Hot Water...

[strummerjoe]

Evening all,

 

A question on hot water.

 

I am in the process of purchasing my very first narrow boat to live aboard and I am trying to do some long term planning. Following the mantra of KISS I am going to limit my use of electricity to possibly only a 12v system but I have a question regarding hot water in the summer time. In the winter I plan to run my hot water off of the stove but what is the best solution, and by best i mean the cheapest solution for the summer. Is it to run the calorifier off of the engine or is it to install a hot water heater such as an Alde or Rinnai?

 

It is only me on the boat and I do not plan to use that much in the way of hot water.

 

Any and all opinions welcome...

 

Cheers

 

Dave

[David Mack]

Is it to run the calorifier off of the engine or is it to install a hot water heater such as an Alde or Rinnai?

 

You can do both, switching between the two with a L-port valve. That way you get a tank full of free engine-heated water when cruising, and on-demand gas-heated water when not running the engine for a few days.

[jonny]

Evening all,

 

A question on hot water.

 

I am in the process of purchasing my very first narrow boat to live aboard and I am trying to do some long term planning. Following the mantra of KISS I am going to limit my use of electricity to possibly only a 12v system but I have a question regarding hot water in the summer time. In the winter I plan to run my hot water off of the stove but what is the best solution, and by best i mean the cheapest solution for the summer. Is it to run the calorifier off of the engine or is it to install a hot water heater such as an Alde or Rinnai?

 

It is only me on the boat and I do not plan to use that much in the way of hot water.

 

Any and all opinions welcome...

 

Cheers

 

Dave

 

For a cup of tea, boil on the cooker, for a shower, run the engine which will also charge your batteries.

[magnetman]

Morco instant gas water heater

 

Hot water when you want it. A calorifier is good as well but might go cold on you when you don't want it to... Depending on occupants and washing habits

Eta just noticed sole occupant so yes probably engine is most efficient

[Alan Saunders]

If, as many do, you need to run the engine for two or three hours every day ro recharge the batteries a calorfier should provide free hot water for a shower. If you run the engine in the evening the water may not be hot enough for a shower in the morning.

 

An instantaneous water heater is the most economical solution. Alde make gas ch boilers that also heat the calorifier.

 

On shore power an immersion heater is convenient and cheap to install and run but many calorifiers do not have the facility to install one.

[strummerjoe]

Thanks for the responses so far...

 

My thinking is this... I only work three days a week, however, in each of those days I work 12 hours a day and so running the engine every evening is going to prove difficult. As with most newbies, I do have aspirations of doing a lot of cruising on my days off however, like most people, I am sure that life will get in the way of these plans, so I am thinking that a instant hot water heater, in addition to the engine run calorifier, might be the best way to go?

 

Dave

[magnetman]

Thanks for the responses so far...

 

My thinking is this... I only work three days a week, however, in each of those days I work 12 hours a day and so running the engine every evening is going to prove difficult. As with most newbies, I do have aspirations of doing a lot of cruising on my days off however, like most people, I am sure that life will get in the way of these plans, so I am thinking that a instant hot water heater, in addition to the engine run calorifier, might be the best way to go?

 

Dave

Sounds good but make sure the systems don't err... Clash

 

they need to be seperated as mentioned with valve(s) otherwise the instant heater might cause the water to become dangerously hot because an instant water heater raises the -existing water temp by x degrees. so if you had been running the engine the day before and the calorifier was full of water at say 45 degrees the instant heater might raise that to 80 or something which could be very dangerous.

So definitely seperate them. I had a boat once which had both in the same system and did exactly this as I did not realise and it was not pleasant

 

Edit to remove 3 dots and add a dot

Edited November 18, 2014 by magnetman

[J R]

Perhaps stay away from the Alde (know nothing about the Rinnai) as you have to replace the gas bottles often, and from experience the failure rate of the Alde systems are quite high and repairs expensive. Maybe a Webasto (diesel powered) which will do both hot water to the calorifier and the central heating depending on how the plumbing is configured. Would suggest that you have 2 sources of the heat you need so as to compensate for the seasons and also you would have a backup if one of the heating sources did not work.

[strummerjoe]

Thanks, I have read that Webasto and Morco are good options with regards to boilers. I think my choice will be stove/boiler for the winter and boiler/engine for the summer. So if anyone can recommend a boiler then I would be glad to hear it.

 

Cheers again.

 

Dave

[MtB]

It is only me on the boat and I do not plan to use that much in the way of hot water.

 

 

And what does your GF make of this plan??

