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Historic Boats for sale online

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4 hours ago, Split Pin said:

The location is about 100yards past Chubbs bridge towards Stourbridge, there was always a scour there as the road drains emptied into the canal at that point. Dane was owned at that time by the Parsons brothers, I thinks its Richard on the helm, Dane made the journey through the Stourbridge Canal a couple of times in the early 60's before its restoration, taking up to 2 days to do about 5 miles, I was sometimes put on the back being the lightest person to manipulate the controls whilst everyone else pulled on ropes to get it over the scours, my first experiance steering a 70 footer, At 9/10 years old some great memories.

 

Steven

Richard Parsons went off and set up hotel barges in france in 1966, and I believe cruising waterways all over Europe and further

 

Not sure which TC boats are in these photos whether Dane or Towy are there. Spey is on the bank

JN12$011.JPG

JN12$014.JPG

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11 minutes ago, max's son said:

Richard Parsons went off and set up hotel barges in france in 1966, and I believe cruising waterways all over Europe and further

 

Not sure which TC boats are in these photos whether Dane or Towy are there. Spey is on the bank

JN12$011.JPG

JN12$014.JPG

Dane isn't, As none of the boats have flat cabin sides.

 

I cant see the distance motor so unable to tell, but its none of the close motors as towy never had short hand sign writing + 1 of the distant boats dosnt have 3 bands only 2

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7 hours ago, max's son said:

Richard Parsons went off and set up hotel barges in france in 1966, and I believe cruising waterways all over Europe and further

 

Not sure which TC boats are in these photos whether Dane or Towy are there. Spey is on the bank

Great photos -thank you for posting them. I assume they are some of your dad's ? I'd love to see more, I'm sure other people would too.

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10 hours ago, John Brightley said:

Great photos -thank you for posting them. I assume they are some of your dad's ? I'd love to see more, I'm sure other people would too.

Thanks the photos are from dad's collection I have copies of the ones he scanned from his slides,

When he passed away the boxes of slides were given to Laurence Hogg sadly he has also passed away with all his knowledge,

I am unsure where these are now

 

May be with Braunston cancelled we could have a virtual event and I will post some more of dad's photos and other could also post then we all get our fix

of historical narrowboats

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8 hours ago, max's son said:

Thanks the photos are from dad's collection I have copies of the ones he scanned from his slides,

When he passed away the boxes of slides were given to Laurence Hogg sadly he has also passed away with all his knowledge,

I am unsure where these are now

 

May be with Braunston cancelled we could have a virtual event and I will post some more of dad's photos and other could also post then we all get our fix

of historical narrowboats

As long as the pictures are not of boats at the braunston gathering....that would be dull.

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Well I've enquired about dane but there isn't going to be any room for negotiation. Unfortunately the boat from pics is in a bad way. There is alot gone on sence the last sale in a bad way and you would be looking at buying just the engine that came with a near bare hull.

My low but reasonable offer to save the boat despite alot we sold it with now missing would easily be rejected unfortunately due to the bolly being in her, her future looks bleak and I can see her being stripped for her value parts rather than sold to save 😢.

I know i said I would sell towy to get her back but due to her nearly bareness it would be the wrong decision for me and towy.

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4 hours ago, billybobbooth said:

Well I've enquired about dane but there isn't going to be any room for negotiation. Unfortunately the boat from pics is in a bad way. There is alot gone on sence the last sale in a bad way and you would be looking at buying just the engine that came with a near bare hull.

My low but reasonable offer to save the boat despite alot we sold it with now missing would easily be rejected unfortunately due to the bolly being in her, her future looks bleak and I can see her being stripped for her value parts rather than sold to save 😢.

I know i said I would sell towy to get her back but due to her nearly bareness it would be the wrong decision for me and towy.

Seems like a no brainer to me - buy DANE and re-fit the Bolinder into TOWY - offset some of you costs by selling TOWY's National 2DM and asset stripping DANE - sell DANE's remains to a 'dreamer' for £1,00.

 

The result is you maintain some of your emotional attachment as you will still have DANE's Boliinder - TOWY regains some of its historical relevance - there is the opportunity for a Grand Union motor to regain a historically relevant engine and you put a smile on somebody's face by selling them a boat for £1.00.

