Dispute at Pillings

[Dangerous Dave]

I was chatting to a couple who moor in Pillings this morning ,they seem to think everything will be OK ,and even if the entrance does get blocked ,it will only be for a short space of time.

 

 

Were their names Paul & Christopher by any chance! lol

I was chatting to a couple who moor in Pillings this morning ,they seem to think everything will be OK ,and even if the entrance does get blocked ,it will only be for a short space of time.

 

 

Well i was talking to someone seriously in the know the other day that the closure/blocking is a cert on April 14th or thereabouts

[Pillingsmoorer]

Were their names Paul & Christopher by any chance! lol

 

 

Well i was talking to someone seriously in the know the other day that the closure/blocking is a cert on April 14th or thereabouts

Lol - "seriously in the know" but can't give you an exact date!!

[Dangerous Dave]

Lol - "seriously in the know" but can't give you an exact date!!

 

 

Perhaps a ploy to avoid swinging handbags!

[Peter X]

Let's face it, the topic has gone quiet lately because no information of note has emerged since the much-expected news that the liquidator has disclaimed the freehold back to Mr Steadman. The improving weather probably means that those intent upon getting their boats out before April 14th will gradually do so, but that won't be much of an indicator really because anyone who likes the marina itself has little to lose by hanging on until the last weekend, and the CRT have said it'll be possible to get out (one way) up to the end of May. Of course a mini-rush could develop if some popular marina in the area gets down to its last few spare spaces.

 

Both sides seem to be sticking to their position, and the CRT probably see no point in continually re-stating theirs when it hasn't changed. Meanwhile PL still seems to hope that boaters can be persuaded to blame CRT, and Mr Steadman is keeping a lower profile than Lord Lucan, not that I would see some dodgy accounting and an inability to choose a good marina manager as in any way comparable to murder/manslaughter. It's entirely possible that he's conducting off the record negotiations with CRT to try to reach a deal, I would if I were in his position, but I'm sure there is no deal agreed yet, because if there were it would be announced very quickly.

[Dangerous Dave]

Let's face it, the topic has gone quiet lately because no information of note has emerged since the much-expected news that the liquidator has disclaimed the freehold back to Mr Steadman. The improving weather probably means that those intent upon getting their boats out before April 14th will gradually do so, but that won't be much of an indicator really because anyone who likes the marina itself has little to lose by hanging on until the last weekend, and the CRT have said it'll be possible to get out (one way) up to the end of May. Of course a mini-rush could develop if some popular marina in the area gets down to its last few spare spaces.

 

Both sides seem to be sticking to their position, and the CRT probably see no point in continually re-stating theirs when it hasn't changed. Meanwhile PL still seems to hope that boaters can be persuaded to blame CRT, and Mr Steadman is keeping a lower profile than Lord Lucan, not that I would see some dodgy accounting and an inability to choose a good marina manager as in any way comparable to murder/manslaughter. It's entirely possible that he's conducting off the record negotiations with CRT to try to reach a deal, I would if I were in his position, but I'm sure there is no deal agreed yet, because if there were it would be announced very quickly.

 

 

I'm so glad that you and Paul G from the USA are on here..

 

The only two "experts"(?) that i can actually understand what you are saying..lol

[David Mack]

At tonight's open boaters meeting with Richard Parry in Leeds, both Richard and Phil Spencer spoke on the matter. They confirmed:

 

CRT are working closely with the IP to secure whatever they can of the £185k owed, but recognise that others are in front of them in the pecking order, and they may not get much back.

 

They work with boating businesses who may be in difficulty, as being heavy handed benefits nobody, particularly the innocent boaters affected. But in this case that process was unsuccessful. It took a year to get the court case heard which added to the delay and the amount owing.

 

They are still planning to block access to the marina in April if there is no NAA in place, but will allow boaters out (but not in) for another 6-7 weeks.

 

They are not currently talking to anybody about a new NAA for Pillings.

