questions on fibreglass boat

[Jim Riley]

so never t

 

I don't think that's how it usually happens. Generally it's a case of petrol fumes travelling to the ignition source.

So never ever transfer fuel from your spare jerry can to your fuel tank on the boat. Do it on the bank while that nice gongoozler walks past with a fag. Any slight spillage from the engine while connecting or from fiddling with the outboard engine goes in the cut not the boat. Many yoghurt pots have petrol outboards, not heard of any going BOOM recently.

[John V]

In our yard there was a couple who lived on an Ormelite cruiser (25'6" x 6'10" ) for two years while saving up for a deposit. These are fitted with hot water system as standard but no heating as such. The couple had shore electricity and used 2 tiny 1Kw oilfilled radiators for heating

.

My cruiser "Shapfell" is another Ormelite and I have used it during some pretty inclement weather although it has been retrofitted with a small Erbesplutter (This however is useless apart from a short burst before you stick your toe out of your sleeping bag in the morning....it's just too damn noisy and uses too much electrickery and anyway boiling the kettle in the morning for the first cup of tea takes most of the sting ot of the cold!!!)

So although I'm no spring chicken I have survived some cold spells on Shapfell, and with some modifications for better heating I think I could live on one.....but only on my own!!! How that couple survived for 2 years without one murdering the other I don't understand.....I don't think my wife and I could survive 2 months

Edited January 21, 2015 by John V

[floatsyourboat]

Have a greenie Floatsyourboat.

Phil

Why thank you kind sir!

[MarkHez]

I lived on a 23ft Shetland black prince, and now life on a 27ft Creighton mid cockpit. It isn't all as bad as it seems, I knocked up a genset with a honda 4.5hp stationary engine linked to a 75A alternator, this charges the batteries as quick as an inboard would for a fraction of the fuel usage. Heating is the main problem for me at the moment, gas blown worked well until it packed up (old 80's unit) so woodburner going in now. The amount of people who have told me "you can't possibly live on a cruiser" is ridiculous. Go for it and good luck!

[floatsyourboat]

Just to add ( and some people may think this is mad until they try it) don't have an engine just pull the thing along, they are so light and easy it's rediculas or you could punt it!

Past charging a mobile phone and iPad most people can do without electric so some solar and wind up lights will suffice and candles then just use a 15 liter camping water jerry can with tap attached for water no pumps needed!

Happy days

I lived on a 23ft Shetland black prince, and now life on a 27ft Creighton mid cockpit. It isn't all as bad as it seems, I knocked up a genset with a honda 4.5hp stationary engine linked to a 75A alternator, this charges the batteries as quick as an inboard would for a fraction of the fuel usage. Heating is the main problem for me at the moment, gas blown worked well until it packed up (old 80's unit) so woodburner going in now. The amount of people who have told me "you can't possibly live on a cruiser" is ridiculous. Go for it and good luck!

I would love to see how you've rigged up your charging setup is it something that could be done with a cheap genny and an alternator?

[MarkHez]

Just to add ( and some people may think this is mad until they try it) don't have an engine just pull the thing along, they are so light and easy it's rediculas or you could punt it!

Past charging a mobile phone and iPad most people can do without electric so some solar and wind up lights will suffice and candles then just use a 15 liter camping water jerry can with tap attached for water no pumps needed!

Happy days

Having had an engine failure, pulling a fibreglass boat isn't a problem.... until you come up to another boat moored on the towpath and you cant get past it. Outboard or Z-drive = no rudder.

[floatsyourboat]

Having had an engine failure, pulling a fibreglass boat isn't a problem.... until you come up to another boat moored on the towpath and you cant get past it. Outboard or Z-drive = no rudder.

I hear you but all you do is use the pole and punt past I did it with no engine from Manchester through the locks too, fair enough it's not ideal but it can be done if needs must! Edited January 21, 2015 by floatsyourboat

[Jim Batty]

The cheapest and most interesting insulation could be to visit jumble sales and charity shops and pick up stacks and stacks of old Thinsulate bobble hats, thermal socks and underwear, you should be able to get these very cheap as most folk like to buy new, especially the socks. Sleeping bags would insulate large areas, the King size ones would also be very desirable, high Togs. It's best to wash the socks first if the boats going to have heating. .

 

... or how about using a selection of those foam exercise mats cut to shape? I noticed last week stacks of very good ones for sale at knock-down prices at TK Max. I suppose you'd need to check on how flammable they are.