 

Some of this is meant in jest but you can probably see where DANE's future lies :captain:

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5 minutes ago, pete harrison said:

Seems like a no brainer to me - buy DANE and re-fit the Bolinder into TOWY - offset some of you costs by selling TOWY's National 2DM and asset stripping DANE - sell DANE's remains to a 'dreamer' for £1,00.

 

The result is you maintain some of your emotional attachment as you will still have DANE's Boliinder - TOWY regains some of its historical relevance - there is the opportunity for a Grand Union motor to regain a historically relevant engine and you put a smile on somebody's face by selling them a boat for £1.00.

 

Some of this is meant in jest but you can probably see where DANE's future lies :captain:

Did some one say dreamer? 

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2 hours ago, pete harrison said:

Seems like a no brainer to me - buy DANE and re-fit the Bolinder into TOWY - offset some of you costs by selling TOWY's National 2DM and asset stripping DANE - sell DANE's remains to a 'dreamer' for £1,00.

 

The result is you maintain some of your emotional attachment as you will still have DANE's Boliinder - TOWY regains some of its historical relevance - there is the opportunity for a Grand Union motor to regain a historically relevant engine and you put a smile on somebody's face by selling them a boat for £1.00.

 

Some of this is meant in jest but you can probably see where DANE's future lies :captain:

Sell Dane’s T stud and iron work to a boat restorer ( replicator) and for 100000 plus  Dane could  be rebuilt, in steel. Not like Dane at all then but, look at the magnificence of steam boat Hasty . 

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4 minutes ago, roland elsdon said:

Sell Dane’s T stud and iron work to a boat restorer ( replicator) and for 100000 plus  Dane could  be rebuilt, in steel. Not like Dane at all then but, look at the magnificence of steam boat Hasty . 

because dane is over 100 years old, the bolly was fitted in 1929 and been in eversence. I'm not prepared to effectively cut up a boat just to get to a bolinder. Un like some would i would rather try and save a boat. I'm also not about to destroy something my dad spent years looking after. For me to be the one just cut it up.

 

As much as i would love to put the bolly in towy, as above im not prepared to destroy something just to get at an engine.

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2 hours ago, pete harrison said:

Seems like a no brainer to me - buy DANE and re-fit the Bolinder into TOWY - offset some of you costs by selling TOWY's National 2DM and asset stripping DANE - sell DANE's remains to a 'dreamer' for £1,00.

 

The result is you maintain some of your emotional attachment as you will still have DANE's Boliinder - TOWY regains some of its historical relevance - there is the opportunity for a Grand Union motor to regain a historically relevant engine and you put a smile on somebody's face by selling them a boat for £1.00.

 

Some of this is meant in jest but you can probably see where DANE's future lies :captain:

Or I could keep a 100+ boat going, there is the emotional attachment but I can see over that in that the boat is only worth the engine, i would rather sell a boat to someone who is going to save her than just strip for parts.

 

Yes I can see dane being stripped for her bolly but I'm not going to be the one to destroy a bit of history for an engine.

 

If I could get a bolly at a reasonable price not over the top price coz its a bolly I would consider putting it in towy but at the same time the national has been in her longer than the bolly was and has now been in near on 50 years making it part of towy.

 

Yes I would happly sell the national back to the owner of original boat but I'm not going to be left out of pocket or just a random engine put in her so someone can get there engine back (unless forced due to major brakedown would happly get a k1 or something or jp2 as a replacement) 

hence I wanted to look at dane but for a price to keep her as is what I'm prepared to pay given the work needed wouldnt be accepted.

Its the same as i don't agree with butties being cut in half to sell as 2 motors to make some cash and in the process destroying history.

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I agree with your principles 100% , hell I spent as much rebuilding a butty as I would have done on a motor, knowing the added value was nothing near as much, because I didn’t want it cutting up, into two motors.

But it’s different with a wooden boat. You need £££££££, and while at the end to you it’s impossible to value , to most its worth £.

The emotional cost is huge, for you. I remember seeing Dane almost every trip down Maffers, and indeed almost ran her down once in blisworth , an event the consequence of would have been appalling . Town class versus stern!.
 

