRT.

We all must play by the rules, there are ways he could of gained help to make his boat legal. Taking no action is not the way.

If he lived on land it would be exactly the same, pay no rent, get evicted. Besides, the council now have the obligation to find him accommodation, I'll wager that it will be better than his boat.

[Naughty Cal]

It's just another chance for them to have a dig at CRT. 

This guy was in the wrong and had his boat taken away. Big deal. He knew the consequences yet still chose to not licence, test or insure his boat. He only has himself to blame.

I'm not sure how crowd funding him another boat will help as he will just end up in the same situation again in 18 months or so.

[PD1964]

27 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

The evicted boater, known as ‘Slow Tony’, is described as a “mechanical wizard” who has helped many other boaters with repairs and maintenance. His own boat required alterations to pass the Boat Safety Scheme examination in order to renew the licence. He was trying to earn the money to pay for the examination and alterations by working on other people’s boats. He did not manage to earn the required sum quickly enough to prevent the charity seizing his home

Obviously not that much of a mechanical wizard looking at his boat, why didn't all the people he had helped with repairs and maintenance not help him with his boat? Or were they similar boaters with similar boats also not paying their way and with no money to pay him for his work? as I find this the normal case with boaters and boats on this type.

Edited April 1, 2018 by PD1964

[Alan de Enfield]

Interestingly NBTA go onto say :

In 2014, the NBTA started a campaign to prevent Canal & River Trust evicting disabled, elderly and vulnerable boat dwellers and meet its Equality Act obligations not to discriminate against people on the grounds of disability, age, pregnancy and other grounds. Discrimination includes setting conditions that people cannot comply with due to their old age, disability or other “protected characteristics”.

They presumably are suggesting that conditions (such as BSSC, Insurance and a Licence) are not applicable if people cannot comply due to old age !!

 

How would that work if a 90 year old has a BSSC, insurance and licences his boat, whilst another doesn't ?

That smacks of rank stupidity and would open the flood gates for hundreds of boaters saying they are 'old'.

Maybe the NBTA should go back to their roots :

 

[Athy]

I too find the language of the article gratuitously emotive.  In what sense was he "vulnerable"? he seems to have been able to work, and is probably in receipt of a State Pension also. I don't like to see anyone* made homeless but it rather appears that Tony has brought his misfortunes upon himself.

 

* well, with a few exceptions: Rupert Murdoch, Michael Gove, the manager of the team who beat my team yesterday, you get the idea.

[LadyG]

29 minutes ago, Boater Sam said:

No sympathy at all, and I mean me not CRT.

We all must play by the rules, there are ways he could of gained help to make his boat legal. Taking no action is not the way.

If he lived on land it would be exactly the same, pay no rent, get evicted. Besides, the council now have the obligation to find him accommodation, I'll wager that it will be better than his boat.

But do the Council have an obligation to house him?  There are loads of unfortunates who sleep rough: the Council, as far as I am aware do not consider they have a legal obligation to house single people.  

He may not have been able to cope with things, we don't know the story,  it looks bad for the CRT, but then they are not a housing charity.

[Naughty Cal]

2 minutes ago, LadyG said:

But do the Council have an obligation to house him?  There are loads of unfortunates who sleep rough: the Council, as far as I am aware do not consider they have a legal obligation to house single people.  

He may not have been able to cope with things, we don't know the story,  it looks bad for the CRT, but then they are not a housing charity.

What does look bad for CRT is doing nothing about unlicensed and uninsured boats.

Cases like this send out a clear message that you will lose your boat if you choose not to licence or insure it. 

[Alan de Enfield]

9 minutes ago, Athy said:

  In what sense was he "vulnerable"? 

Isn't everyone who lives in/on a boat 'vulnerable' ?

[Athy]

Just now, Alan de Enfield said:

Isn't everyone who lives in/on a boat 'vulnerable' ?

Surely you're thinking of "certiifiable".

[matty40s]

3 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Isn't everyone who lives in/on a boat 'vulnerable' ?

Yes, every time I get off it.

[LadyG]

5 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

What does look bad for CRT is doing nothing about unlicensed and uninsured boats.

Cases like this send out a clear message that you will lose your boat if you choose not to licence or insure it. 

Of course you are correct, but the general public who read the daily rag have no understanding of the issues, all they see are the remnants of some old guy's life possesions out on the street.

The CRT should be proactive with these journalists and make sure that the story carries a few comments which justify their actions. That is what large businesses do, else they would be dragged thru the hedge backwards on a daily basis. 

Edited April 1, 2018 by LadyG

[Alan de Enfield]

Just now, Athy said:

Surely you're thinking of "certiifiable".

Yes - that as well.

 

[LadyG]

9 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

What does look bad for CRT is doing nothing about unlicensed and uninsured boats.

Cases like this send out a clear message that you will lose your boat if you choose not to licence or insure it. 

Yes, a message for boaters, but not for the General Public who buy the newspaper. How is re branding and wellness going to mix with eviction photos?

Edited April 1, 2018 by LadyG

[Alan de Enfield]

5 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Yes, a message for boaters, but not for the General Public who buy the newspaper. How is re branding and wellness going to mix with eviction photos?

Maybe those pictures are better than the potential pictures when his boat explodes killing the boaters of the 3 or 4 boats around him.

As a 'known tinkerer' who knows what the condition of the boat systems is likely to be - he obviously knew it was a BSSC failure anyway.

[haggis]

What surprised me when I read the story on FB was how all his neighbours were up in arms what what the bad C & RT had done to wonderful Tony and how everyone should chip in and help buy him another boat then it came out that these same people had known that Tony had had warning notices etc and had ignored them. Why did they not all chip in then and help the guy? 

