Why live afloat?

[FadeToScarlet]

I'm not sold on the fridge/cupboard space issue, I think its all down to layout. I have a whole underbench seat area totally empty that I don't need for storage, and my fridge is small but does me fine for a week.

Mind, that is just me on my own.

You've got the two-fer-one round the corner, you don't need to store that much food

 

Fridges don't necessarily have to be small- ours is domestic-under-counter sized- but we are used to turning it off in the winter and buying things as and when we need them, which is a faff and expensive.

 

You're right about layout, though- the kitchen on our old boat had more than ample storage for everything we needed, we even had space for things like tins that sat around for years before being eaten!

Edited September 4, 2013 by FadeToScarlet

[Starcoaster]

I'm not following on the two for one round the corner?

[Doodlebug]

In my opinion the OP's idea of living on a boat stems from the idea of trying to save money. Although you can buy a boat for the kind of money you are talking about you will need to sort out insulation and pretty much a full refit of the boat if you want to live in it all year round.

 

It is possible to live in a boat as a student whilst having other commitments because you get regular holidays when boat maintenance can take place but if you are working full time I have no idea how you would fit all these things in.

 

I would be quite concerned that the OP thinks it will be easy to buy a cheap boat and stay in central london moving every 14 days between a small number of moorings, thus causing even more of a problem than we have at the moment. If you are willing to move a considerable distance (Maybe from hemel hempstead to bishops stortford)then it starts to become more viable.

 

Also asking boaters who break the rules in london for their advice won't help. They will always tell you how C&RT are idiots and how they can't do anything to make sure you move but thats not the point. If I ask a drug dealer how easy it is to deal drugs they would tell me that the police are idiots and don't have a clue what they are doing. It doesn't mean its true. - I hope that analogy makes sense

 

I would advice you think carefully about the following points if you really want to do it.

 

1) Is a boat bought for £10000 going to be adequately sized / well built to be a good investment. At that price range you have very small holiday boats and larger boats that are falling to bits.

2) How is the boat insulated and how will you keep warm in winter. A badly insulated boat will drip with condensation and cost you a lot in fuel.

3) How are you going to keep C&RT happy by moving around the system a sensible amount. Are you willing to commute for up to 2 hours from some moorings to work.

4) How secure is your boat going to be. The number of stories about break ins in london are quite scary.

 

I suggest you wait until winter and then hire a holiday boat for a few weeks. Its lovely in the summer but not so easy in winter.

 

Our boat was built as a small holiday boat. We bought it because we fell in love with it and have spent a huge amount in converting it into a 'proper' liveaboard boat. When we bought it the boat was insulated with a thin layer of polystyrene and so we refitted the whole boat.

 

And its still work in progress

[junior]

In my opinion the OP's idea of living on a boat stems from the idea of trying to save money. Although you can buy a boat for the kind of money you are talking about you will need to sort out insulation and pretty much a full refit of the boat if you want to live in it all year round.

 

I've just read the OP again and it says nowhere that she's thinking about doing this to save money. It says she is fed up with paying rent towards something that will never be hers. Thats one of the many reasons i decided to buy a boat and i'm certainly not attempting to save money.

 

It is possible to live in a boat as a student whilst having other commitments because you get regular holidays when boat maintenance can take place but if you are working full time I have no idea how you would fit all these things in.

 

Weekends? I work full time and work 7 days on/7 days off. Plenty of time to do boat maintenance. None of us know the OP's shift pattern so to make assumptions would be wrong.

 

I would be quite concerned that the OP thinks it will be easy to buy a cheap boat and stay in central london moving every 14 days between a small number of moorings, thus causing even more of a problem than we have at the moment. If you are willing to move a considerable distance (Maybe from hemel hempstead to bishops stortford)then it starts to become more viable.

 

What has the cost of the boat got to do with whether she can move every 4 days? I know someone who bought a cabin cruiser for £800 and manages to move more than every 14 days.

 

Also asking boaters who break the rules in london for their advice won't help. They will always tell you how C&RT are idiots and how they can't do anything to make sure you move but thats not the point. If I ask a drug dealer how easy it is to deal drugs they would tell me that the police are idiots and don't have a clue what they are doing. It doesn't mean its true. - I hope that analogy makes sense

 

I see no mention of her speaking with people who break the rules. Plenty of people on here who are not rule breakers will tell you CaRT are idiots!

 

I would advice you think carefully about the following points if you really want to do it.

