CRT "Functional Location" Codes (like GU-164-003, for example).

[Alan de Enfield]

. At this stage of the game, it matters not "how far" they move, as long as they move every 14 days, to another place.

 

 

So - your 14 days is up, you are moving along, how do you decide when you have arrived in 'another place'?

[jenlyn]

So - your 14 days is up, you are moving along, how do you decide when you have arrived in 'another place'?

When you have left the place you were moored before ;-)

[Alan Saunders]

Thank you, filed for future reference. BW/CRT once claimed that I had only moved by 1km when I believed I had moved to a 'different place' and more than a mile.

Serious question - what makes you think that more than a mile places you in a different 'place' ?

I don't think that and I did not say that! I said "... I had moved to a 'different place' and more than a mile".

I wish I had not mentioned places.

 

Alan

[mayalld]

He stated it, offered it, suggested it, mentioned it, perhaps it was his view, or god forbid his "opinion".

 

Yes, it was his opinion that it could be ARGUED that a place was that small.

 

That isn't to say that he holds the opinion that it is that small.

 

Judges are awfully good at that kind of thing.

[Alan de Enfield]

When you have left the place you were moored before ;-)

 

How can you tell when you have left the place you were in before you arrived at the place you are now in ?

[jenlyn]

Yes, it was his opinion that it could be ARGUED that a place was that small.

 

That isn't to say that he holds the opinion that it is that small.

 

Judges are awfully good at that kind of thing.

Perhaps they read some of your posts :-o

How can you tell when you have left the place you were in before you arrived at the place you are now in ?

You stated I was "moving along", so I assumed I had pulled my pins, started the engine, and moved to my next place, having left my last place behind. Thus giving somewhere for mayall to moor :-)

[Alan de Enfield]

Perhaps they read some of your posts :-o

 

You stated I was "moving along", so I assumed I had pulled my pins, started the engine, and moved to my next place, having left my last place behind. Thus giving somewhere for mayall to moor :-)

 

But how do I know that I have reached the 'next place' - that is the question.

 

You know that to assume makes an ASS out of U and ME

[jenlyn]

Yes, it was his opinion

 

But you said in post 96

He didn't actually offer it as an opinion though did he? [unquote]

 

I note the question mark, and presume you now provide an answer for your own question.

But how do I know that I have reached the 'next place' - that is the question.

 

You know that to assume makes an ASS out of U and ME

Well, you've been 10 miles out of Lincoln for months, so I'm assuming you have not moved to the next place, and therefore do not know where it is.

 

You just want me to say "boundary" innit? Lol lol

[Chalky]

If the code shows the distance from a nominal point e.g. the start of the canal and then the canal is extended e.g. via restoration do they then have to change all of the location codes or use negative numbers?

[Alf Roberts]

Yes, it was his opinion that it could be ARGUED that a place was that small.

 

That isn't to say that he holds the opinion that it is that small.

 

Judges are awfully good at that kind of thing.

No, that's not what he said at all. Please provide a reference for that assertion. I believe you just made it up.

 

One thing he did say was

 

It is the same for ©(ii), “in any one place”, i.e. a mooring or some other place where the vessel can reasonably be kept. It is just looking at “the place” where the thing is, not a place in a different sense of “spot”, which is a word you have used, or “locality” or “neighbourhood”.

That's a quote Mayalld - not kite flying.

[Allan(nb Albert)]

He stated it, offered it, suggested it, mentioned it, perhaps it was his view, or god forbid his "opinion".

Here is the last thing that was said on the matter.

 

MR WESTGATE: -- but that does not say anything about how far and you get to the meaning of how far by considering what does bona fide of your navigation mean and you answer the question, what does bona fide of your navigation mean by asking, what does a pleasure boat have to do? Because if it is good enough for a pleasure boat with a mooring, it has got to be good enough for a pleasure boat without a mooring; with the same phrase.

​

MR JUSTICE LEWIS: Just pausing, we will stop there, but that means that the annual trip to the Dog and Duck is enough.

 

We have to remember that this was a judicial review of BW/CaRT's 'guidance' for those without a home mooring which had been altered due the judges comments in the Davies case.

 

What Mr Westgate was arguing was that 'bona fide for navigation' must have the same meaning for both those with a home mooring and those without (although, as we know it is only a requirement for those without). The theoretical case of someone who had a home mooring travelling a short distance to a pub for lunch and then returning to his home mooring once a year had been previously considered.

 

However, as shown above he appears to have made up his mind that 'bona fide for navigation' could be satisfied by simply moving the boat a few yards.