Hopefully someone with the funds will make your decision for you. Both our old yarwoods boat eventually ended up in poor hands and it breaks my heart to see them . Neglected and with brasses and fittings we used being removed or unpolished. 
We had the option to buy both back, but it was too heart rending, so we concentrate on the present.

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from the pics I've seen she has been stripped of everything except the bolinder.

Cost wise I know it would cost big money hence my low offer.

I see what Pete is saying about putting the bolly in towy but I'm not going to rip apart a boat when it can still be saved, diffrent if her back was broken and splitting at every seam.

 

My heart wants to saver her as much as my head but my head knows the cost and time of repair. My head if could I would just throw every penny to get her but its not worth financially to do that or sain to do so. So I made the best decision make an offer to save her or pos watch her be broken and watch someone else have the conscious of destroying history for an engine or sold and in future pos have the chance to save her again. Dispide how hard it is. At the end I would have to then sell towy and that would be a hard choice too but I know its not wise to have 2 wooden boats and dane would always win over towy

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3 minutes ago, billybobbooth said:

from the pics I've seen she has been stripped of everything except the bolinder.

Cost wise I know it would cost big money hence my low offer.

I see what Pete is saying about putting the bolly in towy but I'm not going to rip apart a boat when it can still be saved, diffrent if her back was broken and splitting at every seam.

 

My heart wants to saver her as much as my head but my head knows the cost and time of repair. My head if could I would just throw every penny to get her but its not worth financially to do that or sain to do so. So I made the best decision make an offer to save her or pos watch her be broken and watch someone else have the conscious of destroying history for an engine or sold and in future pos have the chance to save her again. Dispide how hard it is. At the end I would have to then sell towy and that would be a hard choice too but I know its not wise to have 2 wooden boats and dane would always win over towy

As a teenager I broke up several wooden boats so that their bottoms could be used for the walls of buildings at The Black Country Museum. Perhaps I am fortunate in not being sentimental about narrow boats and I have no problem with their 'circle of life'. I like the idea of a boat that is life expired donating its parts to keep others going (as with human organ donation), but I am not meaning parts being built into modern boats to give them some perceived credibility or added value. Every boat can be rebuilt and rebuilt again, but as you say the costs can be prohibitive - and in my opinion this has been the position with wooden narrow boats for a long time, let alone finding people with the skills to maintain / rebuild them properly. Like many owners I am spending far more on my boat restoration than its end value will be, but because my boat is steel hulled it just feels like a better bet long term (but probably isn't).

 

Of course it is a great shame when any boat is broken up, but this is a part of every boats history whether today, next year or any time in the future. Things seem to have got a lot more sentimental since these boats have become pre-fixed 'historic' - but lets hope that DANE's future can be secured :captain:

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Hi,

We have recently bought Vela, last week in fact, and I have found some of the posts on this forum fascinating.  You say that Vela was the stern end, does that mean the stern we have was the original?  Having looked at several of the photos here she looks quite different.  We now seem to have a flat traditional stern rather than the one in some of the photos.  Do you know what happened to the other half?

 

She is in a bit of a state, needing a lot of work before we can live aboard with comfort.  In the meantime I will enjoy seeing the film and photos as we have yet to decide on livery.  

 

Thank you

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2 minutes ago, Sara Strawson said:

Hi,

We have recently bought Vela, last week in fact, and I have found some of the posts on this forum fascinating.  You say that Vela was the stern end, does that mean the stern we have was the original?  Having looked at several of the photos here she looks quite different.  We now seem to have a flat traditional stern rather than the one in some of the photos.  Do you know what happened to the other half?

 

She is in a bit of a state, needing a lot of work before we can live aboard with comfort.  In the meantime I will enjoy seeing the film and photos as we have yet to decide on livery.  

 

Thank you

If your boat has a transom (flat) stern but is the stern end of the original boat, it is highly likely that it is going backwards, ie your bow is the stern of the original boat turned round.

 

Hope that makes sense!

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Hi Sara. 

Yep, you have the stern end, so your bow is the original butty stern going backwards. The other half still exists as a motor, with the original bow. There are numerous photos of her working, probably the best well known is in the bottom lock of the Derby Canal when it had been closed to traffic.

