My Dissapointment

[Athy]

Neil2 & lonewolf,

IT'S SO COMPLEX, AAHHHH

.However it has amazed me that some people actually concentrate & take great satisfaction in picking up on how something is written,

[quote

Paul,

It depends on people's backgrounds. I spent about 30 years as a language teacher (French and English) so I naturally notice how people write. In the same way, someone who has worked as an engineer will notice technical details in threads about engines and so on. To me, the way I write English is important (though, as fellow forum members will tell you, my typing isn't always great), to other people, different things are important.

[carlt]

To me, the way I write English is important.

Yes the way I write English is important, too.

 

I don't really care how other people write nor do I care what other people think about the way I write.

 

I do like picking up the mistakes invariably made by those who do delight in correcting others, though.

[Ray T]

Many people are not very good at the written word due to possible poor teaching at school, not necessarily poor teachers. For many years Coventry Education Department refused to accept Dyslexia existed - the reason, if it were recognised finances would have to be allocated.

 

We have a good friend, adult, who only has a reading age of 12. He is Dyslexic. At school because he didn't understand "the rules" of English he was told he was stupid. Wouldn't happen now, hopefully, but it did. He is incredibly adept with his hands and put an engineering drawing in front of him and he can explain it all down to the last nut and bolt.

 

If you have a fine command of English, "Like what she is spoke", be grateful.

 

ETA.Not forgetting, many of the original canal people were illiterate, only a few were "scollards". Perhaps if we are to be true canal world people we should unlearn how to read and write.

Edited October 3, 2013 by Ray T

[Athy]

.

 

I do like picking up the mistakes invariably made by those who do delight in correcting others, though.

Likewise. The words of the late, great Justin Hinds spring to mind: "The higher the monkey climbs is the more he expose".

[Tuscan]

Many people are not very good at the written word due to possible poor teaching at school, not necessarily poor teachers. For many years Coventry Education Department refused to accept Dyslexia existed - the reason, if it were recognised finances would have to be allocated.

 

We have a good friend, adult, who only has a reading age of 12. He is Dyslexic. At school because he didn't understand "the rules" of English he was told he was stupid. Wouldn't happen now, hopefully, but it did. He is incredibly adept with his hands and put an engineering drawing in front of him and he can explain it all down to the last nut and bolt.

 

If you have a fine command of English, "Like what she is spoke", be grateful.

 

 

That is a reasonable point my son went to school high in the local rankings, he was statemented for Dyslexicia but despite this got O levels good enough to take A levels but the school did not want him as he would only get low grades. He was angry at the time and went to the local college and did city and guilds as in electronics then mechanics slowly the class dropped out leaving just 3 of them under a great lecturer and he got his full tech. He then went to Portsmouth university to do mech/elec engineering degree they helped him with a laptop with special software he got his degree and subsequently a masters . He is now a chartered building services engineer but still needs help reading and writting reports as his reading and writing age is around 13. The school failed him but the kindly lecturer at the local tech saw the potential - luckily

[Neil2]

Neil, a Greeno for your subtle humour in your post no. 106. But I almost withdrew it upon reading the above - what can you mean? This remains a valid spelling rule.

 

Ahem,

 

Science, efficient.

 

Seize, Caffeine. Weigh.

 

Also a plethora of plurals of words eg vacancies, frequencies.

 

The trouble with the sort of primary education I had is that they filled your head with all sorts of nonsense that, when you started to learn properly, you realised were complete twaddle. Not just English grammar either.

 

It's the same with music, for example. You are taught that there are only certain chord progressions but when you listen to some of the great songs they break all these so called rules. The Beatles were groundbreaking because they didn't know what the "rules" were, they just used their ears.

 

There are even lots of examples of great writers who had little or no formal education, Jack Kerouac, George Bernard Shaw, Jack London, you might even throw Charles Dickens in there as well.

 

One of the great things about our modern world is the recognition that everyone has different talents and skills which are all equally valuable regardless of one's abilities with the written word. It's comparable with the breaking down of barriers based on race, gender and sexual orientation.

[Athy]

Neil, you have cited some exceptions which prove the rule - a rule which, in truth, is more applicable in the singular (thank goodness, otherwise such abominations as "vacancy's" would be accepted as correct).

I fully concur with your point about people's different talents and skills, as I said as much myself in an earlier post.

[LoneWolf]

Neil, you have cited some exceptions which prove the rule - a rule which, in truth, is more applicable in the singular (thank goodness, otherwise such abominations as "vacancy's" would be accepted as correct).

I fully concur with your point about people's different talents and skills, as I said as much myself in an earlier post.

 

Arghhhhhhhhh!

 

[RLWP]

 

Arghhhhhhhhh!

 

 

Quick - call the grammar fire brigade!

 

Richard

[ditchcrawler]

Neil, a Greeno for your subtle humour in your post no. 106. But I almost withdrew it upon reading the above - what can you mean? This remains a valid spelling rule.

So how many words can you think of where the rule does not apply I before E except after C ? How about Keith for a starter

[LoneWolf]

 

Quick - call the grammar fire brigade!

 

Richard

 

lol

 

I always notice that one because it puzzled me for a long time - it didn't seem to make sense because i was thinking of 'natural rules' (like Newtons Laws which are always true within their limits) so I didn't see how there could be exceptions that proved it

 

Then, when the internet came along i looked it up one day

 

 

Interesting to compare to "Begs the question" which is also often misused - so much that i think it's changed its meaning now.