 

1) Is a boat bought for £10000 going to be adequately sized / well built to be a good investment. At that price range you have very small holiday boats and larger boats that are falling to bits.

2) How is the boat insulated and how will you keep warm in winter. A badly insulated boat will drip with condensation and cost you a lot in fuel.

3) How are you going to keep C&RT happy by moving around the system a sensible amount. Are you willing to commute for up to 2 hours from some moorings to work.

4) How secure is your boat going to be. The number of stories about break ins in london are quite scary.

 

1) Rubbish. Plenty of medium sized habitable boats around for 10-15k.

2) True

3) Hundereds of people do this every day.

4) I could count on one hand the number of stories i've seen about break ins in london in the last 2 months. In fact i've seen far more reports of break-ins on the K&A!!

 

I suggest you wait until winter and then hire a holiday boat for a few weeks. Its lovely in the summer but not so easy in winter.

 

It sounds like she has friends with boats. A week with them would be far better than chucking £1k of your budget down the drain on a hire boat that will probably be nothing like a £10k Liveaboard boat.

 

Our boat was built as a small holiday boat. We bought it because we fell in love with it and have spent a huge amount in converting it into a 'proper' liveaboard boat. When we bought it the boat was insulated with a thin layer of polystyrene and so we refitted the whole boat.

 

And its still work in progress

 

I understand why you feel the need to point these things out, but you made a hell of a lot of assumptions so i thought i'd play devils advocate.

[pquinn]

living on a boat will/can keep you relatively fit.if you dont drink or smoke to much,which is hard when you live on a boat.

as for fridges and freezers.i don't think it is worth even taking in to account if you are intending to live on a boat.prioritize.as people have said there are alternatives such as bilges,lockers etc.and how far can anybody get from a chain shop these days.when we lived in a house it happened to be across the road from what was the biggest tesco in Europe[24 hour] at the time and still people were always asking about how we lived without a freezer.

we have the same sized fridge as we had then but only started to use it since we attained shore power.it is not important unless you need it medically or something.think ahead.eat more veg.get a sound hull.good engine.warm stove.hot water.then start worrying about how to keep your peas frozen and get 700 channels on your widescreen tv. paul

[Caprifool]

Some of us would rather bake, forage, harvest, fish and shoot our food and dry, pickle, preserve, ferment or freeze it for winter. Or at least buy a box of meat for the freezer rather than go to the shops every day. Jeesh, sometimes I wonder what ever happened to good housekeeping? I would need to downsize my freezer. But couldn't do without one. Some need them, some don't :-)

Edited September 5, 2013 by Caprifool

[i love my narrowboat]

We bought a table top freezer this year after not having one for a couple of years and all we have in it is.... Prepared stewed apple for our porridge and frozen raspberries. We are in the process of having our kitchen refitted but probably won't keep the freezer

[Sade]

We have a freezer at home and it's packed with newspaper (as it's part of the integral fridge freezer) and occasionally a bag of chips and a bag of ice (during the heatwave) .....the boat we are buying has a separate fridge and freezer but we are going to replace them with a small fridge that has an icebox for when it's really hot next summer

 

it really depends what your requirements are and how you shop. Personally we always have a lot of dry products like rice and pasta and we go to our local market every few weeks and buy fresh fruit and veg from there.....the spuds last a lifetime in my dark veg cupboard so won't be a problem on the boat. If you buy things like milk in small cartons rather than the big 4 pinters then it will last longer because you don't have to keep opening it and hence having to throw 3 pints of it away. You can also think about growing your own veg ? Not sure a cow would fit on a boat but Alan Partridge may tell you different?!

[i love my narrowboat]

We have a freezer at home and it's packed with newspaper (as it's part of the integral fridge freezer) and occasionally a bag of chips and a bag of ice (during the heatwave) .....the boat we are buying has a separate fridge and freezer but we are going to replace them with a small fridge that has an icebox for when it's really hot next summer

 

it really depends what your requirements are and how you shop. Personally we always have a lot of dry products like rice and pasta and we go to our local market every few weeks and buy fresh fruit and veg from there.....the spuds last a lifetime in my dark veg cupboard so won't be a problem on the boat. If you buy things like milk in small cartons rather than the big 4 pinters then it will last longer because you don't have to keep opening it and hence having to throw 3 pints of it away. You can also think about growing your own veg ? Not sure a cow would fit on a boat but Alan Partridge may tell you different?!