 

Our narrowboat is insulated with proper Thinsulate (off a role). It's not cheap. Ours is about two inches thick insulation compressed to 1 inch thick and works very well. It allows for much thinner walls ... and a bit more cabin space. It also has fantastic sound insulation qualities. Whether you want to seriously muffle the sound of canalside trains ... or play music LOUD without disturbing your neighbours.

[papercrate]

This has been a great thread for me. I just picked up a 24 foot Norman boat as well. It's almost completely gutted now and I'm refitting it in a really simple/minimal liveaboard manner. I have most ammenities at my studio so I don't need many convienances on the boat. It was previously setup with inboard motor but I've removed that and will be fibreglassing the hole in the transom where it was.

 

It was good to hear about the possibility to punt the boat along the canals, but I was also thinking about a simple motor solution. Would an electric motor be strong enough to push it along? Maybe like Minn Kota 55 Endura Max (55 lb. of thrust)? Or maybe I could even get away with a lower powered electric motor (as long as the shaft was long enough to reach beneath the hull). I like the idea of just running on electricity.

[John V]

running on electrickery is fine but the problem is always generating/storing enough of the stuff...... that's the problem

[craftycarper]

This has been a great thread for me. I just picked up a 24 foot Norman boat as well. It's almost completely gutted now and I'm refitting it in a really simple/minimal liveaboard manner. I have most ammenities at my studio so I don't need many convienances on the boat. It was previously setup with inboard motor but I've removed that and will be fibreglassing the hole in the transom where it was.

 

It was good to hear about the possibility to punt the boat along the canals, but I was also thinking about a simple motor solution. Would an electric motor be strong enough to push it along? Maybe like Minn Kota 55 Endura Max (55 lb. of thrust)? Or maybe I could even get away with a lower powered electric motor (as long as the shaft was long enough to reach beneath the hull). I like the idea of just running on electricity.

25percent off your licence for an electric propelled boat is also a great help and yes a minkota or similar would move your boat along just fine, just stay off the tidal Thames

[Naughty Cal]

25percent off your licence for an electric propelled boat is also a great help and yes a minkota or similar would move your boat along just fine, just stay off the tidal Thames

Just dont drop it in the water, they dont like that!

[Rob@BSSOffice]

So never ever transfer fuel from your spare jerry can to your fuel tank on the boat. Do it on the bank while that nice gongoozler walks past with a fag. Any slight spillage from the engine while connecting or from fiddling with the outboard engine goes in the cut not the boat.

 

 

Many yoghurt pots have petrol outboards, not heard of any going BOOM recently.

 

Good advice about re-fuelling ashore.

 

Here's one similar to yours that went wooooosh/roooar as opposed to BOOM if you need the soundscape, but based on the reports I have read, I think the people aboard were only seconds away from death. http://www.thisisoxfordshire.co.uk/news/11582204.Investigation_into_boat_blaze_near_Osney_Bridge_continues/ Smoking materials, candles or the solid fuel stove may have caused the fire.

 

But both men caught in this GRP boat fire incident died http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/9651741.Man_dies_and_another_badly_hurt_in_boat_fire/ Storage of the spare fuel was the key issue that made a serious fire a whole lot worse in this case

 

I have got other examples of small GRP cruisers with o/bs catching fire, some from solid fuel stoves.

 

However, outboard motors and fatal carbon monoxide poisoning haven't yet been mentioned but it has happened to five people in the past 20 years, using the o/b to power electrical items or charge batteries. Another 6 have died from the fumes produced by their solid fuel stoves.

 

To summarise - it can and does happen - so for the OP, advise your son to read up, understand the various risks, recognise the danger signs, act if something isn't right. Finally, install smoke and CO alarms so that if despite all his good prevention measures, if something goes wrong, he'll get out alive. It doesn't take much CO to fill a Norman cabin with enough CO to kill a human, and if fire breaks out, it's an odd on bet the boat will be an inferno in about as much time as it takes to boil an egg.

 

Wish him well with his project. I'm sure there lots of passionate Norman owners on the interweb that will offer him advice and guidance.

 

Rob

Edited January 21, 2015 by Rob@BSSOffice

[Mr Norman]

Sadly the original poster has not returned since the day they started the topic. I wonder why?? Wish I'd seen this earlier and I would have suggested a visit to our forum where I would be certain of a much more encouraging welcome.

[John V]

Sadly the original poster has not returned since the day they started the topic. I wonder why?? Wish I'd seen this earlier and I would have suggested a visit to our forum where I would be certain of a much more encouraging welcome.