 

Good luck with your project

 

Kind regards

 

Dan

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20 minutes ago, Sara Strawson said:

Hi,

We have recently bought Vela, last week in fact, and I have found some of the posts on this forum fascinating.  You say that Vela was the stern end, does that mean the stern we have was the original?  Having looked at several of the photos here she looks quite different.  We now seem to have a flat traditional stern rather than the one in some of the photos.  Do you know what happened to the other half?

 

She is in a bit of a state, needing a lot of work before we can live aboard with comfort.  In the meantime I will enjoy seeing the film and photos as we have yet to decide on livery.  

 

Thank you

VELA was built as a 71'6'' unpowered small Woolwich butty, i.e. it was designed to be towed behind a powered boat or motor. Once out of trade VELA was cut in two, with each end rebuilt into pleasure boats - the original fore end being used as a fore end and the original stern also used as a fore end, and both fitted with conventional counter sterns. The boat you have bought is the original stern being used as a fore end.

 

Do you know much about these old working boats :captain:

 

edit - the photographs on Ebay when VELA was for sale a few weeks ago showed it having a welded conventional counter stern rather than a 'flat traditional stern'. I am sure there is some confusion in the terms you / we are using - and congratulations on your acquisition. 

 

 

Edited by pete harrison

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That is amazing, thank you.  

 

Although there is a huge amount of work to do, we are really excited to find so much information about her on this site.  Photos and film, as well as information about the Idle Women.  I will thoroughly enjoy researching and finding out more about her.

 

6 minutes ago, pete harrison said:

VELA was built as a 71'6'' unpowered small Woolwich butty, i.e. it was designed to be towed behind a powered boat or motor. Once out of trade VELA was cut in two, with each end rebuilt into pleasure boats - the original fore end being used as a fore end and the original stern also used as a fore end, and both fitted with conventional counter sterns. The boat you have bought is the original stern being used as a fore end.

 

Do you know much about these old working boats :captain:

 

 

I don\t, know a huge amount about the working boats but have been fascinated by them since a boating holiday in the 70's.   I have been watching some of the videos on here and know she was a butty.  Not sure, as yet, what a Woolwich butty is but would be interested to know more.  I am an avid history fan so finding Vela has a past I can look into is fantastic.  It will make the hard work making her good so much more worthwhile.

 

At the moment she has a wooden cabin and we want to keep that, at least repair it, trying to keep her as 'original' as possible at least on the outside but also aware she has gone through more than one transformation.

 

I look forward to learning more and thank you for your help so far.

 

 

 

 

16 minutes ago, stagedamager said:

Hi Sara. 

Yep, you have the stern end, so your bow is the original butty stern going backwards. The other half still exists as a motor, with the original bow. There are numerous photos of her working, probably the best well known is in the bottom lock of the Derby Canal when it had been closed to traffic.

 

Good luck with your project

 

Kind regards

 

Dan

Hi Dan,

 

Thanks for that.  I will probably spend more time than I should do looking these up. :)  

 

Best wishes,

 

Sara

 

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1 minute ago, Sara Strawson said:

That is amazing, thank you.  

 

Although there is a huge amount of work to do, we are really excited to find so much information about her on this site.  Photos and film, as well as information about the Idle Women.  I will thoroughly enjoy researching and finding out more about her.

 

I don\t, know a huge amount about the working boats but have been fascinated by them since a boating holiday in the 70's.   I have been watching some of the videos on here and know she was a butty.  Not sure, as yet, what a Woolwich butty is but would be interested to know more.  I am an avid history fan so finding Vela has a past I can look into is fantastic.  It will make the hard work making her good so much more worthwhile.

 

At the moment she has a wooden cabin and we want to keep that, at least repair it, trying to keep her as 'original' as possible at least on the outside but also aware she has gone through more than one transformation.

 

I look forward to learning more and thank you for your help so far.

 

 

 

 

The Grand Union Canal Carrying company commissioned several yards to build their boats. The main ones for metal hulls were Harland and Wolff, at North Woolwich and W.J Yarwoods in Northwich. Both built differently and to the trained eye easily identifiable. Both built two main sizes of craft (not including royalty), the small ones were named after stars and constellations, whereas the large were named after towns (numerous reasons how and why they got their names). Therefore, as Vela is built at Woolwich to the smaller dimensions she is known as a Small Woolwich. She could also be known as a star class although there is a lack of evidence that they were ever known as a "class", or even known as small/little or large/big back in the day.