 

 

MTB

[strummerjoe]

Ahhh when you're as handsome as I am it all works out in the end...

[Wanted]

I quite like the look of these...

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/271109987340

 

 

Could do with a slightly bigger one..

[Alan de Enfield]

Mike the Boilerman, on 18 Nov 2014 - 9:16 PM, said:

 

 

And what does your GF make of this plan??

 

 

MTB

 

I bet there are some on here that don't remember 1976

 

 

Edited November 19, 2014 by Alan de Enfield

[OldGoat]

You've not mentioned costs.....

 

Looking at your lifestyle I'd go for the combination of engine / webasto/Mikuni/Ebbersplutter/ 'boiler' system.

If you work 12 hour shifts, it's not sensible to keep a stove running when you'll probably just come in, have a meal and go to bed.

 

[SamKingfisher]

Er, solar collector. Free hot water after installation cost of £350 diy. Works almost all summer.

[strummerjoe]

Er, solar collector. Free hot water after installation cost of £350 diy. Works almost all summer.

 

I hadn't really thought of this option. Does anybody have this system and if they do how do they find it?

 

Cheers again for all the responses.

 

Dave

[Alan de Enfield]

I am just guessing, but when Sam says it works most of the Summer (June, July, August) , the implication is that for the rest of the year - and particularly the 6 Winter months you just get cold water.

 

Put in an Eberspacher (or similar) and a solid fuel stove and back boiler.

 

Eberspacher gives you hot water (and central heating) in 15 minutes of getting into the boat, the SF stove can be kept in all weekend, providing hot water and central heating.

[SamKingfisher]

It works in May June July August September October. Obviously tails in and out. When it isn't working, it's cold enough to light the stove for the back boiler.

[MtB]

It works in May June July August September October. Obviously tails in and out. When it isn't working, it's cold enough to light the stove for the back boiler.

 

What is it you have that works, exactly, please?

 

Thanks.

 

MtB

[SamKingfisher]

Eversplutters can be unreliable. My system gives me hot water before I even put my key in the boat door!

 

Vertical cauliflower is best though.

 

What is it you have that works, exactly, please?

 

Thanks.

 

MtB

My lawnmower. Loads of things. In this context, a solar hot water collector, differential thermometer, solenoid shut off valve.

 

Edit to add comma

Edited November 19, 2014 by SamKingfisher

[MtB]

Eversplutters can be unreliable. My system gives me hot water before I even put my key in the boat door!

 

Vertical cauliflower is best though.

 

My lawnmower. Loads of things. In this context, a solar hot water collector differential thermometer, solenoid shut off valve.

 

Ok, I'll be more precise in my question.

 

Which make and model of solar hot water collector? Which make and model of differential thermometer, and is the hot water stored?

 

Or is your system a secret?

 

 

MtB

[Neil Coker]

MtB, take a look at these links

http://www.worcester-bosch.co.uk/homeowner/solar-water-heating

 

http://www.solarfriend.co.uk

 

Im thinking of something similar myself.

[SamKingfisher]

I have no idea of the make of my collector, it has 6 tubes. 10 would be better. I believe they all work the same way, like solar pv, the make of the panel is not all that important. All this kit is available from www.solarproject.co.uk

 

I bought my collector second hand.

 

Any differential thermometer capable of switching on at 6 degrees more at collector would be fine. 10 degrees would be better.

 

Keep pipework short, and insulate it.

 

Any solenoid valve would be fine, needs to switch on with the pump to prevent thermocycling.

 

A header tank at the highest point of the system can be made from eg an old brass plant pot holder. My old one was a golden syrup tin, looked ace went rusty.

Ps Mike, I don't understand what you mean by is the water stored?

[Gordias]

Can these units be built so you can walk on them without losing efficiency? E.g. put them behind a sufficiently strong transparent cover, or build them flexible but robust so they just "bounce back" if you step on them.

 

And FWIW, can they be built so they can be stored rolled up rather than flat?

[NigelMoore]

I incorporated the facility to use the simplest possible solar heating for my bathroom shower [only] when fitting out. A separate shower head connected to a spigot on the roof, that could be connected to a collector, and an adjacent spigot connected to the water supply so I could fill the collector. The idea was to use a black plastic tank that could be rolled up and out of the way.

 

As it happens, I have only used it on one trip, before most of the fit-out was done. I used an air mattress, filled it with water in the morning, and by evening had plenty of hot water for a shower for me and my sister – gravity fed. Worked a treat for the month we were cruising the GU - Oxford - Thames ring.