 

As a result of this business they will be requiring much more robust arrangements to be in place to ensure access payments are made (and on time) before entering into any new NAAs. This policy is now on the website.

 

CRT have to be even handed with all prospective business partners, so cannot put in place more onerous requirements for certain individuals, just because they don't like them, or due to some previous experience. But Richard did stress that in future the arrangements to ensure payments will be MUCH more robust.

Edited March 13, 2014 by David Mack

[Alan de Enfield]

At tonight's open boaters meeting with Richard Parry in Leeds, both Richard and Phil Spencer spoke on the matter. They confirmed:

 

CRT are working closely with the IP to secure whatever they can of the £185k owed, but recognise that others are in front of them in the pecking order, and they may not get much back.

 

They work with boating businesses who may be in difficulty, as being heavy handed benefits nobody, particularly the innocent boaters affected. But in this case that process was unsuccessful. It took a year to get the court case heard which added to the delay and the amount owing.

 

They are still planning to block access to the marina in April if there is no NAA in place, but will allow boaters out (but not in) for another 6-7 weeks.

 

They are not currently talking to anybody about a new NAA for Pillings.

 

As a result of this business they will be requiring much more robust arrangements to be in place to ensure access payments are made (and on time) before entering into any new NAAs. This policy is now on the website.

 

CRT have to be even handed with all prospective business partners, so cannot put in place more onerous requirements for certain individuals, just because they don't like them, or due to some previous experience. But Richard did stress that in future the arrangements to ensure payments will be MUCH more robust.

 

Its good to hear an update - but the highlighted in "red" could be read as they are prepared to deal with P Lillie / Stedman etc under standard terms.

[Grace and Favour]

Thank you for the update, David

[MtB]

 

Its good to hear an update - but the highlighted in "red" could be read as they are prepared to deal with P Lillie / Stedman etc under standard terms.

 

Sounds to me as though this is exactly their intention. I wonder how many more times CRT need to get shafted by amoral company directors before learning the lesson.

 

Why on earth should previous experience of bad faith dealings from a particular set of directors NOT mean more onerous requirements when dealing with again them are the correct course of action??

 

MtB

[gaggle]

Boaters will decide if the place can run with P Lillie in the future , after all that has and is going on with the marina it is hard to believe anyone would risk dealing with him , but people are strange.

[MtB]

Boaters will decide if the place can run with P Lillie in the future , after all that has and is going on with the marina it is hard to believe anyone would risk dealing with him , but people are strange.

 

 

I think you mean gullible.

 

 

MtB

[John Holden]

 

Its good to hear an update - but the highlighted in "red" could be read as they are prepared to deal with P Lillie / Stedman etc under standard terms.

 

I think you should have highlighted "But Richard did stress that in future the arrangements to ensure payments will be MUCH more robust." as well, as that implies that they are not prepared to be quite so easily shafted in future.

[Nightwatch]

Perhaps Mr Steadman has promised to make a donation ,privately, to a charity!

 

Martyn

[Alan de Enfield]

 

I think you should have highlighted "But Richard did stress that in future the arrangements to ensure payments will be MUCH more robust." as well, as that implies that they are not prepared to be quite so easily shafted in future.

 

If they had actually applied the existing payment 'rules' (ie pay 4 months in advance) they would never have got into this 'state'

 

QMP signed up to do this - BW / C&RT Finance Director should have implemented action immediately the payment did not arrive instead of waiting 3 (or is it 4) years before taking action.

 

What evidence do we have that C&RT will now actually apply the conditions they are getting their customers signed up to

[David Mack]

 

I think you should have highlighted "But Richard did stress that in future the arrangements to ensure payments will be MUCH more robust." as well, as that implies that they are not prepared to be quite so easily shafted in future.

That was very much the impression they wanted to give. They chose their words carefully but it was pretty obvious that they are aware or the risks of doing another deal with Lillie and Steadman.

[haggis]

I think it is interesting that CRT are not currently talking to anyone about a new NAA for Pillings. Letting PL and Steadman stew for a bit perhaps?