Haggis

[Tumshie]

38 minutes ago, LadyG said:

but not for the General Public who buy the newspaper.

I don't know if the story got into the papers, it may have - but the OP looks like a blog post from the NBTA website.

While I do feel for the gentleman's situation I can't help but think if the NBTA community had really cared about him, rather than the drama of the situation, then they would have helped him keep his boat rather than weaponise his predicament.

Sorry Haggis, I didn't see your post before I posted.

Edited April 1, 2018 by Tumshie

[haggis]

5 minutes ago, Tumshie said:

 

Sorry Haggis, I didn't see your post before I posted.

No problem. Great minds and all that :-) 

haggis

[Naughty Cal]

18 minutes ago, haggis said:

What surprised me when I read the story on FB was how all his neighbours were up in arms what what the bad C & RT had done to wonderful Tony and how everyone should chip in and help buy him another boat then it came out that these same people had known that Tony had had warning notices etc and had ignored them. Why did they not all chip in then and help the guy? 

Haggis

More to the point why did this guy let his boat get to the state where it would fail a safety test?

[Bee]

Oh Dear. That describes that feeling that I get when I feel obliged to take the side of someone who I really would not like to have living near me. The bloke has probably been 'just about managing' to feed and clothe himself for ages, he has probably been only one step from homelessness for years, the state of the boat looks awful, the living conditions not much better than a cardboard box and now he loses even that and is presumably on the streets. Well that's better for everybody innit? No doubt all of us capable, sensible folks have all the right paperwork and we don't suffer from too much confusion and can remember to do all the necessary stuff, - he obviously can't. I know CRT have their responsibilities and that doesn't include sorting out the lives of the inadequate or just plain hopeless but if social services can provide ramps for disabled and help with living surely someone could have got in touch and prevented this. It hasn't solved anything except making the canal a bit neater when the boat is crushed.

[haggis]

2 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

More to the point why did this guy let his boat get to the state where it would fail a safety test?

Exactly! he had apparently lived on a boat for many years so he can't say he was ignorant of the BSS etc. Just looking at the stuff beside his boat, that didn't all come out of a boat! He was not living on his boat, he was living on his boat and the towpath. 

haggis

[haggis]

6 minutes ago, Bee said:

Oh Dear. That describes that feeling that I get when I feel obliged to take the side of someone who I really would not like to have living near me. The bloke has probably been 'just about managing' to feed and clothe himself for ages, he has probably been only one step from homelessness for years, the state of the boat looks awful, the living conditions not much better than a cardboard box and now he loses even that and is presumably on the streets. Well that's better for everybody innit? No doubt all of us capable, sensible folks have all the right paperwork and we don't suffer from too much confusion and can remember to do all the necessary stuff, - he obviously can't. I know CRT have their responsibilities and that doesn't include sorting out the lives of the inadequate or just plain hopeless but if social services can provide ramps for disabled and help with living surely someone could have got in touch and prevented this. It hasn't solved anything except making the canal a bit neater when the boat is crushed.

I think if he had been just about managing to feed and clothe himself  that would have been said by his neighbours who posted on FB. I got the impression that he was so busy fixing other folks boats that he didn't have time to fix his own so that it would pass the BSS. To me his neighbours who obviously knew the guy well had chosen not to help him despite the fact that he was helping them. It is sad that he was made homeless but I think his "friends" could and should have help prevent it

haggis

[Alan de Enfield]

13 minutes ago, Bee said:

Oh Dear. That describes that feeling that I get when I feel obliged to take the side of someone who I really would not like to have living near me. The bloke has probably been 'just about managing' to feed and clothe himself for ages, he has probably been only one step from homelessness for years, the state of the boat looks awful, the living conditions not much better than a cardboard box and now he loses even that and is presumably on the streets. Well that's better for everybody innit? No doubt all of us capable, sensible folks have all the right paperwork and we don't suffer from too much confusion and can remember to do all the necessary stuff, - he obviously can't. I know CRT have their responsibilities and that doesn't include sorting out the lives of the inadequate or just plain hopeless but if social services can provide ramps for disabled and help with living surely someone could have got in touch and prevented this. It hasn't solved anything except making the canal a bit neater when the boat is crushed.

C&RT have appointed staff in 'London area' whose role it is to help those 'just about managing' to get help and support - NBTA are fully aware of this (and if I remember correctly claimed that it was because of their interventions that C&RT implemented this) and could have helped him out earlier, but that wouldn't have made such a good story would it ?

[Athy]

6 minutes ago, haggis said:

 I got the impression that he was so busy fixing other folks boats that he didn't have time to fix his own.

A very common syndrome. In our village there's a chap who is a busy and respected builder. His own house looks as if bits are about to drop off it most of the time.

[PD1964]

1 hour ago, PD1964 said:

Obviously not that much of a mechanical wizard looking at his boat, why didn't all the people he had helped with repairs and maintenance not help him with his boat? Or were they similar boaters with similar boats also not paying their way and with no money to pay him for his work? as I find this the normal case with boaters and boats on this type.

 

45 minutes ago, haggis said:

What surprised me when I read the story on FB was how all his neighbours were up in arms what what the bad C & RT had done to wonderful Tony and how everyone should chip in and help buy him another boat then it came out that these same people had known that Tony had had warning notices etc and had ignored them. Why did they not all chip in then and help the guy? 

Haggis

Because boaters and boats like this tend to herd together and if you pardon the pun "tend to be in the same boat" with little money and little respect of the canals and CaRT with regards to license, BSS and insurance. Somehow they think the rules don't apply to them, especially when payment is involved.

Edited April 1, 2018 by PD1964