Can somebody advise me which is the better, generator or engine?

[trebby91]

]Hi, All.

Can somebody advise me which is the better, generator or engine?

The set up.

Battery bank, 550 Ah traction batteries.

Alternators, 1 X 80 amp 1 X 110 amp, Maximum output via a battery management system 197amps

Engine size 35 HP it uses about 1 litre an hour charging normally running for about 2 hours to charge up the batteries.

Generator Honda 2000 watt ( Max) running on gas with it running on gas it’s hard to work out how much gas it uses. I tried it on petrol and it uses about 1 litre per hour but for obvious reasons I prefer gas.

Sterling Inverter charger 80 amp output (12 volt)

So the question is taking everything into consideration which is more economical to use to charge the batteries, the engine or the generator on gas?

Regards, Brian.

[blackrose]

Whichever works out cheaper on fuel, don't forget to include servicing and replacement costs.

 

It seems to make more sense to me to put all those (battery charging) running hours onto a £1000 generator which is easy and cheap to service, rather than a £5k or £6k engine which requires expensive replacement filters, etc.

 

Also, assuming it's a Honda EU20, your generator is likely to be much quieter than your engine which will benefit you and your neighbours. That's a benefit which is difficult to quantify in terms of cost.

Edited December 2, 2012 by blackrose

[Richard10002]

Whichever works out cheaper on fuel, don't forget to include servicing and replacement costs.

 

It seems to make more sense to me to put all those (battery charging) running hours onto a £1000 generator which is easy and cheap to service, rather than a £5k or £6k engine which requires expensive replacement filters, etc.

 

Also, assuming it's a Honda EU20, your generator is likely to be much quieter than your engine which will benefit you and your neighbours. That's a benefit which is difficult to quantify in terms of cost.

 

+1

[mrsmelly]

+1

 

 

2

[jelunga]

Whilst it may be cheaper in purely fuel costs to run the diesel main engine, depending on what you pay for non propulsion fuel, the extra wear abd maintenance costs abd replacement cost of the main engine will outweight the fuel cost of the generator.

I bought a Kipor IG2600 geny. People say the Honda is more reliable. But I could buy 3 kipors for the price of a honda. So even if the Honda would last 3 times as long it seems to me to be better to buy the Kipor.

So, my view is generator.

 

 

 

X3

Edited December 2, 2012 by jelunga

[blackrose]

I bought a Kipor IG2600 geny. People say the Honda is more reliable. But I could buy 3 kipors for the price of a honda. So even if the Honda would last 3 times as long it seems to me to be better to buy the Kipor.

 

I bought my Honda EU30 second hand for £1000 and it was a good buy, but I think if I was buying a brand new generator then I'd go for a Kipper too. However, it's not just about how long a generator lasts, but (as you have intimated), how reliable a generator is during its lifespan.

[Nickhlx]

....and the other point is that it WILL take longer than two hours to charge the batteries (fully)

 

Nick

Edited December 2, 2012 by Nickhlx

[Alfie & Smartie]

Whilst it may be cheaper in purely fuel costs to run the diesel main engine, depending on what you pay for non propulsion fuel, the extra wear abd maintenance costs abd replacement cost of the main engine will outweight the fuel cost of the generator.

I bought a Kipor IG2600 geny. People say the Honda is more reliable. But I could buy 3 kipors for the price of a honda. So even if the Honda would last 3 times as long it seems to me to be better to buy the Kipor.

So, my view is generator.

 

We have a kippor like yours 5 years old now work's a treat change the oil when its black wash the air fillter starts 2nd pull. great bit of kit,

 

X3

[Guest]

I don't like running the main engine for battery charging. I use an ancient Yamaha or Honda genny via a Sterling chrager, depending which one starts first.

[naema sufi]

I like my Honda quiet gene, a big plus for me is the fact that starts easy and not to much strength needed. It seems to work out cheaper than running the engine, which we can not do at the moment. I miss the engine warmth though, back bedroom feels icy

[Guest]

I like my Honda quiet gene, a big plus for me is the fact that starts easy and not to much strength needed. It seems to work out cheaper than running the engine, which we can not do at the moment. I miss the engine warmth though, back bedroom feels icy

That is the other side of the coin for me. Our engine does heat the boat cabin and water, so the cost of diesel is not just for charging. I just hate running the thing in neutral.

