Stop dumping ash!

[Tracy D'arth]

29 minutes ago, Maffi said:

He didn't say I was speeding. He said I didn't slow down. I did slow down, but not as much as he deemed necessary. I do not do tick-over when there is a mile or more of moored boats.

Is it a measured mile? How do you know if the moorings exceed a mile in length? There are not many continuous mooring sites that are over a mile long, therefore by your own admission you should always be slowing to tickover when passing moored boats at a site less than a mile long.

[Tracy D'arth]

On 20/03/2021 at 18:29, Parahandy said:

You want to forget about the Ash and concentrate on slowing down for moored Boats the next time you are passing through Milton Keynes . I had cause to remonstrate with you some

time back in a restrained way I may add as you had a female present , you on the other hand had an appalling attitude . 

You are not alone in remonstrating with this inconsiderate and foul mouthed person, I know of 2 more who have had reason to ask him to slow and be considerate.

[Maffi]

3 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

But, why not?

  Its manners to not cause annoyance. What difference is there between one boat and a mile of moorings?  None in my view, I slow down properly and make friends, you do not, and make enemies.

 

Who is right?

The rule is 'slow past moored boats'. And I do slow down. How much I slow down depends on how wide the canal is and how deep. If I am forced by width to travel close to boats I slow down more than if the canal is wide and I can travel 10/20 feet away. As the master of my vessel it is for me to apply the rules, not you or any of the cuckoos who pop out of their side hatch.

 

People with slack ropes who shout slow down cause annoyance! Why do people on boats get annoyed if the boat rocks? If they dont like their boat moving they have choices. Learn to tie their boat up properly or get a house. It's even easier than Rocket science!

 

I make plenty of friends on the canals thank you very much.

22 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Is it a measured mile? How do you know if the moorings exceed a mile in length? There are not many continuous mooring sites that are over a mile long, therefore by your own admission you should always be slowing to tickover when passing moored boats at a site less than a mile long.

You are being very petty!

[Arthur Marshall]

25 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Is it a measured mile? How do you know if the moorings exceed a mile in length? There are not many continuous mooring sites that are over a mile long, therefore by your own admission you should always be slowing to tickover when passing moored boats at a site less than a mile long.

The one I ran into a lot was the Golden Nook mooring at the top of the Shroppie, which must be well over a mile now, and I would slow to about 2mph for it. The other end of the Shroppie is nearly as bad. If someone chooses to moor along such a stretch I don't think it's too much to ask that they use a couple of springs and do it properly. Almost none do.

Tickover is probably half a mile an hour, and I rarely go past anyone that slow, as the steering goes to pot, especially in a wind.

 

Edited March 26, 2021 by Arthur Marshall

[Maffi]

39 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Its a throwback remark to before you were born when men had better manners and were respectful of the fairer sex. I always remember my mum saying how " silly " womens libbers were as she liked it when a gentleman doffed his cap to her or opened a door in a polite manner. Men and indeed boys would get up if a bus was full for a lady to sit down if there were no seats left, I have done it myself in the sixties for instance wheras today the lad with his back to front cap on would have his feet on the opposite seat. It is a throwback to a time when police women 5 feet tall weighing 8 stone were not linked arm to arm to 6ft 5 inch 20 stone men in a riot situation. A throwback to when women had babies instead of today when we hear the silly term " We " are having a baby  

We are progressing very quickly in a backward manner and the list is endless.

YO! Mr Smelly how the devil are you old chap?

23 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

You are not alone in remonstrating with this inconsiderate and foul mouthed person, I know of 2 more who have had reason to ask him to slow and be considerate.

If you dont have names it didn't happen!

[Thomas C King]

12 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

Tickover is probably half a mile an hour, and I rarely go past anyone that slow, as the steering goes to pot, especially in a wind.

 

When I knew less than I do now I was overly concerned at going at tick-over, and I got a proper bollocking for not going fast enough (the wind pushed me into another boat). Now, I wouldn't go as far as Maffi to say that it's up to the individual to apply the rules, that's not really how rules work, but there is something to be said about there just being far too many variables for such a blanket rule to be of any use. I'm still a newbie, but these days I try to apply common sense.

 

I think the key is to learn to be a bit calmer about people not doing things exactly as you would. Some people go faster than me, some people bump my boat, and most of the time it's fine. I save my ire for drunk nutters (the most memorable being a hire boater going as fast as they could under a bridge and glancing off the bow of another hire boater).