 

It is interesting to note that discontinuance was opposed by CaRT but Mr Justice Lewis suggested to they might not be happy with the outcome if they proceeded.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 20, 2014 by Allan(nb Albert)

[Alan de Enfield]

Well, you've been 10 miles out of Lincoln for months, so I'm assuming you have not moved to the next place, and therefore do not know where it is.

 

You just want me to say "boundary" innit? Lol lol

 

But being a HMer do I really need to move to a new place, (or a new location), every 14 days ?

[jenlyn]

But being a HMer do I really need to move to a new place, (or a new location), every 14 days ?

That's your choice Alan.

[Peter X]

If the code shows the distance from a nominal point e.g. the start of the canal and then the canal is extended e.g. via restoration do they then have to change all of the location codes or use negative numbers?

 

Good point, and the only on-topic recent post! The eternal argument as to what constitutes a place does not belong here.

 

Wholesale changes of codes in databases are always something to avoid if possible, because you have to cope with everywhere those codes are used, in the database, the programs which use it and worst of all out in the real world, e.g. maybe CRT assets have numbers painted on them. For example every time landline area codes are changed, e.g. the "Big Number" change which was in about 2000, it costs businesses money repainting shop fronts and vehicles.

 

Negative numbers of kilometres would be an untidy nuisance especially as they use a minus sign as a separator in the reports.

 

We can only hope that for each canal CRT chose to number from an end which is most unlikely ever to get extended, or that if it does they'll dream up another two letter code for it, they have plenty of spare combinations to play with there. We can only dream of the day the UK has 676 canals; I say UK because the Excel list which was posted is old enough to include Scottish canals.

[mayalld]

If the code shows the distance from a nominal point e.g. the start of the canal and then the canal is extended e.g. via restoration do they then have to change all of the location codes or use negative numbers?

Codes are seemingly allocated covering the whole length of a canal, including unnavigable sections. New sections that aren't part of the numbering could be added as a new canal

Edited November 21, 2014 by Theo

[Giles Williams]

Found a map.

[Bod]

Found a map.

Interestingly that map, shows the Foxton inclined plane as usable.

 

Bod

[Tony Dunkley]

Interestingly that map, shows the Foxton inclined plane as usable.

 

Bod

 

By C&RT's standards, . . . it probably is.

[Mike Todd]

 

By C&RT's standards, . . . it probably is.

Not quite as bad as suggested:

 

The underlay map correctly shows the extent of the upper and lower arms, both of which are navigable. As I recall, the upper one can generally be sued for mooring but the lower one is allocated to long term users. The error is in the overlay which joins the two together for the purposes of reporting and assigns it an identity. It definitely follows the line of the plane itself as well as the filled in parts of the approaches.

 

However, I seem to recall that CaRT are still responsible for the plane site which is listed and therefore needs to be considered an 'asset' and which will have administrative liabilities. The title of the map indicates that its purpose is to show the location of assets and whose region they lie within. It does not indicate that it shows navigable waterways.

 

Any use of a tool for purposes other than for which it was designed are the users own liability. You could try to navigate - 'cos you think that is what it means, but don't expect much sympathy from a court when you try to sue CaRT for the costs associated with your boat becoming stuck part way down the plane nor the costs which you incurred by damaging a listed structure

 

I was not sure why the link was cited, in the context of the thread.

[sharpness]

I was not sure why the link was cited, in the context of the thread.

 

It did get a bit off topic but that was what Alan originally wanted to identify the location from CRT location codes.

[Mike Todd]

 

It did get a bit off topic but that was what Alan originally wanted to identify the location from CRT location codes.

I may be looking in the wrong place but I could not see how the map achieved that.

[alan_fincher]

I may be looking in the wrong place but I could not see how the map achieved that.

 

It isn't immediately obvious, but if you zoom in enough on a particular location to the point where individual features like bridges get an icon, then when you click on that icon, the functional location is included in the detail that is displayed.....

Example

 

Functional Location

GU-168-009 Name Bridge 140C, Lower Kings Road

 

 

[sharpness]

Beaten to it by Alan but that is exactly what I found.

 

Has that answered your original query Alan or had you already found it?

 

Steve

Edited July 23, 2016 by sharpness

[Mike Todd]

 

It isn't immediately obvious, but if you zoom in enough on a particular location to the point where individual features like bridges get an icon, then when you click on that icon, the functional location is included in the detail that is displayed.....

Example

 

Only sort of: you originally said it would help translate a location code into an actual location. What you describe is the other way around and unless there is some evident logic that allows one to narrow down the choice, going through every single asset to find the one you want is not a simple task.

[sharpness]

The location code on my licence will show me where my home mooring is in case I forget.

If I wanted to report something to CRT I could find the location code from their map so we would be sure we were talking about the same place.