Boat names that don't match their class

[Derek R.]

Not if we are talking about the Constellations. Achenar was the name given to Atrus's son. When you name a child, you can spell it how you wish, it may allude to something else, though quite often the allusion is all, as to spell the same as the original might appear to be a falsehood, and no-one wants a false child. In the case of Myst, both Atrus's son's were false, and in the final challenge, one can become entrapped with either if one does not make the correct choice.

 

I enjoyed Myst, but stumped on Riven.

[Speedwheel]

Ahhh. Note: always read more than just Wikipedia.

[carlt]

Not if we are talking about the Constellations. Achenar was the name given to Atrus's son. When you name a child, you can spell it how you wish, it may allude to something else, though quite often the allusion is all, as to spell the same as the original might appear to be a falsehood, and no-one wants a false child. In the case of Myst, both Atrus's son's were false, and in the final challenge, one can become entrapped with either if one does not make the correct choice.

 

I enjoyed Myst, but stumped on Riven.

But the star was not named after a computer game character, it is derived from the Arabic (original spelling: آخر النهر ).

[Chris Pink]

Not if we are talking about the Constellations. Achenar was the name given to Atrus's son. When you name a child, you can spell it how you wish, it may allude to something else, though quite often the allusion is all, as to spell the same as the original might appear to be a falsehood, and no-one wants a false child. In the case of Myst, both Atrus's son's were false, and in the final challenge, one can become entrapped with either if one does not make the correct choice.

 

I enjoyed Myst, but stumped on Riven.

 

 

SPOILER!!!!!

[mayalld]

And there is this one......

 

 

Despite being partially obscured by the rope, this shows this butty as a BW maintenance boat carrying the spelling "Berkhampstead", which although once the official spelling of the town name had gone out of use long before any Town class boats were named. By then only the spelling "Berkhamsted" was in use in official matters. (My grandfather was born in in 1885, and even by then his [original] birth certificate shows the modern spelling).

 

I don't know if anyone can confirm that this butty always had the spelling "Berkhampstead" ? "The George and the Mary" shows yet another spelling "Berkhamstead", but I think that may well be an error in that publication, and probably not a spelling ever carried by the boat.

 

Anyone know ?

 

Whilst your grandfather's original certificate may well show "Berkhamstead", it was (assuming he was Harry Fincher) recorded as "Berkhampstead" in the GRO registers.

 

The version without the "p" crept in over the years, starting in the 1850s, and becoming prevalent by the early years of the 20th century. The name was officially changed to "Berkhamstead" on 1st October 1939, although the older version continued to crop up at a later date.

[Derek R.]

SPOILER!!!!!

 

LOL! I thought that was history and safe! How far have you got? I have copious notes . . . .

[kingofthecut]

Antartic is another good example. When built in the mid 19th century the names on the BCN iceboats were carved into the wooden top bends by local carpenters and in broad brummy the continent has no middle 'c'! You can picture the conversation, "Gu an' carve Antaaaartic on that 'un". It should of course be Antarctic.

[Steve Priest]

 

 

I do however completely agree that the large Woolwich butty currently paired with BAINTON should be named AYR. Unfortunately this is not the only 'historic' narrow boat to be carrying the name of another boat.

 

I've just noticed this point and I'm not sure that I do agree.

 

The tale that was told at the time (1977/8?) went like this :-

 

Waterways had both Ayr and Berkhampstead at Bull's Bridge, and made a decision to assess the condition of both boats, to refurbish the better of the two and scrap the other. It was found that the Ayr was in better condition, and so it would be Berkhampstead that was to be scrapped. However, someone got it wrong and cut the Ayr up instead. To cover up the mistake they then cleaned the name off the back bends of the Berkhampstead, repainted them in white, and had them signwritten with the name Ayr in the then standard pale blue. They then roaded the boat to Gayton arm end to get it out of the way.I remember seeing it there in what must have been the summer of 1978, looking rather strange with a worn out plywood cabin in faded darker blue, and the stark white of the freshly painted stern. I can't say myself that this is true, but it was certainly was a widely believed rumour at the time.

