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UPDATE ON LICENSING PROCESS FOR BOATS WITHOUT HOME MOORINGS

Laurence Hogg

By Laurence Hogg
in General Boating

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Murflynn Veteran

Murflynn

Posted
Posted

 

 

 

 

Is it not that the 'sudden' influx of boaters into the London area in particular has made CaRT more aware of the problems - in particular those of waste and sanitation problems. An outbreak of cholera in the future is not too far fetched to contemplate - and then 'the government' will come down with a heavy hand.

CaRT have to be seen to do something....

I blame the immigrants

 

.................. and the Archbish has given me a pardon in advance for saying that.

 

.....................

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bassplayer Influencer

bassplayer

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Posted

I've obviously misunderstood. What rights do we need to fight for that we are in danger of losing?

No you haven't misunderstood, you have just put words in my mouth.

 

Rights need to be earnt through respect. So just as hogging a prime mooring is disrespecful, so is making up rules just to benefit the 'elite'.

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Loafer Veteran

Loafer

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I find constructive counter points more helpful.

 

I don't. There aren't really any counter arguments to CRTs long-running (and BW before them) terms and conditions, are there?

 

Unless you just want to stay somewhere for a long time and make a rule for yourself?

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MtB Veteran II

MtBDonate to Canal World

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Lol...seems you can't even be bothered to read my last post.

 

Do you actually have any opinions yourself other than get fed up when you don't get your own way?

 

 

I dunno why you can;t just tell readers of the thread which rights we are in danger of losing, rather than all this puffing and windbagging.

 

Well I do actually. There aren't any!

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bassplayer Influencer

bassplayer

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I dunno why you can;t just tell readers of the thread which rights we are in danger of losing, rather than all this puffing and windbagging.

 

Well I do actually. There aren't any!

...and I said a while back we will have to wait and see. If you are right then all well and good. If not, you won't be able travel around the system like you can now due to sections being shut down due to no maintenence.

 

If you like, it's the right to roam the system we might lose.

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MtB Veteran II

MtBDonate to Canal World

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Posted

...and I said a while back we will have to wait and see. If you are right then all well and good. If not, you won't be able travel around the system like you can now due to sections being shut down due to no maintenence.

 

If you like, it's the right to roam the system we might lose.

 

 

Well done! That wasn't so difficult after all, was it?!

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MtB Veteran II

MtBDonate to Canal World

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Yes, but I have a difficulty with the word 'rights' in the first place. What are rights really?

 

 

Hmmm, now that's actually quite a difficult one. I think a 'right' is a rather arbitrary human construction. A matter of law, made up by the humans. Maybe Nigel Moore would help us out here...

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bassplayer Influencer

bassplayer

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Posted

 

 

Hmmm, now that's actually quite a difficult one. I think a 'right' is a rather arbitrary human construction. A matter of law, made up by the humans. Maybe Nigel Moore would help us out here...

In stoneage times it was very simple. The bloke with the biggest club got his way. Then it got complicated.

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OldGoat Veteran II

OldGoatDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted
bassplayer, on 11 Mar 2016 - 6:41 PM, said:

...and I said a while back we will have to wait and see. If you are right then all well and good. If not, you won't be able travel around the system like you can now due to sections being shut down due to no maintenence.

 

If you like, it's the right to roam the system we might lose.

 

That's a good start!

 

When we started boating there were few CCers and some CMers. I suspect many of them tries to take care / be careful of their immediate environment and managed 'whatever' accordingly. When they moved their pitch, they tidied up and you wouldn't know they'd been there (apart from some worn patches.

 

The pressure on living costs have forced some folks to take to the water just to find anywhere to live. Most don't have any clue about living on a boat or anywhere that there aren't any services - or what to do when there aren't.

Current mores are @me, me, me and *** Authority - sometimes that's quite understandable, but it's still antisocial.

 

The result is that we won't cruise to London anymore. On the Oxford canal - our local - many / most of the space immediately below / above a lock is taken up by residents - in some cases a boat is left on an easy mooring, unoccupied, until the owner comes back 'next month' to carry on boating. It's common for the lead boat to moor up tight to the rear lock landing bollard. That makes it more of a challenge to work the lock. In time this will put off hirers and other boaters using the canal system.