Our landlord has a farm shop so no problems with lots of fresh veg etc, and the most delicious Gallones ice cream

[FadeToScarlet]

I'm not following on the two for one round the corner?

The pub (called The Boathouse I think) at Braunston that does two for one meals.

[Starcoaster]

Ah, I gave up my Braunston mooring almost a year ago! It was "two for the price of one meal that is priced at the cost of two meals" anyway!

[Doodlebug]

Doodlebug, on 04 Sept 2013 - 11:07 PM, said:

In my opinion the OP's idea of living on a boat stems from the idea of trying to save money. Although you can buy a boat for the kind of money you are talking about you will need to sort out insulation and pretty much a full refit of the boat if you want to live in it all year round.

 

I've just read the OP again and it says nowhere that she's thinking about doing this to save money. It says she is fed up with paying rent towards something that will never be hers. Thats one of the many reasons i decided to buy a boat and i'm certainly not attempting to save money.

 

It is possible to live in a boat as a student whilst having other commitments because you get regular holidays when boat maintenance can take place but if you are working full time I have no idea how you would fit all these things in.

 

Weekends? I work full time and work 7 days on/7 days off. Plenty of time to do boat maintenance. None of us know the OP's shift pattern so to make assumptions would be wrong.

 

I would be quite concerned that the OP thinks it will be easy to buy a cheap boat and stay in central london moving every 14 days between a small number of moorings, thus causing even more of a problem than we have at the moment. If you are willing to move a considerable distance (Maybe from hemel hempstead to bishops stortford)then it starts to become more viable.

 

What has the cost of the boat got to do with whether she can move every 4 days? I know someone who bought a cabin cruiser for £800 and manages to move more than every 14 days.

 

Also asking boaters who break the rules in london for their advice won't help. They will always tell you how C&RT are idiots and how they can't do anything to make sure you move but thats not the point. If I ask a drug dealer how easy it is to deal drugs they would tell me that the police are idiots and don't have a clue what they are doing. It doesn't mean its true. - I hope that analogy makes sense

 

I see no mention of her speaking with people who break the rules. Plenty of people on here who are not rule breakers will tell you CaRT are idiots!

 

I would advice you think carefully about the following points if you really want to do it.

 

1) Is a boat bought for £10000 going to be adequately sized / well built to be a good investment. At that price range you have very small holiday boats and larger boats that are falling to bits.

2) How is the boat insulated and how will you keep warm in winter. A badly insulated boat will drip with condensation and cost you a lot in fuel.

3) How are you going to keep C&RT happy by moving around the system a sensible amount. Are you willing to commute for up to 2 hours from some moorings to work.

4) How secure is your boat going to be. The number of stories about break ins in london are quite scary.

 

1) Rubbish. Plenty of medium sized habitable boats around for 10-15k.

2) True

3) Hundereds of people do this every day.

4) I could count on one hand the number of stories i've seen about break ins in london in the last 2 months. In fact i've seen far more reports of break-ins on the K&A!!

 

I suggest you wait until winter and then hire a holiday boat for a few weeks. Its lovely in the summer but not so easy in winter.

 

It sounds like she has friends with boats. A week with them would be far better than chucking £1k of your budget down the drain on a hire boat that will probably be nothing like a £10k Liveaboard boat.

 

Our boat was built as a small holiday boat. We bought it because we fell in love with it and have spent a huge amount in converting it into a 'proper' liveaboard boat. When we bought it the boat was insulated with a thin layer of polystyrene and so we refitted the whole boat.

 

And its still work in progress

I understand why you feel the need to point these things out, but you made a hell of a lot of assumptions so i thought i'd play devils advocate.

 

 

Yes I did make a few assumptions but I don't think they are that far fetched. As someone who has not had a boat it would be easy to think that it is a cheap way of living so naturally I am guessing that it will come into play somewhere in the decision, so wanted to point out it wasn't the case.

 

If you work seven days on seven days off then you have half a year every year to spend on the boat. I know that if I were working five days a week nine till five I would struggle to do the maintenance that needs doing. Especially so if I bought a cheap boat that needs things doing to it.

 

I would be very surprised if you could find a boat for 10000 that doesn't need improvements that will take time and money to do. Most boats in that price bracket are not meant for liveaboards and all the little things that make narrowboats comfy all year add up fast.

 

The reference to the cheap boat in the next paragraph is just pointing out that the answer isn't as simple as buy a cheap boat and move every 14 days. My point refers to all types of boats. I only said cheap because the OP wants a cheap boat.

