Engine Bilge question

[JonA66]

Hi there, thanks for letting me join!

We have a 1988 50' narrowboat built by Colecraft with Thornycroft engine. The bilge pump was replaced a few years ago by previous owner and it seems to be set in a tank below the prop shaft. It seems to work fine, but there is a small amount of water in the engine bay which I can't see will be pumped out as it wont get into the tank. The tank is bolted to the wall of the engine bay, so it looks like it has been put there on purpose. Just wondered if this is usual / OK?

 

Thanks in advance - picture for reference.

[JoeC]

It is not a standard setup. They are using the tub and bilge pump to remove the water drips from the stern gland - this saves the water going into the engine bay. However, there needs to be another pump in the bay.

[Tacet]

The small tank and pump are there to address the drips from the stern gland.  

 

The pump won't remove water from outside the tank, which has come from elsewhere. For what it's worth, a bilge pump leaves a little water behind in any event.

 

If you want the bilges bone dry, you'll need to get busy with a bucket and sponge.  The water may return, of course.

[Bod]

 

Is the bilge water shown in the photo, able to get under the engine and mix with any oil leaked from the engine?

There should be a separate engine bilge area that cannot be pumped overboard, for pollution reasons.

Also is this a Trad, or cruiser stern?

 

Bod.

[PeterF]

The usual route for the other water is rain water which runs off the deck boards into the gutters the deck boards sit on. These gutters often have small drain piped 20mm or so diameter that block with dead leaves, mud, grit etc so you need to keep these drains clear. Also, there may be some leaks in the gutters. You also get water running along the bottom of the deck board which gets through the gaps between the deck boards and the gutters even if there are no leaks in the gutters and the drains work. I have put strips of seld adhesive foam rubber under the edhe of my deck boards that seals against the gutters, it works well but is still not 100% infallible.

[Grassman]

When I first bought my boat years ago (cruiser stern) I used to worry about water in the engine bilge. I have a plastic tub under the propshaft similar to yours, I vigilantly keep the deck drain channels and holes clear of debris, and I fitted new deck boards, but I still get some water in there.

 

It seems that many other boaters have the same issues, and I believe that the damage caused to the steelwork is so negligible I no longer worry about it. If you're new to boating I can assure you that in future you will have far more pressing matters to worry about!

[magnetman]

Sponge or disposable nappies for the extra water might be easiest. 

 

If you don't want to get in there you could get a litter picker and use that to put the nappies down. 

 

[MtB]

43 minutes ago, Tacet said:

If you want the bilges bone dry, you'll need to get busy with a bucket and sponge. 

 

A better thing for this is a wet vac. 

 

I use the battery powered Milwaukee M18.

 

https://www.screwfix.com/p/milwaukee-m18-vc2-0-18v-li-ion-cordless-wet-dry-vacuum-bare/867fj

 

[magnetman]

Not seen those before. Handy boat toy! 

[MtB]

2 minutes ago, magnetman said:

Not seen those before. Handy boat toy! 

 

Brilliant devices, they work on oil and diesel too.

 

Although I suspect if one caught fire sucking up oil or diesel and the user tried to blame Milwaukee, they might quibble about it...

 

 

 

[Slim]

57 minutes ago, JoeC said:

It is not a standard setup. They are using the tub and bilge pump to remove the water drips from the stern gland - this saves the water going into the engine bay. However, there needs to be another pump in the bay.

No. Never put a pump in the engine bilge.

[magnetman]

The engine will have a separate closed drip tray. I don't believe adding a washing up tub under the stern gland will pass the BS requirement for the engine drip tray. 

 

 

 

Having said that the water does look a bit oily. 

[MtB]

1 hour ago, JonA66 said:

 

Thanks in advance - picture for reference.

 

 

I've never seen a stern gland like this either. Is it some sort of home-brew? 

 

 

[magnetman]

If it is a cruiser starn with leaky deck boards a situation can arise where the engine drip tray gets filled with rain water and overflows into the general bilge area contaminating it with oil. 

2 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

 

I've never seen a stern gland like this either. Is it some sort of home-brew? 

 

 

I had one of these on a narrow Boat. It was brilliant. Best stern gland I've had on any of my Boats. It just worked never any trouble and I did thousands of hours motoring with that Boat. 

 

It wasn't a colecraft it was made by Tony Gregory Marine. 

Edited December 17, 2023 by magnetman

[StephenA]

9 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

 

I've never seen a stern gland like this either. Is it some sort of home-brew? 

 

 

 

Thats exactly the same as the stern gland that Mintball has fitted when it was built in 1986. It was replaced last year when it finally wore out (We had done 1000s of miles on it)

Edited December 17, 2023 by StephenA

[magnetman]

My boat was a 1986 build as well. 

