Hot ash setting of the carbon monoxide detector?

[manxmike]

34 minutes ago, MartynG said:

Where does that advice come from please ?

 

Do they?

 

Years of marshaling motorbike racing and being trained as a fire marshal.

Yes they do have use by dates -take a look at yours (if you have one)

2 hours ago, MtB said:

 

Check them six or seven times on arrival to catch up, perhaps? 

Ooh, sarcasm, the highest form of wit!

 

[ditchcrawler]

2 hours ago, manxmike said:

Years of marshaling motorbike racing and being trained as a fire marshal.

Yes they do have use by dates -take a look at yours (if you have one)

 

 

Sorry not all do have a use by date on them, even the BSS takes this into account.
As for powder going hard that was a problem we had Offshore with the drypowder extinguishers in the accommodation. If just left sitting in the corner, when they were discharged after 3 years only a small amount of powder would com out and leave a cavity around the dip tube. We had it as a 3 monthly service item to invert and shake on inspection. They were inspected weekly. Most extinguishers you find on Narrowboats are fully pressured and don't have a dip tube so can be used in any orientation but the powder can still compact with vibration.

[Momac]

2 hours ago, manxmike said:

 

Yes they do have use by dates -take a look at yours (if you have one)

I have quite a few fire extinguishers  , as do mot people on this forum. The extinguishers I have  don't have use by date but they do have a date of manufacture.

Comparison with marshalling motor racing isn't really appropriate . The consequences may be similar but the risk is much higher with motor racing. As a more appropriate comparison how  often should fire extinguishers be inspected in an office or a hotel for example? Once  a month for  a visual inspection perhaps. 

[Alan de Enfield]

8 minutes ago, MartynG said:

.......... often should fire extinguishers be inspected in an office or a hotel for example? Once  a month for  a visual inspection perhaps. 

 

Ours are never 'inspected', they are simply serviced on an annual basis by a Fire Extinguisher sevicing company (they are Co2, Water and dry Powder). The annual sevicing is an insurance requirement and each extinguisher is marked with the date of service and a signature of the service 'engineer'.

[IanD]

9 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Ours are never 'inspected', they are simply serviced on an annual basis by a Fire Extinguisher sevicing company (they are Co2, Water and dry Powder). The annual sevicing is an insurance requirement and each extinguisher is marked with the date of service and a signature of the service 'engineer'.

 

What's the context of "ours" -- boat, house, business... ?

 

I've never heard of house and boat insurers make annual servicing a requirement...

[Alan de Enfield]

1 minute ago, IanD said:

 

What's the context of "ours" -- boat, house, business... ?

 

I've never heard of house and boat insurers make annual servicing a requirement...

 

The question asked, and to which I replied, was about 'business fire extinguishers'.

[Momac]

23 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

 

I've never heard of house and boat insurers make annual servicing a requirement...

Nor me

 

Also 

Insurers don't require the owner or anyone else  to fight a fire.

And sea boats are not required to have any fire extinguisher 

[Alan de Enfield]

24 minutes ago, MartynG said:

And sea boats are not required to have any fire extinguisher 

 

Maybe worth reading your insurance 'small print'.

 

I have 2 policies for my 'lumpy water' boats (with different insurers) and both have a similar clause that applies to any boat capable of exceeding 17 knts.

 

4.3 Your Insurers will not pay any claim for:

 

4:3:1

 

4:3:2

 

4.3.3 loss, damage, liability or any salvage services caused by or arising from fire or explosion if Your Craft is fitted with inboard Machinery unless Your Craft is fitted with:

        4.3.3.1 a remote controlled (the controls must be operated from the steering position) or automatic Fire Extinguishing             System in the engine compartment and if possible the tank space; and

 

        4.3.3.2 manually operated Fire Extinguishers and a fire blanket in the galley area

 

Edited November 10, 2023 by Alan de Enfield

[GUMPY]

Not even @IanD electric narrowboat could reach 17knots even with the wind and tide behind it.

[IanD]

4 minutes ago, GUMPY said:

Not even @IanD electric narrowboat could reach 17knots even with the wind and tide behind it.

Bet it could over Niagara Falls... 😉

[Alan de Enfield]

Just now, GUMPY said:

Not even @IanD electric narrowboat could reach 17knots even with the wind and tide behind it.

 

The difference being sea-going boats are not subject to the BSS, whilst NBs (generally) are, the BSS specifies the size, type and number of extinguishers.

 

For sea going boats (and any others) the Insurers are at liberty to require whatever safety measure they like - if you don't accept them, find another insurer without those requirements, or don't bother with insurance at all. There is no requirement to have insurance 'at sea', but I think that all marinas will require evidence of cover before allowing you to take a mooring.

[system 4-50]

I kept my powder extinguishers suspended by a cord on a pulley on the ceiling down to the bedframe.  As long as you have a reasonable love life this keeps them sufficiently shaken.

[IanD]

1 minute ago, system 4-50 said:

I kept my powder extinguishers suspended by a cord on a pulley on the ceiling down to the bedframe.  As long as you have a reasonable love life this keeps them sufficiently shaken.