 

Again I assumed that she would have spoken to people who do break the rules since there are very few people CCing in london properly. Only a handful do a substantial length of the canal. Most hop back and forth. I have spoken to quite a few london boaters and I would say that most of them push the boundaries (Note that not all of them do this) A ccer by definition can't be in london because london is too smaller area to be a CCers. I hope that makes sense.

 

In answer to the other points

 

1) As mentioned I would like to see a cheap boat is just as comfortable as a more expensive liveaboard boat. Then again my definition of comfortable may not be the same as everyone elses. I would want a warm boat that doesn't use up loads of fuel, has a good number of batteries and inverter etc etc.

 

3)I know people do this every day but its a point to consider. Can she actually do this?

 

4) I know of 4 break ins in london this month and there were 3 arson attacks on boats in london this year. I know other areas are just as bad but its still a point to consider.

 

I know you are playing devils advocate and although I made assumptions they are all things that would need to be thought of.

 

Cheers

[ditchcrawler]

Sensible question !!! Why the hell would anyone on ordinary incomes want to live and work in London? I can understand high flyers doing it, I wouldnt live there for a million pounds an hour but some seem to like it but an ordinary worker why the hell would they? Whats the point of working your chuggies off just to pay a ridiculous fee in accomodation?

 

Tim

I'm with you on that tim

[Jamm]

Sensible question !!! Why the hell would anyone on ordinary incomes want to live and work in London? I can understand high flyers doing it, I wouldnt live there for a million pounds an hour but some seem to like it but an ordinary worker why the hell would they? Whats the point of working your chuggies off just to pay a ridiculous fee in accomodation?

 

Tim

 

Because, if they didn't live and work in London, they wouldn't have "that" job. Unless you know something the rest of us don't, there is a shortage of jobs out there.

[Neil2]

I don't know anything about living in London, and probably like many on this forum the whole idea would terrify and depress me in equal measure.

 

But I have friends who live in the city and I have met many people who have lived there, and as usual the conceptions and prejudices we form from a distance are rarely born out by the facts.

 

Most folk I know that have spent time in the capital reckon you can actually live cheaper there than anywhere, if you know how. The idea that everything is off the scale, price wise, is apparently nonsense. I wouldn't last five minutes but I guess when it is "your town" it's different.

 

As for the accommodation issue;

 

There was an item recently on the radio where the mother of a potential London student complained that her daughter could not afford £10,000 a year for accommodation costs. Then several people phoned in to explain that in fact student accommodation in London is readily available at well under half that figure.

 

I don't know who's right and who's wrong, but it wouldn't be difficult to persuade an ignorant outsider such as myself that you had to pay £800 a month for a bedsit.

 

But for a "local", there are always alternatives, and it seems to me that the boat idea is certainly worth considering.

 

I think of the squalid little flat my sister rented when she got her first job. A 30 foot Springer would have been sheer luxury by comparison, and you can most definitely get a reasonable 30 footer for under £10,000 - probably not in the South though.

 

 

[junior]

I guess im bucking a trend then. I'm moving from rural Leicestershire to London and can't wait. I think it's an amazing place. I've even got a long term mooring within the tube network for £170 a month. So don't believe everything you hear about living on a boat in London.

[Erin42]

Not looking to live "cheaply" but I do think I could, averaging over two or three years, pay about the same in living costs as where I'm currently living. Friends of mine are being moved out of their shared house because the landlord wants to sell, and this is another big reason I don't want to continue renting. Regarding the "scary" number of break in stories this doesn't match with what I've heard but definitely security is one of my main concerns.

 

I've lived in a lot of odd places and been happy living in a lot of places other people might not. My idea of "comfort" might not be the same as other folks'! But I do want to be dry, and I do want to be safe, so I'm reading everyone's posts and taking in all of the varying advice

[Lady Muck]

Ive lived in London for 21 years and the longest I've managed anywhere is the boat at 7 years. I found as a renter I was forced to move every two or three years, once you get older this starts to do your head in and is even worse if you have a family.

[Captain Zim]

 

 

I know that if I were working five days a week nine till five I would struggle to do the maintenance that needs doing. Especially so if I bought a cheap boat that needs things doing to it.

 

 

4) I know of 4 break ins in london this month and there were 3 arson attacks on boats in london this year. I know other areas are just as bad but its still a point to consider.

