Name those boats .....

[carlt]

mabel and forget-me-not possibly

 

 

Yes, definitely Mabel and Forget me not.

 

The motor, breasted up with FMN looks interesting, too, and I do like that Day boat (?) conversion.

Edited July 9, 2009 by carlt

[Mike Nicoll]

Yes, definitely Mabel and Forget me not.

 

The motor, breasted up with FMN looks interesting, too, and I do like that Day boat (?) conversion.

any idea where MABEL & FORGET ME NOT are nou and there condion.

the last time i heard about them was in the 1990s thay where on the kennet & avon.

[Timleech]

The motor, breasted up with FMN looks interesting, too

 

Yes it has what looks likely to be a semidiesel exhaust coming from where the cross bed should be, as well as a chimney collar in the usual place.

 

Tim

[carlt]

any idea where MABEL & FORGET ME NOT are nou and there condion.

the last time i heard about them was in the 1990s thay where on the kennet & avon.

Up Warwick way, near Shrewley tunnel, together again.

 

FMN is in the process of being deconverted and is due to go into dock soon.

[Kez]

Any thoughts on this? taken 2 or 3 years back.

 

 

 

Walton.

Now about to be rebuilt at Malkins bank

[carlt]

Walton.

Now about to be rebuilt at Malkins bank

Keep up!

 

Walton?

Edited July 10, 2009 by carlt

[RLWP]

Up Warwick way, near Shrewley tunnel, together again.

 

FMN is in the process of being deconverted and is due to go into dock soon.

 

I posted a picture of them here ages ago. I wonder where it is? Somewhere in the H&H section I thought

 

Richard

[Hairy-Neil]

Forget me not as she is today. Well, was a couple of months ago.....

 

[matty40s]

there are two boats under copious amounts of sheeting and tarpaulin at weedon, which boats are they??????

[alan_fincher]

I'm guessing you mean Bainton and Berkhampstead.

 

(But there is apparently doubt about whether what is labelled this days as Berkhampstead is actually the original Berkhampstead.....)

[Timleech]

Forget me not as she is today. Well, was a couple of months ago.....

 

 

Well at least my fore end still looks reasonably OK

 

Tim

[Hairy-Neil]

(But there is apparently doubt about whether what is labelled this days as Berkhampstead is actually the original Berkhampstead.....)

 

That ought to provoke a response from the PH's...

 

My money is on Ayr having been cut up and Berko being the real Berkhampstead.

Edited July 10, 2009 by Hairy-Neil

[the grinch]

That ought to provoke a response from the PH's...

 

My money is on Ayr having been cut up and Berko being the real Berkhampstead.

 

i would second Ayr being cut up this was the story i was told at foxton back in 1984

 

one saturday morning a boat had the name ayr applied and the real ayr was removed from the water and cut up very quickly by BW and disposed of rapidly in the hope that no one would notice her demise.

[journeyperson]

Forget me not as she is today. Well, was a couple of months ago.....

 

I am really impressed that the boat in my photo was identified and that there is so much knowledge of its history. Seeing how she looks today is fascinating and I will keep my eyes open for news of the restoration.

[carlt]

I am really impressed that the boat in my photo was identified and that there is so much knowledge of its history. Seeing how she looks today is fascinating and I will keep my eyes open for news of the restoration.

Mabel and FMN are owned by very good friends of mine.

 

Mabel was partially deconverted several years ago, leaving an extension on the engine room.

 

I have been pestering the owner to deconvert FMN for years.

 

This work was begun but stalled due to domestic problems and has restarted, recently.

 

The hull is in very good condition (though a caulking and blacking is overdue), although there is something not quite right about the back end. There are too many knees, in fairly random places.

 

I think this is due to some unremarkable work, done by Ian Staples.

[Steve King]

one saturday morning a boat had the name ayr applied and the real ayr was removed from the water and cut up very quickly by BW and disposed of rapidly in the hope that no one would notice her demise.

I recall a rather different story. Both Ayr and Berkhampstead were at BWB's Bulls Bridge depot. One was in poor condition and was due to be cut up. However, a mistake was made and the wrong butty was cut up - so they simply swapped the names over on the remaining one.

 

I recall that a subsequent owner sanded down the paint on the fore end and ascertained the true identity of the boat from old lettering, but Pete Harrison will hopefully be along to clarify this in due course.

 

 

Steve

[RLWP]

Mabel and FMN are owned by very good friends of mine.

 

Mabel was partially deconverted several years ago, leaving an extension on the engine room.

 

I have been pestering the owner to deconvert FMN for years.

 

This work was begun but stalled due to domestic problems and has restarted, recently.

 

The hull is in very good condition (though a caulking and blacking is overdue), although there is something not quite right about the back end. There are too many knees, in fairly random places.

 

I think this is due to some unremarkable work, done by Ian Staples.

 

Am I right in thinking that Mabel and Forget-me-not have been pumped out recently? They seemed to move about a bit more than usual today even though the pound is a bit down.

 

Richard

Edited July 11, 2009 by RLWP

[alan_fincher]

I have looked at some (very poor) 1970s photos of Berkhampstead and Ayr.

 

Ayr was paired with Aynho and based at Marsworth to deliver concrete piles, (finally steerer was Billy Brown, I think).

