Angling match pegged on lock moorings!

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

So we can catch fish .

wish I knew how to do those emotion symbols.

I'd choose one that shows someone rolling around laffing their cock off!

This thread gets better

 

Sometimes it pays to use a bit of psychology with fishermen on lock landings. Well if fish can fool them its easy for us.

 

The first mate is very adept at warning them that "Take care its his first time out driving the boat. He's not very good and he's broken someones rod already today". No one ever says a word and they keep their tackle well clear. I make it look like I am struggling with the boat, which comes naturally to me anyway.

 

The second one is only used if the odd ones do get abusive, a trick last used at Thorne lock. She says "he will put anti-fish liquid into the canal, it stops them from feeding for days!" I then make a point of splashing some anti-fishing liquid (a bit of water mixed with washing up liquid out of a squeezy bottle just to create a few surface bubbles) into the canal just behind the boat. Then I pretend to mix it into the canal water with the propeller as we pull away. It's the look on their faces that makes my day.

 

Mick

 

A bit of humour never does any harm. Thumbs up from me

[Wanted]

So we can catch fish .

 

Ah, I thought it had benefits to the environment or something...

 

wish I knew how to do those emotion symbols.

I'd choose one that shows someone rolling around laffing their cock off!

This thread gets better

 

Maybe you wish to add your opinion?

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

Ah, I thought it had benefits to the environment or something...

 

 

 

Maybe you wish to add your opinion?

 

 

I've stated my behaviour towards fishermen, earlier

 

Opinion...., the canals there for us all to use. Share and share alike, pretty simple. I can't really elaborate on that.

 

And I'm of similar opinion to GSeR. I think he's talked a lot of sense and shown a great deal of patience.

 

I'd really like to hear the fisherman's account, the guy who the OP had altercations with. Get a balanced story.

 

Also, of my opinion,

I'd guess when your correct about a rule, it helps to use a little tact in your approach.

As boaters we're often out in some isolated areas and it makes sense to be careful how we approach others. I think some don't realise it.

Edited October 23, 2012 by Goliath

[Jim Riley]

Nice to see I got my point across

 

Mr Riley, The reason you didn't get a reply until now is that the letter didn't arrive until last Wednesday. I was going to write to you to explain that this stretch was pegged by another club and, after looking on Google to research codes of conduct, I came across your post so I decided to look.

 

The vitriol in question came from the morons who decided to hijack the comments you made and make it personal. They need to grow up.

End of discussion.

 

Afterthought, If you (Mr Jim Riley) would like to contact me at the address you wrote to I would be more than happy to discuss issues with you on a one to one basis

 

hi ishticar, I already have contacted you at the OBAC, well it was addressed to the secretary but obviously you have seen it. I understand the position, it was not your club that pegged out on the lock landings, I have duly informed John Ellis at CaRT. I would like to be assured that your club never fishes within 25m of a lock, whether as individuals or as part of a match, and that you will inform other clubs who use your waters of the rules, even though they should know already. I don't see that there is much else to say, such an assurance on this public forum would do much to reassure fellow boaters. I am also pleasantly surprised that the vitriol is all one way, that you have never heard a bunch (should that be shoal) of fishermen unfairly or fairly denigrating boaters.I'll give your members a pleasant nod, wave and hello next time I'm passing.

 

 

I've stated my behaviour towards fishermen, earlier

 

Opinion...., the canals there for us all to use. Share and share alike, pretty simple. I can't really elaborate on that.

 

And I'm of similar opinion to GSeR. I think he's talked a lot of sense and shown a great deal of patience.

 

I'd really like to hear the fisherman's account, the guy who the OP had altercations with. Get a balanced story.

 

Also, of my opinion,

I'd guess when your correct about a rule, it helps to use a little tact in your approach.

As boaters we're often out in some isolated areas and it makes sense to be careful how we approach others. I think some don't realise it.