So long as you don't get too enthusiastic and set them off. Could give a whole new meaning to "powdering your nose"... 😉

[Hudds Lad]

1 minute ago, IanD said:

Could give a whole new meaning to "powdering your nose"... 😉

They've already tried that with the bathrooms in the Houses of Parliament  

[GUMPY]

18 minutes ago, IanD said:

Bet it could over Niagara Falls... 😉

Have you done the calculations 🤔

[Momac]

27 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Maybe worth reading your insurance 'small print'.

 

I have 2 policies for my 'lumpy water' boats (with different insurers) and both have a similar clause that applies to any boat capable of exceeding 17 knts.

 

4.3 Your Insurers will not pay any claim for:

 

4:3:1

 

4:3:2

 

4.3.3 loss, damage, liability or any salvage services caused by or arising from fire or explosion if Your Craft is fitted with inboard Machinery unless Your Craft is fitted with:

        4.3.3.1 a remote controlled (the controls must be operated from the steering position) or automatic Fire Extinguishing             System in the engine compartment and if possible the tank space; and

 

        4.3.3.2 manually operated Fire Extinguishers and a fire blanket in the galley area

 

That's a fair point. You are correct its an insurance requirement . But strictly speaking a sea boat is not required to be insured.

On the other hand most sea boats don't do more then 17kts

[Alan de Enfield]

6 minutes ago, MartynG said:

That's a fair point. You are correct its an insurance requirement . But strictly speaking a sea boat is not required to be insured.

On the other hand most sea boats don't do more then 17kts

 

I think yours does, and certainly all planing boats do, my Fairline cruised at about 18knts and top speed of 26 knots. Even my Bayliner and Benateau 'trailer boats' all exceeded 17 kts.

[IanD]

12 minutes ago, GUMPY said:

Have you done the calculations 🤔

Sometimes you don't need to, just look up how fast the water goes over them... 😉

[Momac]

11 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

I think yours does, and certainly all planing boats do, my Fairline cruised at about 18knts and top speed of 26 knots. Even my Bayliner and Benateau 'trailer boats' all exceeded 17 kts.

Yes but thats not "most" boats.

[ditchcrawler]

2 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

The difference being sea-going boats are not subject to the BSS, whilst NBs (generally) are, the BSS specifies the size, type and number of extinguishers.

 

The minimum size and number or a specific type  

[Alan de Enfield]

3 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

The minimum size and number or a specific type  

 

Specific for the engine room - automatic or being able to be operated from the helm.

 

Our Cat does not exceed 17knts so does not require auto-extinguishers, but is has a 'spy-hole' in both back-cabins so that in order to avoid a big 'blow-back' if you lift the engine hatches (one in each hull) the 'spy-hole' can be pushed out and you can direct an extinguisher hose into the engine room.

 

For the Galley, our insurers simply say there must be an extinguisher and a fire blanket.

 

As we (most of us) know, a fire extinguisher is generally not to be used to fight the fire, but to clear an escape route - however with sea going boats, being potentially 100s of miles from land you should try to keep the boat afloat if possible - without endagering yourself. It is easier for the rescue services to find a boat than a liferaft or just a human head in the water.

[ditchcrawler]

14 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Specific for the engine room - automatic or being able to be operated from the helm.

 

Our Cat does not exceed 17knts so does not require auto-extinguishers, but is has a 'spy-hole' in both back-cabins so that in order to avoid a big 'blow-back' if you lift the engine hatches (one in each hull) the 'spy-hole' can be pushed out and you can direct an extinguisher hose into the engine room.

 

For the Galley, our insurers simply say there must be an extinguisher and a fire blanket.

 

As we (most of us) know, a fire extinguisher is generally not to be used to fight the fire, but to clear an escape route - however with sea going boats, being potentially 100s of miles from land you should try to keep the boat afloat if possible - without endagering yourself. It is easier for the rescue services to find a boat than a liferaft or just a human head in the water.

My comment was in reply to what the BSS required 

 "the BSS specifies the size, type and number of extinguishers."

 

 

 

[MtB]

6 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Well mine did, and they passed the BSS examiner in 2019

 

That's a "Valid until" date, after which they need to be chucked or re-certified.

 

There is no obligation to actually use them by that date!

[Momac]

17 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

That's a "Valid until" date, after which they need to be chucked or re-certified.

 

There is no obligation to actually use them by that date!

I think we all knew that .

Same applies to food where a 'use by' date is commonly seen. No one forces you to eat it.

[Alan de Enfield]

45 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

My comment was in reply to what the BSS required 

 "the BSS specifies the size, type and number of extinguishers."

 

 

 

 

Yes - they have to reach a certain (total) A/B rating, each  extinguisher must be a minimum rating of 5A/34B, they specify that Halon is illegal to use on board and that the dangers of CO2 means they 'suggest' it is not used. They go onto say :

 

The BSS requires each portable fire extinguisher to be capable of tackling both Class A and Class B fires (the main classes of fires experienced on small craft) and so the choice is currently limited to foam, powder and a limited number of wet chemical, clean agent and water mist extinguishers.