 

Berkhampstead was a maintenance boat (on the Leicester section, I think).

 

I wondered if pictures might turn up any distinguishing feature that could be matched to what can now be seen poking out from the plastic covers.

 

One think I notice about GUCCCo steel boats is that they had, (presumably acquired sometime after new), an extra guard at the top at the front of the hull, wider than the other guards, but extending much less far back, (i.e. only about to the cratch board).

 

Both Bainton and Berkhampstead/Ayr have these guards.

 

Unfortunately the 1970s pictures of the two buttys also show this distinguishing feature.

 

As an aside, does anybody know the circumstances and timing of these being added, (I assume they were added) ?

[carlt]

Am I right in thinking that Mabel and Forget-me-not have been pumped out recently? They seemed to move about a bit more than usual today even though the pound is a bit down.

 

Richard

I don't think so. If they'd sunk I would have been contacted (as keeper of the pumps).

 

They are both on float switches so the draught will hardly change, between self-pumping.

 

The ropes might need tightening.

Edited July 11, 2009 by carlt

[RLWP]

I don't think so. If they'd sunk I would have been contacted (as keeper of the pumps).

 

They are both on float switches so the draught will hardly change, between self-pumping.

 

The ropes might need tightening.

 

Good news. I do like to see them move a bit as we go past. Boats should!

 

Richard

[Steve King]

One think I notice about GUCCCo steel boats is that they had, (presumably acquired sometime after new), an extra guard at the top at the front of the hull, wider than the other guards, but extending much less far back, (i.e. only about to the cratch board).

As an aside, does anybody know the circumstances and timing of these being added, (I assume they were added) ?

Alan, I asked boater Charlie Green about this when we both worked on BWB's Water Bus Service in the late 1970s. He told me that it had been found that when a Town class pair was loaded with the 50-ton or so normal load the hull would be vulnerable thereabouts to contact with concrete banks and so on. So the additional guard was added to give protection in this area. I don't know when they were added though.

 

 

Steve

[alan_fincher]

Alan, I asked boater Charlie Green about this when we both worked on BWB's Water Bus Service in the late 1970s. He told me that it had been found that when a Town class pair was loaded with the 50-ton or so normal load the hull would be vulnerable thereabouts to contact with concrete banks and so on. So the additional guard was added to give protection in this area. I don't know when they were added though.

OK, thanks,

 

Clearly they were not added to all.

 

Initially I thought it was more a butty thing, (perhaps to protect from running into the motor), because quite a lot of pictures seem to show a butty with them, but the motor not.

 

But having looked again, it's fairly random, although clearly it is a modification never retro-fitted to all boats still working.

 

One other thought struck me, BTW. If there is any truth in the suggestion that a subsequent owner has identified it by sanding through the paint layers on the bows, presumably it was GUCCCo paint they had to go back to ? I don't think I have seen pictures of BTC / BW boats carrying a name on the bow, (or am I wrong ?).

[Steve King]

One other thought struck me, BTW. If there is any truth in the suggestion that a subsequent owner has identified it by sanding through the paint layers on the bows, presumably it was GUCCCo paint they had to go back to ? I don't think I have seen pictures of BTC / BW boats carrying a name on the bow, (or am I wrong ?).

Well spotted Alan, and I shouldn't have specified the 'fore end' as I don't know where the paint was sanded back.

 

As you say, if lettering was found on the bows it would be GUCCCo.

 

An additional observation, the fact that the two names in question are of such different lengths might help an identification, viz lettering will be found over a much larger area in the case of Berkhampstead than would be the case with Ayr.

 

 

Steve

[Chertsey]

OK, thanks,

 

Clearly they were not added to all.

 

Initially I thought it was more a butty thing, (perhaps to protect from running into the motor), because quite a lot of pictures seem to show a butty with them, but the motor not.

 

But having looked again, it's fairly random, although clearly it is a modification never retro-fitted to all boats still working.

I was told recently by its owner that only Darley had escaped having the extra guard fitted, on account of not being in possession of its front end at the time. It does seem however that it was unlikely to have been the only one.

[Paul H]

I was told recently by its owner that only Darley had escaped having the extra guard fitted, on account of not being in possession of its front end at the time. It does seem however that it was unlikely to have been the only one.

IIRC the bow of Darley was only cut off when at Matty's when to was converted to the dredger Will Scarlett - the bow remaining on the bank for some years. I don't think BW cut it off.

 

Presumably the extra guards were only added to boats operational at Bulls Bridge at the time it was done and excluded boats on maintenance. Incidentally I remember Berkhamsted on maintenance at Thrupp around 1976.

 

As for the Ayr/Berkhamsted controversy rumours were rife in the early 80s when the cutting up took place - photo by Tam Murrell here. If the story of the name switch is right I doubt it was a mistake - more like the local staff knowing more about which was the worse boat than the bosses. I have seen another picture which seems to show Berkamsted (or at least a big woolwich with a long name) at Bulls Bridge amongst a collection of derelict butties awaiting disposal. Interestingly the two boats it is moored against don't have cabins.

 

But on the otherhand isn't it just a bit too convenient that Bainton and Berkhamsted are an original pair as supplied by Harland and Wolff? Maybe the owner wanted it to be Berkhampsted?

 

Paul H

Edited July 12, 2009 by Paul H