 

There were no altercations with the fishermen, "bad place to fish that, mate" ,looks of frustration from me and looks of confusion from them as I came close in to moor, followed by reasonable discussion. They hadn't a clue what problems they were causing, why they just shouldn't be there, code of conduct? Eh? That's how I found out that the match pegs had been put on the landings. Organised chaos!

 

 

[Ishticar]

hi ishticar, I already have contacted you at the OBAC, well it was addressed to the secretary but obviously you have seen it. I understand the position, it was not your club that pegged out on the lock landings, I have duly informed John Ellis at CaRT. I would like to be assured that your club never fishes within 25m of a lock, whether as individuals or as part of a match, and that you will inform other clubs who use your waters of the rules, even though they should know already. I don't see that there is much else to say, such an assurance on this public forum would do much to reassure fellow boaters. I am also pleasantly surprised that the vitriol is all one way, that you have never heard a bunch (should that be shoal) of fishermen unfairly or fairly denigrating boaters.I'll give your members a pleasant nod, wave and hello next time I'm passing.

 

 

 

 

There were no altercations with the fishermen, "bad place to fish that, mate" ,looks of frustration from me and looks of confusion from them as I came close in to moor, followed by reasonable discussion. They hadn't a clue what problems they were causing, why they just shouldn't be there, code of conduct? Eh? That's how I found out that the match pegs had been put on the landings. Organised chaos!

 

Hello Mr Riley. You can rest assured that my club does not use the moorings as a peg to fish from, as only a couple of weeks ago we fished on Battyeford canal in Mirfield. We were pegged from the far side of the bridge, after South Pennine Boat Club marina up to the launch steps for the old scout hut. Every boat that passed was acknowledged by most anglers, including myself as we know most of the members of SPBC & given the courtesy of removing our rods whilst they passed, well before they reached us. We also have a rule that, under no circumstances should an angler cast his line at a moored boat or catapult bait towards them, we all use bait pots that deposit whatever bait we are using directly over the float.

 

I will be issuing a directive to all the clubs who apply to have matches on our canal stretches, Mirfield canal & Battyeford cut, that they DO NOT peg any moorings near lock gates at a minimum of 35 meters away to accomodate boaters. We have part time bailiffs but they don't often feel the need to police these stretches if they are booked by outside clubs. That said, I will endeavor to attend at weekends to see if matches are pegged correctly, working commitments allowing. The only thing we can't police is the day ticket anglers who turn up sporadically and set up wherever.

 

I hope this this goes some way to clearing up your views and concerns.

 

To answer the other persons concerns about catching fish with hooks. There is no scientific proof that fish feel pain in their lips. The majority of fish, when caught have been hooked in the membrane behind the lip. If you can prove me wrong then I will give up the sport I have enjoyed all my adult life and take up boating & trust me, that would be a disaster as I am lousy at 3 point turns.

[boathunter]

If you never have, you should visit one of those undersea life public attractions. I took my kids there when they were small and my view on fish was changed forever by one thing that happened:

 

There was a low large tank full of flatfish - plaice and other types. Whenever anyone approached the tank, they swam up to the surface to have their heads scratched just like a dog would. So Ishticar, please don't hide behind "nobody has proved fish feel pain", it's laughable.

 

On the boating/fishing side, it's obvious from your post that you've only just got round to reading the rules. Better late than never. You make me angry and I don't even have a boat!

Edited October 25, 2012 by boathunter

[Starcoaster]

To answer the other persons concerns about catching fish with hooks. There is no scientific proof that fish feel pain in their lips.

Is there any scientific proof that fish don't feel pain in their lips then? Or reason to believe they might not?!

 

 

The majority of fish, when caught have been hooked in the membrane behind the lip.

What about the other fish who re not in this majority?

If they don't feel pain in their lips, why do fishermen often slap a bit of bonjela on them before letting them go? I'm pretty sure the fish feel it when the hooks tear their lips, as can happen on occasion.

 

While fishing is not for me and it's not something I would choose to do for a lot of reasons, I do eat fish and don't have any strong opinions, positive or negative, about fishermen per se other than if they impact on my own life.

