Which sikaflex variant

[GUMPY]

28 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

That's fair enough. We're not doing that here though, and experience on narrowboat roof mounted solar panels through several British winters seems a pretty fair test for the OP's similar application. 

I tapped holes in the roof and bolted my panels down on the boat  using security Torx with a dab of sealant on each bolt.. No reason to use Sikaflex at all unless you have a fibreglass or wooden roof.😱

Edited April 29 by GUMPY

[Peugeot 106]

1 hour ago, blackrose said:

 

I disagree, it's always worked for me. White spirit removes any grease or oil and doesn't leave any significant residue itself - at least none that would present any issue with most single part paints or modified polymer sealants from sticking. I wasn't talking about pouring the stuff on.

 

 

Agreed, I wouldn't use white spirit to wipe over before applying epoxy, but I have used the correct thinners for the epoxy. Likewise for single part paints based on white spirit thinners I've used white spirit as a wipe.

 

Doesn't acetone leave a residue too? 

I’ve always used acetone for epoxy. You can actually thin epoxy with acetone though it’s not recommended. I wipe down for most paints with whatever thinners is applicable for that paint eg white spirit for oil based paints. If I don’t know what to use I generally use acetone. though sometimes panel wipe just because I’ve got it. You can wash acetone off as it’s soluble in water. Anything critical or used a lot I would seek advice off the manufacturer

For cleaning off uncured Sikaflex I use white spirit or decorators big wipes

The pretreatments available for Sikaflex are expensive for small jobs but I have used them on a very fancy hatch I made for a yacht in teak. The teak cost a fortune in any case 20 years ago so I didn’t want anything to go wrong. 

There are so many wonderful adhesives and sealants around now but they can operate far below par if you don’t pretreat/postreat correctly so I think it’s important not to take general advice but to read the data sheets carefully and if necessary contact the manufacturer. I have had my share of “frights” with stuff not going right due to my inappropriate use of wonder chemicals for cleaning, painting, bonding, sealing…..

[magnetman]

PU18 is a pretty good PU sealant/adhesive. Available for a low price if you buy 4. I used it once to stick two pieces of wood together and when I later attempted to separate them it was the wood which split not the sealant bond. 

 

Good stuff. Available on Fleabay. 

 

 

[Sea Dog]

2 hours ago, GUMPY said:

No reason to use Sikaflex at all unless you have a fibreglass or wooden roof.

 In my case, and doubtless others, I did have a reason: I didn't want to drill holes in my roof. The Stixall solution I used has proven to achieve that admirably. YMMV.

[blackrose]

9 hours ago, GUMPY said:

I tapped holes in the roof and bolted my panels down on the boat  using security Torx with a dab of sealant on each bolt.. No reason to use Sikaflex at all unless you have a fibreglass or wooden roof.😱

 

What sealant did you use for the bolts? You must have used some sort of brackets, what were they bedded in with? Likewise mushroom vents, cleats, etc, all need bedding in even on a steel boat. It doesn't need to be sikaflex but if you don't use some sort of waterproof sealant to bed in fittings then on a steel boat water and rust will get underneath. There are some very good modified PU polymer sealants around now which are permanent and silicone is now very much last century technology.

Edited April 29 by blackrose

[RickS]

It does feel like it's getting quite complicated, but I suppose it would if I have no real experience of this.

The idea of the Sikaflex was as a sealant more than an adhesive - although that's a bonus - as I plan to tap into the roof for the triangular panel brackets. Took me a while to be mostly happy with that idea. I don't want water and gunge getting underneath it all and rusting the roof.

Similarly with the bracket onto the wooden cratch, more for a sealant so the wood doesn't rot. Plan to screw the bracket on.

[blackrose]

8 hours ago, Peugeot 106 said:

There are so many wonderful adhesives and sealants around now but they can operate far below par if you don’t pretreat/postreat correctly 

 

Yes it's getting complicated because some people are overcomplicating it.

 

I started using Marineflex 20 years ago when that was just about was the only alternative to Sikaflex. In the last 10 - 15 years or so lots of new PU sealant/adhesives have emerged. I've always found them bulletproof and I've never had a problem with any of them underperforming. Some of these products can even be used on wet surfaces or underwater so I really don't think a little bit of evaporated spirit residue is going to make any difference.

Edited April 29 by blackrose

[GUMPY]

49 minutes ago, blackrose said:

 

What sealant did you use for the bolts? You must have used some sort of brackets, what were they bedded in with? Likewise mushroom vents, cleats, etc, all need bedding in even on a steel boat. It doesn't need to be sikaflex but if you don't use some sort of waterproof sealant to bed in fittings then on a steel boat water and rust will get underneath. There are some very good modified PU polymer sealants around now which are permanent and silicone is now very much last century technology.

Panels were fixed using Z brackets attached to 30x6mm aluminium strip which was bedded on neoprene strip and bolted down to the roof. The only sealant was a dab on the end of each machine screws before insertion. All I remember is it was black so possibly the same as I used on the stove.

No rust after 4 years  when I removed them for the boat to be painted. 

 

[jacko264]

This is getting interesting 

I worked in a body repair shop for 31 years fitting bonded windows /  windscreens 

side panels to busses as well  as lots of other things

we would never use white spirits  turps 

we used  a alcohol cleaner from sika  you can’t afford for a coach screen to fall out

we would also use a sika primer no 206 or 207 on bare metal first

Graham

[Peugeot 106]

3 hours ago, blackrose said:

 

Yes it's getting complicated because some people are overcomplicating it.

 

I started using Marineflex 20 years ago when that was just about was the only alternative to Sikaflex. In the last 10 - 15 years or so lots of new PU sealant/adhesives have emerged. I've always found them bulletproof and I've never had a problem with any of them underperforming. Some of these products can even be used on wet surfaces or underwater so I really don't think a little bit of evaporated spirit residue is going to make any difference.

You I am sure will carry on. I  am suggesting maybe others will take care and take note of data sheets and manufacturers advice. I suggest the OP rings the helpline rather than listen to cloth ear advice from me or you. Sikaflex has a helpline and after all has been around for quite a while now and they should know which degreaser is best

 

i don’t think we are overcomplicating it at all

[David Mack]

12 hours ago, jacko264 said:

This is getting interesting 

I worked in a body repair shop for 31 years fitting bonded windows /  windscreens 

side panels to busses as well  as lots of other things

we would never use white spirits  turps 

we used  a alcohol cleaner from sika  you can’t afford for a coach screen to fall out

we would also use a sika primer no 206 or 207 on bare metal first

Graham

In a commercial environment where you are constantly doing the same job you would use the best product for the particular application. But for a DIYer doing a one-off it can make more sense to use a product which is available and good enough for the task in hand.

[TheBiscuits]

23 minutes ago, David Mack said:

In a commercial environment where you are constantly doing the same job you would use the best product for the particular application. But for a DIYer doing a one-off it can make more sense to use a product which is available and good enough for the task in hand.

 

True, but the"good enough" bit is important.

 

With modern sealants and epoxies, there's a lot more chemistry involved than the old "white spirit or water" paint thinner choices.

 

It's probably better to not wipe the surface than to wipe with something that will negatively affect the product being used.

 

All else has failed: read the instructions!  

[GUMPY]

7 hours ago, David Mack said:

 But for a DIYer doing a one-off it can make more sense to use a product which is available and good enough for the task in hand.

Depends if you want a bodge job, like many narrowboat jobs are, or a job done properly. 🤔