[Maffi]

12 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

 

When I knew less than I do now I was overly concerned at going at tick-over, and I got a proper bollocking for not going fast enough (the wind pushed me into another boat). Now, I wouldn't go as far as Maffi to say that it's up to the individual to apply the rules, that's not really how rules work, but there is something to be said about there just being far too many variables for such a blanket rule to be of any use. I'm still a newbie, but these days I try to apply common sense.

 

I think the key is to learn to be a bit calmer about people not doing things exactly as you would. Some people go faster than me, some people bump my boat, and most of the time it's fine. I save my ire for drunk nutters (the most memorable being a hire boater going as fast as they could under a bridge and glancing off the bow of another hire boater).

Sorry I have to take you to task.  I said, "As the master of my vessel it is for me to apply the rules, not you or any of the cuckoos who pop out of their side hatch." Now if any of the cuckoos have a problem with me and how I handle my boat they can take down my registration number, which is clearly displayed on my vessel in accordance with the terms and conditions of my licence, and report me to CRT they are the governing authority not Joe Boater.

 

[Maffi]

44 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

The one I ran into a lot was the Golden Nook mooring at the top of the Shroppie, which must be well over a mile now, and I would slow to about 2mph for it. The other end of the Shroppie is nearly as bad. If someone chooses to moor along such a stretch I don't think it's too much to ask that they use a couple of springs and do it properly. Almost none do.

Tickover is probably half a mile an hour, and I rarely go past anyone that slow, as the steering goes to pot, especially in a wind.

 

I've been there and done that. That's when I finally decided that tick-over was not really feasible!

[Thomas C King]

11 minutes ago, Maffi said:

Sorry I have to take you to task.  I said, "As the master of my vessel it is for me to apply the rules, not you or any of the cuckoos who pop out of their side hatch." Now if any of the cuckoos have a problem with me and how I handle my boat they can take down my registration number, which is clearly displayed on my vessel in accordance with the terms and conditions of my licence, and report me to CRT they are the governing authority not Joe Boater.

 

So, it's not for you to apply the rules, it's the CRT...

 

And in general, social norms are for everyone to apply.

[Midnight]

The problem is of course no matter how fast or slow you travel past moored boats there's always some whinging bugger who just wants to vent their anger.
I once passed a boat at Preston Brook after drifting for about 200 yards out of gear. The hatch flew open and nugget shouts "Slow Down" when I explained I was out of gear waiting to get into Claymoore's yard the hatch closed as fast as it opened. I do usually drop down to tick-over about 1 mph but still get the occasional rebuke.

[Maffi]

3 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

So, it's not for you to apply the rules, it's the CRT...

 

And in general, social norms are for everyone to apply.

Sorry did I not explain that properly or did I say it in Swahili? "As the master of my vessel it is for me to apply the rules, not you or any of the cuckoos who pop out of their side hatch!" So its my vessel and it is my responsibility to apply the rules laid down by the CRT. If CRT dont like what I am doing they will tell me I am doing it wrong not the numpties! Clear enough?

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Midnight said:

The problem is of course no matter how fast or slow you travel past moored boats there's always some whinging bugger who just wants to vent their anger.
I once passed a boat at Preston Brook after drifting for about 200 yards out of gear. The hatch flew open and nugget shouts "Slow Down" when I explained I was out of gear waiting to get into Claymoore's yard the hatch closed as fast as it opened. I do usually drop down to tick-over about 1 mph but still get the occasional rebuke.

 

Try passing moored boats in a hire boat. No matter how ruddy slow you go some nugget will always leap out and tell you 'slow down'. It's like a watching a condition response you see in a dog sometimes.

 

'See hire boat must shout, slow down'.

[Thomas C King]

4 minutes ago, Maffi said:

Sorry did I not explain that properly or did I say it in Swahili? "As the master of my vessel it is for me to apply the rules, not you or any of the cuckoos who pop out of their side hatch!" So its my vessel and it is my responsibility to apply the rules laid down by the CRT. If CRT dont like what I am doing they will tell me I am doing it wrong not the numpties! Clear enough?

 

It's your responsibility to abide by the rules, not to apply or enforce them.

[Arthur Marshall]

11 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

So, it's not for you to apply the rules, it's the CRT...

 

And in general, social norms are for everyone to apply.

No, CRT make the rules  or, as in the case of passing speeds, the advice, but it's the boater that applies them by waggling the Morse control. And social norms vary from one bit of society to another, and, again, you pick and choose which ones you adhere to.

But even if everyone on here agreed that we were all going to pass boats at tickover, we'd all still be going at different speeds and some people who can't moor properly would still yell at you. And some people would speed their tickovers up....

3 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

 

It's your responsibility to abide by the rules, not to apply or enforce them.