 

Shortly after, it was offered for tender, and ended up in the hands of Roger White, who had by then owned Bainton for four or five years. At some stage in the early 1980's when I worked for the Warks. Flyboat Co. I did some work on the hull, I can't remember what, but I do remember that I was impressed with the overall condition of the boat, far better than that of many other big Woolwich butties. Roger stuck with the name Berkhampstead, in line with the popular belief that that was what it was.

Edited February 25, 2011 by Steve Priest

[alan_fincher]

I've just noticed this point and I'm not sure that I do agree.

 

The tale that was told at the time (1977/8?) went like this :-

 

Waterways had both Ayr and Berkhampstead at Bull's Bridge, and made a decision to assess the condition of both boats, to refurbish the better of the two and scrap the other. It was found that the Ayr was in better condition, and so it would be Berkhampstead that was to be scrapped. However, someone got it wrong and cut the Ayr up instead. To cover up the mistake they then cleaned the name off the back bends of the Berkhampstead, repainted them in white, and had them signwritten with the name Ayr in the then standard pale blue. They then roaded the boat to Gayton arm end to get it out of the way.I remember seeing it there in what must have been the summer of 1978, looking rather strange with a worn out plywood cabin in faded darker blue, and the stark white of the freshly painted stern. I can't say myself that this is true, but it was certainly was a widely believed rumour at the time.

 

Shortly after, it was offered for tender, and ended up in the hands of Roger White, who had by then owned Bainton for four or five years. At some stage in the early 1980's when I worked for the Warks. Flyboat Co. I did some work on the hull, I can't remember what, but I do remember that I was impressed with the overall condition of the boat, far better than that of many other big Woolwich butties. Roger stuck with the name Berkhampstead, in line with the popular belief that that was what it was.

 

I have chatted very recently to my brother Mike on this particular topic.

 

He is absolutely 100% adamant that the boat now carrying the name Berkhampstead is actually Ayr.

 

His reasons for this are simply that he knew Aynho and Ayr very well when they were lived on by Bill Brown and Dolly Dakin and (large!) family at Marsworth yard. He said he knew Ayr well enough to know where some very distinctive dents were that were very unlikely to have existed identically on Berkhampstead. When he saw a boat coming back from Bulls Bridge now carrying the Berkhampstead name, he said it was entirely obvious to those in the know that it was actually Ayr. He is unshakable on the point.

 

He occasionally reads the forum, so may at some point pop up with a fuller explanation than that, to include the dates we are talking about.

 

However I'm pretty sure that in his version of events a boat travelled south to Bull's Bridge called Ayr, and returned carrying the Berkhampstead name. That of course doesn't stack up with the idea of a boat travelling back up to Gayton, which was actually Berkhampsted, but lettered as Ayr - so I don't imagine I've convinced you!

[Steve Priest]

I have chatted very recently to my brother Mike on this particular topic.

 

He is absolutely 100% adamant that the boat now carrying the name Berkhampstead is actually Ayr.

 

His reasons for this are simply that he knew Aynho and Ayr very well when they were lived on by Bill Brown and Dolly Dakin and (large!) family at Marsworth yard. He said he knew Ayr well enough to know where some very distinctive dents were that were very unlikely to have existed identically on Berkhampstead. When he saw a boat coming back from Bulls Bridge now carrying the Berkhampstead name, he said it was entirely obvious to those in the know that it was actually Ayr. He is unshakable on the point.

 

He occasionally reads the forum, so may at some point pop up with a fuller explanation than that, to include the dates we are talking about.

 

However I'm pretty sure that in his version of events a boat travelled south to Bull's Bridge called Ayr, and returned carrying the Berkhampstead name. That of course doesn't stack up with the idea of a boat travelling back up to Gayton, which was actually Berkhampsted, but lettered as Ayr - so I don't imagine I've convinced you!