 

So there's a risk of less boats cruising - which creates a visual pleasure for walkers, fishermen. and others.

CaRT with its charitable status needs to attract the public's use to the system in order to justify its grant. If the system becomes a stinking empty ditch.

 

So for a start CaRT need to keep the system flowing and used by boats moving around. An early step is to stop folks abusing the rules.

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dogless Rising Star

dogless

Posted
Posted

As I understand it, the majority of the system is around 200 years old.

There's the odd rough bit but we still manage to navigate, if slowly.

For the most part, in my experience, the system works well.

And I have certainly been held up in the last few months by somebody carrying out repairs and maintenance.

Nothing in life is simple and clear cut, but is there really the need for so much doom and gloom ?

Rog

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bassplayer Influencer

bassplayer

Posted
Posted

 

That's a good start!

 

When we started boating there were few CCers and some CMers. I suspect many of them tries to take care / be careful of their immediate environment and managed 'whatever' accordingly. When they moved their pitch, they tidied up and you wouldn't know they'd been there (apart from some worn patches.

 

The pressure on living costs have forced some folks to take to the water just to find anywhere to live. Most don't have any clue about living on a boat or anywhere that there aren't any services - or what to do when there aren't.

Current mores are @me, me, me and *** Authority - sometimes that's quite understandable, but it's still antisocial.

 

The result is that we won't cruise to London anymore. On the Oxford canal - our local - many / most of the space immediately below / above a lock is taken up by residents - in some cases a boat is left on an easy mooring, unoccupied, until the owner comes back 'next month' to carry on boating. It's common for the lead boat to moor up tight to the rear lock landing bollard. That makes it more of a challenge to work the lock. In time this will put off hirers and other boaters using the canal system.

 

So there's a risk of less boats cruising - which creates a visual pleasure for walkers, fishermen. and others.

CaRT with its charitable status needs to attract the public's use to the system in order to justify its grant. If the system becomes a stinking empty ditch.

 

So for a start CaRT need to keep the system flowing and used by boats moving around. An early step is to stop folks abusing the rules.

But if we push the rules too far, overuse threats of enforcement and put signs up where there isn't a need, it makes boating less attractive so people stay in their home mooring.

 

I know it's not an easy balance, but I do wonder whether there is a drive to make it deliberately unatttactive sometimes. After all there are easier ways for CRT to get funding than keep us boaters happy.

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MtB Veteran II

MtBDonate to Canal World

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Posted

...and I said a while back we will have to wait and see. If you are right then all well and good. If not, you won't be able travel around the system like you can now due to sections being shut down due to no maintenence.

 

If you like, it's the right to roam the system we might lose.

 

 

On reflection I can't imagine the right to roam the system ever being extinguished.

 

I think you are confusing the right to roam the system with the ability to roam the system. You seem to fear CRT stopping maintaining the less used bits of the system - but even if they do, the right to navigate those bit will persist even when they have degraded to a muddy pond 3" deep.

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bassplayer Influencer

bassplayer

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Posted

 

 

On reflection I can't imagine the right to roam the system ever being extinguished.

 

I think you are confusing the right to roam the system with the ability to roam the system. You seem to fear CRT stopping maintaining the less used bits of the system - but even if they do, the right to navigate those bit will persist even when they have degraded to a muddy pond 3" deep.

Well maybe if it happened it would fall back in the hands of volunteers, right?

 

There are other reasons why the system could become fragmented.

 

What if sections are sold off by CRT to the private sector for development and the rights of navigation are witheld?

 

What if more sections are handed over by CRT to local councils and they start messing about with navigation rights?

 

Both what if's of course.

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Paul C Veteran II

Paul C

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So does it then follow we have no moral or legal entitlement to navigate the system? Really??

 

Are you asking us or telling us? Because in post #62 you claimed there was a "right to roam the system". I think its worth fully understanding the legal framework under which CRT operates. I also accept your point that there's moral obligations in addition to the legal ones.

 

A start would be:

 

1962 Transport Act s.10

1968 Transport Act s.105 (1) (b )

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