 

I didn't fully understand the reason for this post.......So I went back through the whole thread to check my original impression.

With the exception of one very vocal "against", most of the posts, to my mind, were non-committal to quite positive. Most of the negatives were on the basis of "don't spend too much if you hope to get your money back on re-sale" which I would have thought fair warning for any type of boat.

[Guest]

Sadly the original poster has not returned since the day they started the topic. I wonder why?? Wish I'd seen this earlier and I would have suggested a visit to our forum where I would be certain of a much more encouraging welcome.

Rather a sweeping statement.

Quite a few have encouraged the proposed idea by the OP and made some useful suggestions especially re. safety. I don't think many have discouraged the idea. There will always be a range of opinions.

I understand and agree that a "one make" forum will have more relevant information for the OP and indeed it is a good idea to visit your forum. Why not PM the OP if you feel they can benefit from your forum?

[Mr Norman]

Simple question then! Why has the OP not come back to this?

[bizzard]

Simple question then! Why has the OP not come back to this?

Because she seldom does once she's sought the information that she wants.

 

ETA Not I don't think because she's impolite or anything but because I think she's a bit nervous and not used to forums.

Edited January 22, 2015 by bizzard

[Guest]

Simple question then! Why has the OP not come back to this?

Simple answer; ask the OP!

It is not our place to speculate as to why the OP has not added any comments (though he/she may well have returned in a "read only" capacity.)

Edited January 22, 2015 by Guest

[floatsyourboat]

 

Good advice about re-fuelling ashore.

 

Here's one similar to yours that went wooooosh/roooar as opposed to BOOM if you need the soundscape, but based on the reports I have read, I think the people aboard were only seconds away from death. http://www.thisisoxfordshire.co.uk/news/11582204.Investigation_into_boat_blaze_near_Osney_Bridge_continues/ Smoking materials, candles or the solid fuel stove may have caused the fire.

 

But both men caught in this GRP boat fire incident died http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/9651741.Man_dies_and_another_badly_hurt_in_boat_fire/ Storage of the spare fuel was the key issue that made a serious fire a whole lot worse in this case

 

I have got other examples of small GRP cruisers with o/bs catching fire, some from solid fuel stoves.

 

However, outboard motors and fatal carbon monoxide poisoning haven't yet been mentioned but it has happened to five people in the past 20 years, using the o/b to power electrical items or charge batteries. Another 6 have died from the fumes produced by their solid fuel stoves.

 

To summarise - it can and does happen - so for the OP, advise your son to read up, understand the various risks, recognise the danger signs, act if something isn't right. Finally, install smoke and CO alarms so that if despite all his good prevention measures, if something goes wrong, he'll get out alive. It doesn't take much CO to fill a Norman cabin with enough CO to kill a human, and if fire breaks out, it's an odd on bet the boat will be an inferno in about as much time as it takes to boil an egg.

 

Wish him well with his project. I'm sure there lots of passionate Norman owners on the interweb that will offer him advice and guidance.

 

Rob

how many non fibreglass boats have burnt down from badly installed wood burners Rob and how many fatal Co2 incidents?

[Phil Ambrose]

how many non fibreglass boats have burnt down from badly installed wood burners Rob and how many fatal Co2 incidents?

I'd guess more.

Phil

[Alan de Enfield]

I'd guess more.

Phil

 

Judging from the ones this company have - quite a few boats get fire damaged' each year. (both metal and plastic)

 

http://www.boatwrecks.com/power.asp

[John V]

Alan thanks for posting, it's an interesting site John

[Dar Kuma]

Buy tinfoil and camping mats for insulation and glue them in, you want tinfoil, then mat then tinfoil again and you should be done.

those mats are made from the same stuff that they make insulation.

[John V]

"Pippin" is a 17'6" Shetland, used for quick trips down the creek (40Hp 2stroke O/B) and odd inshore sea fishing trips. Originally only some tatty carpet on the hull sides and bare GRP for the cabin, I found night trips in winter for cod a bit on the chilly side. (Ok bloody miserable) When it was out of the water for antifouling last time I decided to make it a bit less spartan. After stripping out the carpet I glued double sided foil bubble wrap insulation (B&Q's finest) to the GRP and then ultra thin cheap carpet on top (the hardest bit was getting a neat trim round the windows) It doesn't look very professional (actually it looks a bit rough) . I have not had a chance to try it out for over a year now as I have only managed one trip since it was added. It has, however stopped the condensation drops that used to rain on you when you boiled the kettle for a cup of tea.