But if you're going to come out with ambiguous statements about scientific proof and generally trying to play down the image of sport catch and release fishing as distressing/ unpleasant/ harmful to fish, please provide some kind of verifiable and credible background evidence to support your claims.

[Tuscan]

Hello Mr Riley. You can rest assured that my club does not use the moorings as a peg to fish from, as only a couple of weeks ago we fished on Battyeford canal in Mirfield. We were pegged from the far side of the bridge, after South Pennine Boat Club marina up to the launch steps for the old scout hut. Every boat that passed was acknowledged by most anglers, including myself as we know most of the members of SPBC & given the courtesy of removing our rods whilst they passed, well before they reached us. We also have a rule that, under no circumstances should an angler cast his line at a moored boat or catapult bait towards them, we all use bait pots that deposit whatever bait we are using directly over the float.

 

I will be issuing a directive to all the clubs who apply to have matches on our canal stretches, Mirfield canal & Battyeford cut, that they DO NOT peg any moorings near lock gates at a minimum of 35 meters away to accomodate boaters. We have part time bailiffs but they don't often feel the need to police these stretches if they are booked by outside clubs. That said, I will endeavor to attend at weekends to see if matches are pegged correctly, working commitments allowing. The only thing we can't police is the day ticket anglers who turn up sporadically and set up wherever.

 

I hope this this goes some way to clearing up your views and concerns.

 

To answer the other persons concerns about catching fish with hooks. There is no scientific proof that fish feel pain in their lips. The majority of fish, when caught have been hooked in the membrane behind the lip. If you can prove me wrong then I will give up the sport I have enjoyed all my adult life and take up boating & trust me, that would be a disaster as I am lousy at 3 point turns.

 

 

 

 

 

 

A reasonable post lets all enjoy the canals, the idiots that fish by the locks are the same as boaters that "moor" on the water points.

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

A reasonable post lets all enjoy the canals, the idiots that fish by the locks are the same as boaters that "moor" on the water points.

 

Hear hear!

 

Having said that;

I've just helped a hire boat moor up. At a lock entrance, on the white waiting bollards.

There was no room on the tempoarary rings which followed, and after that was unsuitable for mooring.

It was almost dark.

These guys had picked up the boat a few hours before and were still getting the hang of the boat, they didn't have much of an idea.

 

Another boat and I thought it safer to help them moor at the lock than suggest they keep going.

I did tell one of them "the white bollards are for boats waiting for the lock, so you'd best be off early before someone wants to use the lock.

 

So sometimes 'shit happens'.

 

(Maybe a fisherman will turn up early expecting to fish from there?)

[RLWP]

<snip>

 

(Maybe a fisherman will turn up early expecting to fish from there?)

 

 

Richard

[Wanted]

Hello Mr Riley. You can rest assured that my club does not use the moorings as a peg to fish from, as only a couple of weeks ago we fished on Battyeford canal in Mirfield. We were pegged from the far side of the bridge, after South Pennine Boat Club marina up to the launch steps for the old scout hut. Every boat that passed was acknowledged by most anglers, including myself as we know most of the members of SPBC & given the courtesy of removing our rods whilst they passed, well before they reached us. We also have a rule that, under no circumstances should an angler cast his line at a moored boat or catapult bait towards them, we all use bait pots that deposit whatever bait we are using directly over the float.

 

I will be issuing a directive to all the clubs who apply to have matches on our canal stretches, Mirfield canal & Battyeford cut, that they DO NOT peg any moorings near lock gates at a minimum of 35 meters away to accomodate boaters. We have part time bailiffs but they don't often feel the need to police these stretches if they are booked by outside clubs. That said, I will endeavor to attend at weekends to see if matches are pegged correctly, working commitments allowing. The only thing we can't police is the day ticket anglers who turn up sporadically and set up wherever.

 

I hope this this goes some way to clearing up your views and concerns.