[MtB]

I like my Honda quiet gene, a big plus for me is the fact that starts easy and not to much strength needed. It seems to work out cheaper than running the engine, which we can not do at the moment. I miss the engine warmth though, back bedroom feels icy

 

Get an ECOfan then!

 

.....

 

 

MtB

[bottle]

Alternators, 1 X 80 amp 1 X 110 amp, Maximum output via a battery management system 197amps

 

That's clever.

[Guest]

Going slightly

 

but what do the assembled crew feel is the minimum generator output wattage required for battery charging (via a combi.) purposes only.

 

The smaller Kipor seems extremely keenly priced

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Kipor-IG770-Suitcase-Inverter-Generator-FREE-DELIVERY-and-FREE-LOCK-/270885560151?_trksid=p5197.m1992&_trkparms=aid%3D111000%26algo%3DREC.CURRENT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D14%26meid%3D3871203247427326465%26pid%3D100015%26prg%3D1006%26rk%3D1%26sd%3D270885560151%26

 

But puts out 700 watts.

[bottle]

It will depend on the size of the charger.

[Guest]

It will depend on the size of the charger.

 

http://www.mastervolt.com/marine/products/mass-combi-12v/mass-combi-12-4000-200-230-v/

[Grace and Favour]

I bought my Honda EU30 second hand for £1000 and it was a good buy, but I think if I was buying a brand new generator then I'd go for a Kipper too.

 

Don't these smoke a great deal?

[Arthur Brown]

Having a liking for reliability, I'd suggest that you keep both systems but use the generator/combi as the main static charger. You can check the gas consumption with the use of a kitchen or bathroom scale, the cylinder should have a tare weight stamped into the top, subtract he tare from the scale reading.

 

However I'd suggest that you check the charge regime as two hours is either a small charge, a part charge or a very fast charge, and your battery would benefit from a full gentle charge, giving you better battery life and performance. Now if you could get a generator running, and completing the bulk charge phase by say 11am then solar panels will complete the absorption and float charge sectors before sundown, silently and for free!

[canalowl]

I have a 120 amp alternator connected directly to the batteries with no management system. I generally use this up to around 90% SOC and then leave the 360 watt solar panels to do the rest. I also have a studer combi inverter with a sophisticated 50 amp charger. I have to use this if I want to get up to 100% SOC in the winter when the suns turned off (generally once a week whilst I use the generator for washing, ironing, hovering...). I am not sure if this is the cheapest approach in terms of diesel and maintenance but it seems to be the quickest in terms of noise and neighbours.

[Richard10002]

http://www.mastervolt.com/marine/products/mass-combi-12v/mass-combi-12-4000-200-230-v/

 

A 200A charger will require something around 3KW of generator power to deliver 200A, so a 700W generator won't do it. If you can adjust the charger down to about 40A, it should be able to cope.

[Guest]

A 200A charger will require something around 3KW of generator power to deliver 200A, so a 700W generator won't do it. If you can adjust the charger down to about 40A, it should be able to cope.

 

Ok cheers Richard

[churchward]

Ok cheers Richard

I agree with Richard something around the 3Kw mark will be right to be able to cope with maximum charging output and voltage.

 

It's the old formula of Amps X Volts equals Watts.

 

eg 200 amps multipled by 14.4 Volts (max charging voltage) equals 2880 Watts

[smileypete]

A 200A charger will require something around 3KW of generator power to deliver 200A, so a 700W generator won't do it. If you can adjust the charger down to about 40A, it should be able to cope.

Don't think it quite works like this with switched mode chargers, someone the other day had problems with running a combi from a EU10i despite the output current being reasonably low.

 

cheers, Pete.

~smpt~

[luctor et emergo]

So, you have an engine, with an alternator, which charges the batteries. Possibly set up to charge those batteries quite well. 70 amp alternator, maybe even 90 or over a 100 amps. Split charger etc.

But you know, that seems a bit odd. Why not add a seperate petrol generator, and a seperate charger, to do the job that is ready done? What size your separate charger? Half the size of your alternator? Less??

 

If you don't like running your engine in nutral, try moving the boat occassionaly. It's fun, and charges your batts...

[DeanS]

I like my Honda quiet gene, a big plus for me is the fact that starts easy and not to much strength needed. It seems to work out cheaper than running the engine, which we can not do at the moment. I miss the engine warmth though, back bedroom feels icy

 

Are you on hookup over winter? We used to use a small oil heater...it didnt use a lot of elec..and warmed the back cabin well. We just kept it turned right down, and on all the time.