Scumble - Latest Situation?

[alan_fincher]

We may need to do some scumble-work soon.

 

I'm aware the former Ratcliffe's oil based products ceased production, and I believe that when a new Ratcliffe's branded product did appear it was probably a very different formulation.

 

I'm sure some people reported difficulties with it.

 

If I Google around now, I find references like on this web page.....

 

Because of some complaints in the industry about this product's performance since it's recent reformulation, we have introduced a new product Polyvine Pre-tinted Traditional Oil Scumble which also uses a traditional solvent-borne formulation with extended drying times.

 

 

So is Polyvine Oil Scumble now the recommened approach, please, and how have people fared with it, (or anything else) they have used.

 

Our level of experience is "zero", so would be self confessed "numptys" trying to work out how it is done.

[pippawatson]

_{I've used the Polyvine. It was different in that it seemed more like a straight tinted varnish rather than having the solids content of Ratcliffe's but it grained up OK.}

_{The results were fine though and the person I did the job for was pleased.}

_{My guess is that if you can use Ratcliffe's you'll get on with Polyvine.}

 

_{Get some practice in on plain boards, then small items, then other peoples boats(!) first.}

 

 

 

 

 

 

_{(Aren't I a clever dog)}

Edited January 7, 2015 by pippawatson

[alan_fincher]

My guess is that if you can use Ratcliffe's you'll get on with Polyvine.

No idea if we could use Ratcliffe's having never tried!

 

Get some practice in on plain boards, then small items, then other peoples boats

How would a boat we are planning to sell do?

 

(Aren't I a clever dog)[/size][/sub]

Woould we have more success if we put Odin in charge of scumbling, then?

[bizzard]

I once watched a painter scumbling a pubs paneled door. He didn't muck about with any specialized scumbling stuff he just whacked on county cream, then a gloss brown then a few streaks of black and maroon and then got to work with his combs and a scrubbing brush. It was brilliant and all done in about 20 minutes.

[Leo No2]

Alan - you can purchase oil based scumble (and all the tools) - sorry cannot remember the brand - from Wharf House Narrowboats in Braunston.

[Ray T]

In his book "Colours for Cruisers" John M Hill has a section on scumbling.

 

 

 

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Colours-Cruisers-John-M-Hill/dp/090536628X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1420666737&sr=8-1&keywords=colours+for+cruisers+john+m+hill

 

 

The pages are a direct copy of his pages in his similar book on working boats

Edited January 7, 2015 by Ray T

[dave moore]

Alan

 

I'm happy to advise, I've used Ratcliffes for years and Polyvine more recently, but I'd prefer to speak rather than type. If you don't have my numbers, PM me

 

Dave

[Texasboater]

YouTube has video's showing the technique.

[MtB]

I did MILES odf scumbling on Aldy last summer, it all came out brilliantly though I say so myself.

 

Best comment was from a gongoozler who asked what I was doing. I explained I was painting on woodgrain pattern to make it look like wood. He looked perplexed and said 'but it's already wood you're painting on'. So I explained again, that I was painting woodgrain pattern on steel, and he repeated his comment... so I gave up!

 

I was using Polyvine, straight from the tin. No diluting like with oil based Ratcliffes. Water based Ratcliffes is a waste of money and time.

 

MtB

[dave moore]

Polyvine raw with stain added isn't far off treacle. You must have had fun working it into corners and brushing it out!

 

Dave

[Laurence Hogg]

I was lucky enough to have been taught about scumbling by Harold Hood the foreman of the Anderton Dock. His house in Stoke was a marvel of the art.

But both he and Jess Owen at Charity dock used to make up their own scumble from a variety of base compounds basically mixed and ground up in Linseed oil.

Whilst I have used Ratcliffes with great results I have also made up my own base and used that with terrific success, coffee, burnt sugar, various powder paints etc can be mixed and used, as long as its touch dry to apply the varnish then away you go. I have a basic set of German steel combs, two rollers and a knotting tool, alongside this odd bits of rag, a corn plaster (Harold Hood idea) and various everyday items make the patterns. Its great fun and if you don't like it wipe it off and start again.