 

To answer the other persons concerns about catching fish with hooks. There is no scientific proof that fish feel pain in their lips. The majority of fish, when caught have been hooked in the membrane behind the lip. If you can prove me wrong then I will give up the sport I have enjoyed all my adult life and take up boating & trust me, that would be a disaster as I am lousy at 3 point turns.

 

 

http://www.spiegel.de/international/zeitgeist/the-hook-that-hurts-scientists-tip-the-scales-against-anglers-a-749956.html

 

Also check out apolloduck.co.uk for equipment for your new hobby

[Ishticar]

Is there any scientific proof that fish don't feel pain in their lips then? Or reason to believe they might not?!

 

 

 

What about the other fish who re not in this majority?

If they don't feel pain in their lips, why do fishermen often slap a bit of bonjela on them before letting them go? I'm pretty sure the fish feel it when the hooks tear their lips, as can happen on occasion.

 

While fishing is not for me and it's not something I would choose to do for a lot of reasons, I do eat fish and don't have any strong opinions, positive or negative, about fishermen per se other than if they impact on my own life.

But if you're going to come out with ambiguous statements about scientific proof and generally trying to play down the image of sport catch and release fishing as distressing/ unpleasant/ harmful to fish, please provide some kind of verifiable and credible background evidence to support your claims.

 

25 years + of research by scientists and the EA have not proven conclusively that fish do or do not feel pain. The "bonjela" you see being used is an antiseptic that is applied to a fish that has a lesion (sore to the uninitiated) on its flank.

 

This is not a discussion I am going to persue further as you have your views, I have mine and never the t'wain shall meet. Let's agree to disagree.

[Starcoaster]

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you really- As I say, I don't have particularly strong feelings either way.

I do feel that people who make sweeping statements should be willing to back them up with hard proof though.

 

A quick Google of the terms 'bonjela' and 'fish' finds numerous forum posts and info on the first two pages citing using bonjela on mouth injuries in fish, as well as you mention, on the flank, ie- http://www.cymfishing.com/wcf/printview.php?t=4936&start=0&sid=c35bd489e6697432564025a44a63adbc

[Wanted]

Oh no you don't matey! What about our deal?

[Grace and Favour]

<<snip>>

 

This is not a discussion I am going to persue further as you have your views, I have mine and never the t'wain shall meet. Let's agree to disagree.

 

I agree

 

er . . . . .

 

 

or, should I be disagreeing . . . . . .

 

Either way - - I note that you have chosen to pierce fish with hooks, (barbed?) in the hope, or is it blind faith(?) that it doesn't damage them.

 

That's caring of you.

[luctor et emergo]

Leaving the now ensuing debate about the sensibility of pulling a fish out of its breathing environment, with a large metal hook , aside for the moment, and returning briefly to the fishing on lock landings. I see very few fisherman fishing on locklandings, and if they do, they do so 'light', i.e. with a small reel rod, and without all the heaps of equipment and seats often sported by 'competion anglers'.. there has never been an issue, when I came in to moor on the lock landing. They always move over, because a 70' boat is bigger than a rod. And they know, that I will be gone in 10 minutes tops.

 

Do you really expect a lock landing to be kept free all day, even if there are only a few boats using that landing, for just a few minutes at a time?

 

Share and share alike, it's all about how you interact.

[wannabe]

Leaving the now ensuing debate about the sensibility of pulling a fish out of its breathing environment, with a large metal hook , aside for the moment, and returning briefly to the fishing on lock landings. I see very few fisherman fishing on locklandings, and if they do, they do so 'light', i.e. with a small reel rod, and without all the heaps of equipment and seats often sported by 'competion anglers'.. there has never been an issue, when I came in to moor on the lock landing. They always move over, because a 70' boat is bigger than a rod. And they know, that I will be gone in 10 minutes tops.

 

Do you really expect a lock landing to be kept free all day, even if there are only a few boats using that landing, for just a few minutes at a time?

 

Share and share alike, it's all about how you interact.

Sounds quite sensible to me

They fish. I come along.

They stop.

I go.

They start again.