[StephenA]

2 minutes ago, magnetman said:

My boat was a 1986 build as well. 

Interesting - were Crowthers involved at any stage?

[blackrose]

1 hour ago, magnetman said:

disposable nappies for the extra water might be easiest. 

 

Chuck some cheap nappies down there, leave them for a few days, then pull them out like bags of water. Definitely the easiest way to remove small amounts of bilge water. For larger quantities treat yourself to a wetvac - assuming you have shore power, a generator or a decent inverter. I recently replaced my 16 year old wetvac that stopped working with a new one from Screwfix for 50 quid. It's brilliant. I wouldn't be without one on a boat.

Edited December 17, 2023 by blackrose

[magnetman]

Yes I would use supermarket own brand not Pampers or Huggies for this. 

 

For wet vacs MtB pointed out they do cordless versions. Potentially interesting for someone who already has other tools with the batteries. 

 

Not sure how much actual liquid they hold. 

 

 

7.5 litre for the Makita apparently and it will run orf batteries OR direct via AC adapter. Interesting ! 

 

https://www.powertool-supplies.co.uk/makita-dvc750lz-18v-lxt-bl-7.5l-l-class-wet-dry-vacuum-cleaner-body-only.html

Not cheap £140 body only but Makita generally pretty good stuff. 

 

Now where is father christmas. 

[JonA66]

1 hour ago, JoeC said:

It is not a standard setup. They are using the tub and bilge pump to remove the water drips from the stern gland - this saves the water going into the engine bay. However, there needs to be another pump in the bay.

Ahh thanks that makes sense. I dont think there is another pump unless it is well hidden. I'll check next time aboard. thanks

[JonA66]

1 hour ago, Tacet said:

The small tank and pump are there to address the drips from the stern gland.  

 

The pump won't remove water from outside the tank, which has come from elsewhere. For what it's worth, a bilge pump leaves a little water behind in any event.

 

If you want the bilges bone dry, you'll need to get busy with a bucket and sponge.  The water may return, of course.

Perfect - bucket looks like the solution! thanks

[JonA66]

1 hour ago, Bod said:

 

Is the bilge water shown in the photo, able to get under the engine and mix with any oil leaked from the engine?

There should be a separate engine bilge area that cannot be pumped overboard, for pollution reasons.

Also is this a Trad, or cruiser stern?

 

Bod.

Hi Bod

 

Semi trad and no, there is a seperated section of the bilge with a tray that collects any leaked oil etc 

 

Thanks 

1 hour ago, Grassman said:

When I first bought my boat years ago (cruiser stern) I used to worry about water in the engine bilge. I have a plastic tub under the propshaft similar to yours, I vigilantly keep the deck drain channels and holes clear of debris, and I fitted new deck boards, but I still get some water in there.

 

It seems that many other boaters have the same issues, and I believe that the damage caused to the steelwork is so negligible I no longer worry about it. If you're new to boating I can assure you that in future you will have far more pressing matters to worry about!

hahaha thanks so much - that is so true. We are 6 months in and just working through the never ending list of things that keep cropping up. Have to say I am loving it

1 hour ago, MtB said:

 

A better thing for this is a wet vac. 

 

I use the battery powered Milwaukee M18.

 

https://www.screwfix.com/p/milwaukee-m18-vc2-0-18v-li-ion-cordless-wet-dry-vacuum-bare/867fj

 

Ahh thanks was thinking of getting one of those as well, saw some which are only a tenner, but I am guessing this one actually works?

[magnetman]

35 minutes ago, StephenA said:

Interesting - were Crowthers involved at any stage?

That I don't know. Its quite possible but as I had the boat secondhand I did not have that sort of detail. Nothing in the paperwork about it. 

 

[Momac]

1 hour ago, Bod said:

 

There should be a separate engine bilge area that cannot be pumped overboard, for pollution reasons.

Alternatively a special filter which traps oil may be fitted on the outlet pipe from the bilge pump.

[Rebotco]

I gave up using a wet vac on my cruiser stern.  It is designed to have a wet bilge, and and takes multiple empties with a vac.

It does have an automatic bilge pump, but this still leaves about 2" of water.

So now I also use a cheapie small bilge pump fixed to the end of a stick, with crocodile clips to temporarily attach to the domestic batteries.  I also use a longish piece of hose, which will reach the far side of the towpath.  So I just dip the pump into the bilge and it runs continuously, with no emptying of a vac., until I'm happy with the result.  If there is a bit of oil as well, it doesn't much matter as its not going into the cut.  I find this most useful for emptying the bulk of the engine tray especially, as this cannot be dealt with automatically.