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9 minutes ago, Sara Strawson said:

That is amazing, thank you.  

 

Although there is a huge amount of work to do, we are really excited to find so much information about her on this site.  Photos and film, as well as information about the Idle Women.  I will thoroughly enjoy researching and finding out more about her.

 

I don\t, know a huge amount about the working boats but have been fascinated by them since a boating holiday in the 70's.   I have been watching some of the videos on here and know she was a butty.  Not sure, as yet, what a Woolwich butty is but would be interested to know more.  I am an avid history fan so finding Vela has a past I can look into is fantastic.  It will make the hard work making her good so much more worthwhile.

 

At the moment she has a wooden cabin and we want to keep that, at least repair it, trying to keep her as 'original' as possible at least on the outside but also aware she has gone through more than one transformation.

 

I look forward to learning more and thank you for your help so far.

Woolwich is a reference to where it was built = Harland and Wolff Ltd., North Woolwich, London.

Small is a reference to the depth of the hull from gunwale to bottom of the bottom = 4'2'' for VELA (medium = 4'6'' and large = 4'9'').

butty refers to a boat that is unpowered but used in tow behind another boat, more commonly referred to as such when towed by a motor narrow boat. 

 

Please do not be intimidated by the knowledge on here and keep asking questions, but it might be better to start a new subject (thread) specific to VELA.

Edited by pete harrison
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4 minutes ago, Sara Strawson said:

That is amazing, thank you.  

 

Although there is a huge amount of work to do, we are really excited to find so much information about her on this site.  Photos and film, as well as information about the Idle Women.  I will thoroughly enjoy researching and finding out more about her.

 

I don\t, know a huge amount about the working boats but have been fascinated by them since a boating holiday in the 70's.   I have been watching some of the videos on here and know she was a butty.  Not sure, as yet, what a Woolwich butty is but would be interested to know more.  I am an avid history fan so finding Vela has a past I can look into is fantastic.  It will make the hard work making her good so much more worthwhile.

 

 

 

Good luck with the hunting. I have researched my own boat, Badger, and you will fill many hours finding cargoes, who steered her and when, even the wages of the skipper if you are lucky.  Ellesmere Port museum has loads of info, but getting through the maze of it is something else!

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2 hours ago, roland elsdon said: I remember seeing Dane almost every trip down Maffers, and indeed almost ran her down once in blisworth , an event the consequence of would have been appalling . Town class versus stern!.

Yes we moored on the field at Marsworth and used to see Dane on a regular basis. Once after a long session in the Red Lion we had a good luck round and discussed swapping Canis for her. At that time she wasn’t in too bad a condition but a quick chat with Jem put us right as to likely maintenance costs and we had to pass. 

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Interesting to note that Vela sold. Congratulations @Sara Strawson. I hope I don’t end up regretting not pursuing it in a few years time.

 

I’d like a butty to work with Vulpes and although I’m not hung up on it being a historic boat since it won’t be towed by one, the idea of restoring a former butty stern that’s been cut and used as a fore end is appealing. As I only want a 35’ boat I’m not considering buying a full length butty.

 

For various reasons - not least that I don’t need it for 4 or 5 years hence - I decided against pursuing Vela or Egypt which both came up for sale at the same time. First priority is to complete the refurbishment of Vulpes.
 

JP
 

PS @stagedamager please check the LMBY inbox 😉

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4 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

Interesting to note that Vela sold. Congratulations @Sara Strawson. I hope I don’t end up regretting not pursuing it in a few years time.

 

I’d like a butty to work with Vulpes and although I’m not hung up on it being a historic boat since it won’t be towed by one, the idea of restoring a former butty stern that’s been cut and used as a fore end is appealing. As I only want a 35’ boat I’m not considering buying a full length butty.

 

For various reasons - not least that I don’t need it for 4 or 5 years hence - I decided against pursuing Vela or Egypt which both came up for sale at the same time. First priority is to complete the refurbishment of Vulpes.
 

JP
 

PS @stagedamager please check the LMBY inbox 😉

Will do, we have just transferred servers to host with a boater friendly host so some may have been lost in the move. If you forward it again I'll pick it up!

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