No problems

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

 

Share and share alike, it's all about how you interact.

??

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

Hear hear!

 

Having said that;

I've just helped a hire boat moor up. At a lock entrance, on the white waiting bollards.

There was no room on the tempoarary rings which followed, and after that was unsuitable for mooring.

It was almost dark.

These guys had picked up the boat a few hours before and were still getting the hang of the boat, they didn't have much of an idea.

 

Another boat and I thought it safer to help them moor at the lock than suggest they keep going.

I did tell one of them "the white bollards are for boats waiting for the lock, so you'd best be off early before someone wants to use the lock.

 

So sometimes 'shit happens'.

 

(Maybe a fisherman will turn up early expecting to fish from there?)

 

Also, there is very famous person amongst those we helped moor at the landing to a lock this evening. But I ain't naming and shaming.

 

I can imagine tomorrow:

but don't you know who I am? Says famous person

I don't care who you are I need to moor/fish there! Says boater/fisherman

[luctor et emergo]

Also, there is very famous person amongst those we helped moor at the landing to a lock this evening. But I ain't naming and shaming.

 

I can imagine tomorrow:

but don't you know who I am? Says famous person

I don't care who you are I need to moor/fish there! Says boater/fisherman

 

 

What? What is the problem? I often moor on lock landings. I arrive late, and will be gone early. What is the 'naming and shaming ' problem?

[mark99]

I agree

 

er . . . . .

 

 

or, should I be disagreeing . . . . . .

 

Either way - - I note that you have chosen to pierce fish with hooks, (barbed?) in the hope, or is it blind faith(?) that it doesn't damage them.

 

That's caring of you.

 

It's a question of degree I suppose. People who eat meat knows it means killing of an animal - but how long does the animal suffer before being culled? 1/2 second? 100 seconds? all it's life? - at what point do you decide it's time enough (i.e. too long a time for you to bear thinking about) and stop eating meat.

 

I'm afraid in all history we all exploit other things, it's just hidden in the veneer of modern life.

 

And no I don't eat meat or fish but I do go angling sometimes.

 

If you want real cruelty how about gutting fish when they are still alive, ripping up sea beds with dredgers, exhausting fish stocks until nearly extinct, then throwing most small ones back dead cos of quota's. Think about that when you eat your next cod and moan about an angler putting antisceptic on a wound before the fish is put back.

 

Personal choice, personal values.

 

Mark

Edited October 27, 2012 by mark99

[Wanted]

 

 

Personal choice, personal values.

 

Mark

 

 

Indeed,

 

But is it a trade off?

 

'I do this because it causes less pain than this'

 

I eat carefully selected meat and fish because I care about welfare but am also a carnivor. For me it's more about the need to hunt a living thing for no other reason than sport.

 

You are right though that it is indeed personal choice, as is my choice to let sport hunters know that I think they are cruel.

[mark99]

Indeed,

 

But is it a trade off?

 

'I do this because it causes less pain than this'

 

I eat carefully selected meat and fish because I care about welfare but am also a carnivor. For me it's more about the need to hunt a living thing for no other reason than sport.

 

You are right though that it is indeed personal choice, as is my choice to let sport hunters know that I think they are cruel.

 

 

My personal opinion is that killing any animal for food is cruel and something I could not do myself. So I withdraw from the whole business. However I do not think I have any right to impart that personal opinion on anyone. I do respect others opinions to do what they think is right. Most of us (unless Monks) do live a life of fairly illogical contradictions.

 

 

Mark

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

What? What is the problem? I often moor on lock landings. I arrive late, and will be gone early. What is the 'naming and shaming ' problem?

Tongue in cheek comment, I don't think it is a problem.

But there are some who do

[Wanted]

My personal opinion is that killing any animal for food is cruel and something I could not do myself. So I withdraw from the whole business. However I do not think I have any right to impart that personal opinion on anyone. I do respect others opinions to do what they think is right. Most of us (unless Monks) do live a life of fairly illogical contradictions.

 

 

Mark

 

Indeed, good post