 

haggis

[Graham Davis]

But didn't Lillie Jnr recently state he was already in discussions?

[Phantasm]

But didn't Lillie Jnr recently state he was already in discussions?

Since when has it been advisable to believe anything that he utters? I never did.

[MtB]

But didn't Lillie Jnr recently state he was already in discussions?

 

Well one of them must be lying. Now, I wonder who it is...

 

 

MtB

[Alan de Enfield]

But didn't Lillie Jnr recently state he was already in discussions?

 

He said (and C&RT confirmed) that the 'new company' QMP2 have approached C&RT, and C&RT said they would not commence disusssions with anyone until they owned the site - which apparently will be March 20th

[Nightwatch]

Boaters will decide if the place can run with P Lillie in the future , after all that has and is going on with the marina it is hard to believe anyone would risk dealing with him , but people are strange.

Unless you know someone moored there,or know someone who knows someone who moors there, or read this forum it's unlikely the average boater won't know the history and like what they see and hear and take a mooring.

 

Martyn

[Peter X]

 

CRT have to be even handed with all prospective business partners, so cannot put in place more onerous requirements for certain individuals, just because they don't like them, or due to some previous experience. But Richard did stress that in future the arrangements to ensure payments will be MUCH more robust.

 

It's nice to hear of CRT sounding determined that they won't let a debt pile up again, but unless the liquidator or the Insolvency Service go after PL, he'll have got away with his rip-off.

Can you remember, did CRT elaborate as to why they "have to be even handed", why they "cannot" impose extra requirements for Steadman/PL/RR?

 

I'm still waiting for someone to answer the question I posed weeks ago; the debt ceases to exist when the liquidator finishes his work, but if CRT simply arbitrarily refuse to grant an NAA for the site until £215,000 is forthcoming from someone, under what law can Steadman make them? Is there perhaps something about this in the wording of the rules CRT were given when set up in 2012?

[carpet wallah]

 

Here's a date for your diaries: 31 March 2014. That's the last day that the accounts for Pillings Lock Marina Ltd, to 30/6/13, have to be filed at Companies House.

The interesting thing is that the last set of accounts show quite a healthy position - EXCEPT that they show current assets of about £1.6m a similar figure to the unsecured debt from QMP. On the face of it, that asset may largely evaporate when the IP has finished his work.

Balancing that were current creditors of about £1.2m. One could speculate that the bulk of that may be additional money put in by Mr Steadman and possibly some borrowing from NatWest, who have a mortgage debenture filed. I believe this gives the bank fairly extensive powers if they started getting twitchy about any loans or overdrafts they have extended to a client company.

It will be interesting to see what qualifying comments the accountant has appended, when the accounts appear.

Watch this space. .......

[Peter X]

Further to the above, it seems to me that in order to be "even handed", CRT must make Steadman pay up. Otherwise they've been treating all the marinas who have paid NAA fees unfairly!

[MtB]

Here's a date for your diaries: 31 March 2014. That's the last day that the accounts for Pillings Lock Marina Ltd, to 30/6/13, have to be filed at Companies House.

The interesting thing is that the last set of accounts show quite a healthy position - EXCEPT that they show current assets of about £1.6m a similar figure to the unsecured debt from QMP. On the face of it, that asset may largely evaporate when the IP has finished his work.

Balancing that were current creditors of about £1.2m. One could speculate that the bulk of that may be additional money put in by Mr Steadman and possibly some borrowing from NatWest, who have a mortgage debenture filed. I believe this gives the bank fairly extensive powers if they started getting twitchy about any loans or overdrafts they have extended to a client company.

It will be interesting to see what qualifying comments the accountant has appended, when the accounts appear.

Watch this space. .......

 

 

EXCEPT that, those accounts are as at the 30th June 2013. The £1.6m current assets were just that, on that date.

 

The accounts may well have been filed complete with qualifying comments long before QMP hit the buffers.

 

MtB