A sad day at yelvertoft Marina

[Athy]

3 minutes ago, Jerra said:

 in the old days there was sawn upping

I am not a fan of swans, but that sounds unduly drastic.

[Jerra]

1 minute ago, Athy said:

I am not a fan of swans, but that sounds unduly drastic.

LOL   To quote corpral Jones "They don't like it up em"

 

It is what the catching and marking was called.   Ipresume the root derivation was something like "taking up".

[Athy]

33 minutes ago, Jerra said:

LOL   To quote corpral Jones "They don't like it up em"

 

It is what the catching and marking was called.   Ipresume the root derivation was something like "taking up".

Yes - although it was really your typo to which I was alluding.

[Jerra]

1 hour ago, Athy said:

Yes - although it was really your typo to which I was alluding.

LOL Even on second reading I hadn't spotted that!!!

[Nightwatch]

Swan upping still takes place, on  the Thames anyway.

 

Edited July 27, 2019 by Nightwatch

[Jerra]

6 minutes ago, Nightwatch said:

Swan upping still takes place, on  the Thames anyway.

 

I suspect for the pagentry rather than any practical purpose.   Interesting to hear though.

 

EDIT:  To add it has then been taking place on the Thames since around 1500 if not earlier.

Edited July 27, 2019 by Jerra

[Nightwatch]

9 minutes ago, Jerra said:

I suspect for the pagentry rather than any practical purpose.   Interesting to hear though.

 

EDIT:  To add it has then been taking place on the Thames since around 1500 if not earlier.

I guess so. As you touched on, they dress accordingly, well the head 'upper' does. I do think it's a bit of a stock taking exercise, Queen Swans etc. Certainly traditional. That's all I know. It may also be completely inaccurate. But it's what I have believed for years.https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swan_Upping

Edited July 27, 2019 by Nightwatch

[dor]

3 hours ago, Jerra said:

People catch and ring swans and in the old days there was sawn upping (I don't know if the event is still marked anywhere) when swans were caught and marked on the beak with the owners mark (contrary to popular opinion they didn't all belong to the crown).  If the myth were true there would be lots of folk getting arms broken.

Today's bit of useless information:

Around the country there are pubs called "The swan with two necks"  which comes from mistaking the real expression which is "swan with two nicks".  The nicks being small cuts on the beak to identify the owner, carried out during upping (and done with a knife not a saw...).

[Jerra]

37 minutes ago, Nightwatch said:

I guess so. As you touched on, they dress accordingly, well the head 'upper' does. I do think it's a bit of a stock taking exercise, Queen Swans etc. Certainly traditional. That's all I know. It may also be completely inaccurate. But it's what I have believed for years.https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swan_Upping

Certainly the monarch owning the unmarked swans would be the case in the past.  Hence the existance of "Swan Rolls".  Cetrinaly NE Ticehurst in his book "The Mute Swan in England - Its history and the ancient custom of Swan-Keeping" (1957) has examples from 67 rolls with many beak marks and owners.

 

I obtained it secondhand and inside the cover is a colour photo cut out from a magazine which shows roawing boats with crews in white trousers, red jumpers and standards with E11R on the boats.  Which suggests that even years ago it was purely pageant.

16 minutes ago, dor said:

Today's bit of useless information:

Around the country there are pubs called "The swan with two necks"  which comes from mistaking the real expression which is "swan with two nicks".  The nicks being small cuts on the beak to identify the owner, carried out during upping (and done with a knife not a saw...).

Very probably the case.  You spotted my typo as well!!  Two nicks would be a very early mark the book I mention above shows many marks much more complicated and dating to the late 1490s.

[tree monkey]

Was the upping a sort of stock control thing then and if so I presume swan were eaten regularly 

[Jerra]

5 minutes ago, tree monkey said:

Was the upping a sort of stock control thing then and if so I presume swan were eaten regularly 

As in the early days the nirds were pinioned (part of one wing removed) and so couldn't fly it would be for the purpose oof ensuring  this years "stock" didn't get chased out of the territory by their parents as would happen in nature.

 

So yes a form of stock control and marking ownership.

[cuthound]

27 minutes ago, Jerra said:

As in the early days the nirds were pinioned (part of one wing removed) and so couldn't fly it would be for the purpose oof ensuring  this years "stock" didn't get chased out of the territory by their parents as would happen in nature.

 

So yes a form of stock control and marking ownership.

 

I thought that nirds (nerds?) only came into being with computers? ?

[tree monkey]

35 minutes ago, Jerra said:

As in the early days the nirds were pinioned (part of one wing removed) and so couldn't fly it would be for the purpose oof ensuring  this years "stock" didn't get chased out of the territory by their parents as would happen in nature.

 

So yes a form of stock control and marking ownership.

I hadn't considered that before, I knew about upping but never thought about the reasons why, ta

Mxd reviews about swan meat but greasy and tough comes up a lot, so maybe the nobs can keep it

[Jerra]

27 minutes ago, cuthound said:

 

I thought that nirds (nerds?) only came into being with computers? ?

ROFLMAO   I am making some tremendous typos today.

[Athy]

2 hours ago, tree monkey said:

 I presume swan were eaten regularly 

Didn't you see the reference above to "swan rolls"?

[tree monkey]

46 minutes ago, Athy said:

Didn't you see the reference above to "swan rolls"?

Is that a bit like arctic rolls?

[Athy]

27 minutes ago, tree monkey said:

Is that a bit like arctic rolls?

No, arctics bend in the middle.

(I have actually seen a boat called 'Antartic'!)

Edited July 27, 2019 by Athy

[Mike Todd]

3 hours ago, dor said:

Today's bit of useless information:

Around the country there are pubs called "The swan with two necks"  which comes from mistaking the real expression which is "swan with two nicks".  The nicks being small cuts on the beak to identify the owner, carried out during upping (and done with a knife not a saw...).

As mentioned recently in another thread re Bridgewater at Little Bollington

[Mac of Cygnet]

6 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

As mentioned recently in another thread re Bridgewater at Little Bollington

Except that one uses the correct version.

[Mike Todd]

22 minutes ago, Mac of Cygnet said:

Except that one uses the correct version.

That;s what I meant.

[dor]

2 hours ago, Mac of Cygnet said:

Except that one uses the correct version.

There used to be a 'Necks' one in Nantwich, now an Italian restaurant.  There was one in Newbury once as well, probably long gone.

[Nightwatch]

There was one in Chorley. Closed last time I was there. Near Astley Park entrance on the way to Chorley Bottoms.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Nightwatch said:

There was one in Chorley. Closed last time I was there. Near Astley Park entrance on the way to Chorley Bottoms.

Dunno if it still exists,but there was a pub either in or close to Chorley called the "Sea View." Can't imagine the sea was visible!

Swans from yesterday have spent a lot of time trying to remove a rubbing strake today. Not sure why they need it, but they have their work cut out. Hope they don't invoice me.

Edited July 27, 2019 by Guest

[Jerra]

In the long gone by there was a "pub" at Thornthwaite (beside Bassenthwaite lake the only lake in the lake district) called the Swan with two necks now it is an Hotel simply called The Swan.

[Nightwatch]

I

2 hours ago, Jerra said:

In the long gone by there was a "pub" at Thornthwaite (beside Bassenthwaite lake the only lake in the lake district) called the Swan with two necks now it is an Hotel simply called The Swan.

Lots of Thwaites there. My mums maiden name was Thistlethwaite.