 

 

 

How interesting,

 

The only part of my post that I can personally confirm beyond doubt is that I did see the boat sporting the name AYR at Gayton during that Summer (1978), and that, I think, has to be the boat now called Berkhampstead. I'll have a chat with Andy Boucher when I next see him and see what he remembers. I hope Tam Murrell reads this, I'd like to hear what he has to say. The only other anomaly is the overall condition of the boat when I worked on it at Stockton. It had at some stage been rebottomed, and while it was (when it left BW) very thin around the cabin footings and the lower fore end, it was in overall very good condition, not in the state that you might expect it to be scrapped (mind you, that wouldn't have stopped them, would it?)

[Paul H]

I think this one will run and run. In an earlier post under Seventies Boating, Mike wrote:

 

The things parents had in their back gardens...

This table cupboard was the one I put into Bilster when I rebuilt the cabin.

 

It was liberated from one of the maintenance boats going down to Bulls Bridge for scrapping, I am fairly sure it was Ayr, as she travelled down to Bulls bridge, after the Dakin/ Browns moved off Ayno and Ayr and into housing in Marsworth.

 

It was in a poor state when it fell off the back of a narrowboat, and I found it laying on the towpath looking for a new home. (Honest m'lud)

 

The Castle had been painted by Sam Brooks many years before, and whilst Ayr was lying unlocked below Broadwater, vandals had gone in and carved "Skins" right across it and over all the roses. The roses could not be saved, but I touched up Sam's castle (consenting adults and all that)

 

We knew Ayr was going for scrapping. However in a big hush hush, the butty Berkamstead had been sold but then scrapped in error. In a quick cover up Ayr was hurriedly repainted with the name Berkamstead, and the buyer who thought he had bought Berko had ended up with Ayr.

 

Had I known Ayr was not going to be scrapped, I might not have picked up the table I found "laying there"

 

I bet that post opens up a debate!

 

We knew Ayr very well, (I often went aboard to talk to Dolly and her family, and I worked regularly with Bill Brown, so I always called in when passing)

and recognised the boat claiming to be Berkhamstead, to be Ayr from all the familiar dents., so don't tell me I am wrong.

 

I remember Berkampstead as a maintenenace boat at Thrupp in 1976 and of course Ayr was a "carrying boat". I can't believe that Berkhampstead would have had any running gear or a painted up table flap.

 

And of course the owner of Bainton would have very much wanted to believe that his newly acquired butty was Berkhampstead as he would then have an original pair.

 

Who's got some wet and dry sandpaper?

 

Paul

[DHutch]

Ahhh. Note: always read more than just Wikipedia.

WHAT!! No one ever told ME this....

[Derek R.]

Ah! The Wikid Wikipedia - full of facsimilie facts opinions!

 

Try Old Moore's Almanac. That's fun too.

[antarmike]

What is the story on Glossor/ Glossop?

[Laurence Hogg]

What is the story on Glossor/ Glossop?

This boat is now a bar in a presently shut down pub in Netherton. However I was always led to believe this was intended to be either Gloster or Gloucester.

[antarmike]

If the names were transcribed from a hand written list Glossor ? Glossop seems most likely to me. Loosing the stroke from the R is easily done.

 

If the list was dictated then Glossor could have been intended to be called Gloucester....

 

Either is possible in my mind.

 

 

Gloster does not appear to be a proper name of a town Anyway.

 

Gloster is sometimes used as a name for some Gloucester based companies, such a Gloucester Aircraft Company which renamed itself Gloster Aircraft company because foreign customers where having problems with the proper spelling.

 

(Yes I know There is a Gloster in Mississippi)

 

I will throw in Grimsby? (not that it is a Town class) but just because it purports to be a town and it isn't (technically) There is a town called Great Grimsby and a village called Little Grimsby. Although the Great is frequently omitted it is/ was the correct name of the town. Although the name has come and gone, and reappeared a few times, at the time the Josher butty was named it should surely have been Great Grimsby!

Edited October 16, 2011 by antarmike