Rules is rules, advice is advice. It is not compulsory to abide by either.

[Thomas C King]

2 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

No, CRT make the rules  or, as in the case of passing speeds, the advice, but it's the boater that applies them by waggling the Morse control. And social norms vary from one bit of society to another, and, again, you pick and choose which ones you adhere to.

But even if everyone on here agreed that we were all going to pass boats at tickover, we'd all still be going at different speeds and some people who can't moor properly would still yell at you. And some people would speed their tickovers up....

The application of rules normally refers to enforcement. Here by rule we mean a social norm in the technical sense, which is considered to be a rule that imposes some kind of (directed) obligation, and may be related to other rules including ones that apply a sanction. This 'sanctioning'/punishment is what I took the OP to have issue with, it's not up to others to apply rules and hence sanctions... well, actually it is, that's how social norms work.

 

If I'm using completely different terminology from others, that's fine, feel free to ignore, technical terms might not correspond with common parlance.

[ditchcrawler]

29 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

So, it's not for you to apply the rules, it's the CRT...

 

And in general, social norms are for everyone to apply.

Which RULE are we talking about.

[Wanderer Vagabond]

The problem is that 'tick-over' means different speeds on different boats. I am never in any great rush to get anywhere so am quite content to set the throttle at it's slowest speed when passing moored boats and yet there have been several occasions when, even when set at its slowest, I still catch up with boats ahead of me who are capable of far slower speeds than my boat will do and remain in 'drive'. What this invariably means is that I end out repeatedly putting the boat into gear and then out of gear to maintain distance behind them. This does neither my drive plate, nor my patience, much good. The only solution to go any slower would be to get myself a horse, and I would guess that even then there would be some who would complain about excess speed.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

 The only solution to go any slower would be to get myself a horse, and I would guess that even then there would be some who would complain about excess speed.

 

....... and the horse poo on the towpath.

[Athy]

9 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

The problem is that 'tick-over' means different speeds on different boats. I am never in any great rush to get anywhere so am quite content to set the throttle at it's slowest speed when passing moored boats and yet there have been several occasions when, even when set at its slowest, I still catch up with boats ahead of me who are capable of far slower speeds than my boat will do and remain in 'drive'.

Yes, same here. There have been occasions when we've been following another boat and, despite being at minimum tickover, have to keep going into neutral to avoid ramming them up the backside.

[Arthur Marshall]

45 minutes ago, Athy said:

Yes, same here. There have been occasions when we've been following another boat and, despite being at minimum tickover, have to keep going into neutral to avoid ramming them up the backside.

I have a theory that a boat in front of you causes drag, so that it actually pulls you along, which is why, however slow you try to go, you always catch them up - but then, if you overtake, you never get far ahead of them.

It certainly happens when driving cars close behind lorries, for example, so, if in air, why not in water?

The effect used to raise my frustration level to danger level, but old age has brought at least a tinge of wisdom and now I just bung the boat on the mud for a bit and have a cup of tea, keeping an eye out in case a boat approaches from the rear, when off I go again...

[Thomas C King]

10 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

I have a theory that a boat in front of you causes drag, so that it actually pulls you along, which is why, however slow you try to go, you always catch them up - but then, if you overtake, you never get far ahead of them.

It certainly happens when driving cars close behind lorries, for example, so, if in air, why not in water?

The effect used to raise my frustration level to danger level, but old age has brought at least a tinge of wisdom and now I just bung the boat on the mud for a bit and have a cup of tea, keeping an eye out in case a boat approaches from the rear, when off I go again...

 

Sounds plausible. But like in air, isn't there also the possibility of the opposite with turbulence increasing drag?

[ditchcrawler]

1 hour ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

  The only solution to go any slower would be to get myself a horse, and I would guess that even then there would be some who would complain about excess speed.

That would be no good, all the moored boats would foul the towing line

1 hour ago, Athy said:

Yes, same here. There have been occasions when we've been following another boat and, despite being at minimum tickover, have to keep going into neutral to avoid ramming them up the backside.

I have had that problem in both Blisworth, Wasthill and Netherton tunnels

[roland elsdon]

1 hour ago, The Happy Nomad said:

 

....... and the horse poo on the towpath.

Which would require a bucket of ash to cover over. Solve 2 issues in one.

[David Mack]

38 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

I have a theory that a boat in front of you causes drag, so that it actually pulls you along, 

And is termed 'draughting' by runners, cyclists and swimmers.

[ditchcrawler]

2 minutes ago, David Mack said:

And is termed 'draughting' by runners, cyclists and swimmers.

I always thought it was slipstreaming