But i don't think the meaning of "exception proves the rule" can be changed in the same way

[Athy]

 

Arghhhhhhhhh!

 

Have I made a mistake, or have you sat on your dolly-stud?

So how many words can you think of where the rule does not apply I before E except after C ? How about Keith for a starter

Is that the Scots bloke, Keith from Leith?

[johnthebridge]

A few rules on punctuation/grammar

 

- Always preview your posts to see if you any words out.

 

- Avoid commas, that are not necessary.

 

- Don't overuse exclamation marks!!!!!

 

- the same goes for "quotation" marks.

 

- For the millionth time, try not to use hyperbole

 

-And don't start a sentence with a conjunction. (Unless you happen to be writing the Bible)

 

 

 

Forgive me if it's been posted here before, but it reminds me of the one about the Southern redneck, who somehow passes an entrance examination for Harvard.

On his first day he's going up the grand steps to the entrance and meets a couple of posh Ivy Leaguer fourth years from Maine coming out.

He bawls at them, "Say, where's the Library at?"

The Maine fellows disdainfully eye this backwoodsman up and down and then one of them says haughtily, "My deah fellow, at Hahvahd we NEVER end a sentence with a preposition!"

The redneck thinks for a moment, ruffles his hair, scratches his head and then says, "Mah apologies suh, say, where's the library at, asshole?"

[Athy]

Splendid, Mr. Bridge!

[LoneWolf]

Have I made a mistake, or have you sat on your dolly-stud?

 

Is that the Scots bloke, Keith from Leith?

 

yes, but many people do. wiki explains it quite well

 

"The exception [that] proves the rule" is a frequently misused English phrase. The original meaning of this phrase is that the presence of an exception applying to a specific case establishes ("proves") that a general rule exists. For example, a sign that says "parking prohibited on Sundays" (the exception) "proves" that parking is allowed on the other six days of the week (the rule). A more explicit phrasing might be "The exception that proves the existence of the rule."

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exception_that_proves_the_rule

[carlt]

 

Quick - call the grammar fire brigade!

 

Richard

[Athy]

 

yes, but many people do. wiki explains it quite well

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exception_that_proves_the_rule

So, it's ellipsis.

Excuse me, I had forgotten that Wikipedia was an unimpeachable and totally authoritative source.

 

Not. (I have corrected numerous entries over the last few years).

[Paul's Nulife4-2]

Hi guy's,

It's like a breath of fresh air to me,that its evident that this thread had infact highlighted just how difficult written English is, for people like myself, moderately & highly educated alike.& the points you are all making are great.Let's not even go to trying to differentiate between verbal bullying,sarcasm and playful banter,when you can't even see mannerisms.

There is someone on here that has got a little permanent footnote at the bottom of all his messages that I think is fantastic.

Something like,(can't remember exact) What you said,What you think you said & what was thought that you said are 3 entirely different things.

I want one that says What I want to write,What I wrote,& what I ment to write are 3 entirely different things.

[LoneWolf]

So, it's ellipsis.

Excuse me, I had forgotten that Wikipedia was an unimpeachable and totally authoritative source.

 

Not. (I have corrected numerous entries over the last few years).

 

I didn't claim it was. In this case it is a reasonably clear explanation

 

but whatever dude... carry on believing what you want.

[carlt]

There is someone on here that has got a little permanent footnote at the bottom of all his messages that I think is fantastic.

I prefer the signature:

 

"None of the comments I make on the forum have any malicious intent whatsoever but, if you choose to misinterpret my words, you can go and stick your head in the fridge and slam the door repeatedly until your nose falls off."

[Athy]

 

I didn't claim it was. In this case it is a reasonably clear explanation

 

but whatever dude... carry on believing what you want.

Thank you. I shall carry on believing what is right, yes.

[Paul's Nulife4-2]

Ok,,Hey,,I've just found some moldy cheese at the back.& the light works now.that's a possible remedy for the equipment board.

Edited October 3, 2013 by Paul's Nulife4-2

[carlt]

Ok,,Hey,,I've just found some moldy cheese ay the back.

That's not cheese, that's George94's nose.

[Neil2]

Neil, you have cited some exceptions which prove the rule - a rule which, in truth, is more applicable in the singular (thank goodness, otherwise such abominations as "vacancy's" would be accepted as correct).

I fully concur with your point about people's different talents and skills, as I said as much myself in an earlier post.

Athy - In my haste to challenge your assertion I forgot to say thanks for the green one, my apologies.

 

But you know as well as I do that there must be a couple of hundred words that don't follow the rule, and I know i shouldn't be bothered by it but it the "rule" is responsible for the mis-spelling of common words such as weir and, especially, weird.

 

I'm sure we'll end up agreeing to differ on this one though...

 

 

I suppose on reflection I shouldn't be so hard on my primary education, as Emo Phillips put it "You don't appreciate a lot of stuff in school until you get older, like being spanked every day by a middle aged woman..."

Edited October 3, 2013 by Neil2

[LoneWolf]

Thank you. I shall carry on believing what is right, yes.

 

Or you could post a source you do consider authoritative that gives an explanation that fits in with your usage and I'll happily withdraw my jocular comment

 

If you can find one that is