 

 

I work 5 days 9-5 and I live on a boat 104 years old. Trust me when I say it needs a few things doing to it. It's possible so long as you like DIY.

 

Out of interest, where were the arson attacks? I heard of 3 boat fires but all were accidents. 2 for sure as one I witnessed and the other was just up the path from me. The third was not declared suspicious by the fire brigade. Or are these 3 others? Interested since I'm heading into the city soon.

[Doodlebug]

I work 5 days 9-5 and I live on a boat 104 years old. Trust me when I say it needs a few things doing to it. It's possible so long as you like DIY.

 

Out of interest, where were the arson attacks? I heard of 3 boat fires but all were accidents. 2 for sure as one I witnessed and the other was just up the path from me. The third was not declared suspicious by the fire brigade. Or are these 3 others? Interested since I'm heading into the city soon.

 

Worryingly it was central london. We were passing through to limehouse last year and there had been a fire on a boat a few days before. The fire brigade were going along the canal to remind people to have smoke alarms. I was talking to the fireman and he said there had been 5 fires in the last year he had been working there. I asked what caused them and he said 3 of them were arson. A burning object was dropped through an open window or through an open hatch.

 

I then asked where they were and he said between kings cross and paddington which I always thought was the safer of the places to be.

 

I did hear something which worried me (no idea if its true) that someone had once put a deodorant bottle down a boat chimney whilst the fire was alight. - Now that is scary.

[system 4-50]

 

Worryingly it was central london. We were passing through to limehouse last year and there had been a fire on a boat a few days before. The fire brigade were going along the canal to remind people to have smoke alarms. I was talking to the fireman and he said there had been 5 fires in the last year he had been working there. I asked what caused them and he said 3 of them were arson. A burning object was dropped through an open window or through an open hatch.

 

I then asked where they were and he said between kings cross and paddington which I always thought was the safer of the places to be.

 

I did hear something which worried me (no idea if its true) that someone had once put a deodorant bottle down a boat chimney whilst the fire was alight. - Now that is scary.

I suggest it is not good to post nasty ideas on an open forum....

Edited September 7, 2013 by system 4-50

[pquinn]

 

Worryingly it was central london. We were passing through to limehouse last year and there had been a fire on a boat a few days before. The fire brigade were going along the canal to remind people to have smoke alarms. I was talking to the fireman and he said there had been 5 fires in the last year he had been working there. I asked what caused them and he said 3 of them were arson. A burning object was dropped through an open window or through an open hatch.

 

I then asked where they were and he said between kings cross and paddington which I always thought was the safer of the places to be.

 

I did hear something which worried me (no idea if its true) that someone had once put a deodorant bottle down a boat chimney whilst the fire was alight. - Now that is scary.

a year or two ago when i was cleaning my chimney during the summer i found a beer can behind the baffle plate. paul

[Doodlebug]

I suggest it is not good to post nasty ideas on an open forum....

 

Good point :S Although I doubt a boater would do such a thing and I would hope only boaters read these threads.

[dew]

Just get yourself a boat you like, a good boat maintenance manual, pay your licence and elbow urself in. You will drive yourself nuts planning too much. Buy one from a person who is genuine and you wont go far wrong.

[Jim Batty]

 

Hi! I would introduce myself in the "new to boating" thread but I'm not actually a boater, yet...

 

For a couple of years now I've wanted to live on a narrowboat. I've lived in London all my life ..

 

I work in film/tv, but at the entry level/graduate end of the industry I earn minimum wage ...

 

If I could do something mad and fun and have the option of living in a bunch of different places as a continuous cruiser, for about the same price...

 

After four years afloat and continuously cruising and working regularly part-time (for others as well as freelance), my main recommendation would be: Live on a boat because you want to live ON A BOAT.

 

Not because it seems like a cheap alternative to some other form of living. This is because it's not like living on land, and almost invariably it's not as cheap as you think it will be.

 

One way of checking out whether you like it leads to my second recommendation: Hire a small narrowboat out-of-season (sometime before beginning of November, say, before the winter maintenance closures start to kick in ... and when hiring is cheapest) and 'pretend' you're living on it. See what it's like.

 

If you really like it and can picture yourself being on a boat and driving it through all forms of weather and taking the time to regularly ... fill up with water ... pump-out / dump waste ... keep your batteries topped up ... get dry fuel in and keep a fire going ... as well as enjoy the awesome, re-vitalising, quiet, natural beauty of being on the water ... then do it!