[mark99]

Tony Lewery's video is quite comprehensive re technique.

 

Dave, re your external scumbling, I do like it when passers by ask "what wood is the rear panel".

 

I tap it (so it rings) with the tiller pin and say "steel wood".

 

 

Image by ChrisB.

Edited January 8, 2015 by mark99

[MtB]

Polyvine raw with stain added isn't far off treacle. You must have had fun working it into corners and brushing it out!

 

Dave

 

Not the Polyvine I was buying. It is about the consistency of single cream straight from the tin and needed hardly any thinning or preparation.

 

The downside of this was needing to buy several tins of the stuff (at about £15 each IIRC)

 

 

MtB

[dave moore]

Ah! The scumble I buy is untinted, comes in 1 litre tins and requires the addition of appropriate stainer to achieve the desired colour. It then needs thinning, I prefer an almost watery consistency which is easy to push into nooks and crannies and brushes out readily prior to combing or flogging. I was able to grain out a back cabin using only 250ml or so of this thinned scumble. I think that the litre tin, along with stainer and delivery was around £30 direct from Polyvine.

 

Mark - Happy New Year! Sorry to disappoint, but John grained the framing, doors etc before I set to work.

 

Dave

[casper ghost]

I used Ratcliffes water based scumble to do my back cabin. I had never scumbled before and it turned out fine, to my eye it looks good so i'm happy with it..

Casp'

[MtB]

I used Ratcliffes water based scumble to do my back cabin. I had never scumbled before and it turned out fine, to my eye it looks good so i'm happy with it..

Casp'

 

 

I tried that but gave up in the end. It simply wouldn't stick. It contracted into hundreds of blobs, just as if I were using poster paints on waxed paper.

 

What base paint were you applying it to?

 

MtB

[casper ghost]

 

 

I tried that but gave up in the end. It simply wouldn't stick. It contracted into hundreds of blobs, just as if I were using poster paints on waxed paper.

 

What base paint were you applying it to?

 

MtB

As it's water based I used a water based paint for it's base coat. Just a buttercup colour emulsion paint. It went on fine, watered down half and half, and I like the ease of cleaning brushes with water based...

I'll try and find the camera, load a picture..

Casp'

[MtB]

Cool!

 

But emulsion base coat is no good for exterior scumbling.

 

MtB

[Groundhog]

I did some scumble work in the back cabin of my previous boat. It looked like a dirty protest

[casper ghost]

Cool!

 

But emulsion base coat is no good for exterior scumbling.

 

MtB

I guess you can get water based exterior paint as they keep saying we'll all have to use it one day..

Casp'

[dave moore]

Groundhog....shit happens!

 

Cheers

 

Dave

[Groundhog]

[Sea Dog]

I did some scumble work in the back cabin of my previous boat. It looked like a dirty protest

 

 

Groundhog....shit happens!

 

Cheers

 

Dave

 

Ah guys, you show your age by relating this feature the Seventies, but what a great decade!

 

So as to stay on topic, I remember needing some scumbling doing in my outside loo, but the Sandpaperers' and Brushwielders' Union had all the tradesmen out on strike. So I bust a gut to get to the ironmongers in my Austin Allegro before petrol rationing kicked in, spent 2 shillings on toxic paint and when I tried to do the job myself after work there was a power cut so I couldn't see what I was doing. I made such a mess, I used a whole roll of Izal cleaning it up and had to throw the whole lot in the bin, only to pass it every day for the next 3 months whilst the bin men were out on strike. Good times. Still, we had Eric and Ernie to cheer us up, eh?

[David Schweizer]

I guess you can get water based exterior paint as they keep saying we'll all have to use it one day..

Casp'

 

You certainly can, have you tried to buy Dulux Weathershield lately? It is now water based,

 

Fortunately I managed to get some spirit based Weathershield mixed at our local specialist paint dealers, butb they did warn me that it was onl;y a matter of time before it will only be available as water based.

[alan_fincher]

Thanks to all who have contributed, and sorry for not posting back sooner - "life" has rather got in the way at the moment.

 

Not sure we are now going down this route, but if we do, I'll probably contact you for some advice, Dave Moore.

 

Thanks all.