Running costs for a newbie

[lesrollins]

We are in the process of selling our house to buy a narrow boat to liveaboard. We have chosen a seventy foot boat to give us maximum living space as we do not intend to cruise the whole system. I just wondered if anyone could help with a few questions.

 

1 What sort of running costs would run a boat this size. It as a corner oil stove and a mikuni mx60 oil boiler for the central heating and hot water. I know about the licence, insurance etc.

 

2 What will I be able to run on the boat, which is fitted with a travelpower 3.5kva, 3 x 220a/h domestic batteries, victron inverter 12/1600/70 and are solar panels worth the money not fitted yet but something I would like to consider for the future.

 

3 How many running hours will the engine need between services.

 

I,m sure I have loads of questions if anyone can help.

 

Thanks

[bottle]

We are in the process of selling our house to buy a narrow boat to liveaboard. We have chosen a seventy foot boat to give us maximum living space as we do not intend to cruise the whole system. I just wondered if anyone could help with a few questions.

 

1 What sort of running costs would run a boat this size. It as a corner oil stove and a mikuni mx60 oil boiler for the central heating and hot water. I know about the licence, insurance etc.

 

£5,000 to £7,000 per annum, should cover all costs (including insurance,mooring etc.) and have some to spare for the unexpected.

 

2 What will I be able to run on the boat, which is fitted with a travelpower 3.5kva, 3 x 220a/h domestic batteries, victron inverter 12/1600/70 and are solar panels worth the money not fitted yet but something I would like to consider for the future.

 

Engine running, anything you like up to a maximum of 3.5 Kva or about 3Kw, Engine off, from the bat terries/inverter up to 1.6Kw but the batteries will not last long.

Solar panels will tickle your batteries but are useful if you do not use the boat and it is laid up for weeks. (my opinion)

You should be able to run the engine and use the travelpower to run the Victron and charge the batteries fairly quickly (70 amp charger)

3 How many running hours will the engine need between services.

 

Depends on the engine manufacturers recommendation, eg. Beta 250 Hours.

 

I,m sure I have loads of questions if anyone can help.

 

Thanks

 

Welcome to the forum.

[lesrollins]

Cheers

The running costs seem a little higher than what I thought, bearing in mind

 

BWL £931 or £831 paid up front

Insurance £261

and being classed as a continous cruiser no mooring fees.

 

Compared with running the house

 

£1800 rates pa

£53 per month gas

£53 per month electric

A bill just in for £231 water rates

Mortgage £180 per month

 

I thought I was going to save a lot more living on a boat.

[Lady Muck]

It can depend on your circumstances before you had the boat - I was a renter in London - i.e. very expensive, so it's quite a bit cheaper for me, much cheaper now the boat is paid for and there's no marine mortgage anymore.

 

If you can do most of the maintenance yourself, then that helps. If you can be bothered to forage and chop wood, then that helps your winter heating bills. (for instance, my neighbours are volunteer park rangers - they get all the tree prunings for free).

 

How much it costs is a 'how long is a piece of string' question.

 

Living in a boat in London on a residential mooring with all mod cons and all the same electrical gubbins and expectations you'd have in house = expensive.

 

Cc in a cabin crusier with no heating and basically 'camping.' = incredibly cheap.

 

Most of us are somewhere in the middle.

Edited January 11, 2012 by Lady Muck

[Arthur Brown]

You really need to factor in things like having the boat bottom re blacked. It's a necessary part of owning a boat and it takes a couple of days in a dock when you can't live on board.

 

Boating is a way of life but not necessarily a cheap style, if you try to be too cheap then things bite back - hull corrosion, battery failure, and hundreds of other things need to be attended daily.

 

Houses don't sink. Houses tend to rise in value boats fall in value, ...

[ditchcrawler]

We are in the process of selling our house to buy a narrow boat to liveaboard. We have chosen a seventy foot boat to give us maximum living space as we do not intend to cruise the whole system. I just wondered if anyone could help with a few questions.

 

1 What sort of running costs would run a boat this size. It as a corner oil stove and a mikuni mx60 oil boiler for the central heating and hot water. I know about the licence, insurance etc.

 

2 What will I be able to run on the boat, which is fitted with a travelpower 3.5kva, 3 x 220a/h domestic batteries, victron inverter 12/1600/70 and are solar panels worth the money not fitted yet but something I would like to consider for the future.

 

3 How many running hours will the engine need between services.

 

I,m sure I have loads of questions if anyone can help.

 

Thanks

You are probably going to use 4Lt Diesel a day every day for battery charging and moving. In the colder months you will be using up to 10 of diesel a day for heating. You also have a BSS inspection every 4 year, a new set of Batteries every couple of years unless you are very careful. Paint job between 8 and 10 years probably £6-7000. Mobile phone and broadband.

You don't say if there is a solid fire stove, if so you can save some money burning wood.

[Alan de Enfield]

Cheers

The running costs seem a little higher than what I thought, bearing in mind

 

BWL £931 or £831 paid up front

Insurance £261

and being classed as a continous cruiser no mooring fees.

 

Compared with running the house

 

£1800 rates pa

£53 per month gas

£53 per month electric

A bill just in for £231 water rates

Mortgage £180 per month

 

I thought I was going to save a lot more living on a boat.

 

 

If you are CCing and have no shore line then you will obviously be using a fair bit of diesel to both 'move about' and to charge your batteries.

The engine will (probabaly) use about one-and-a-half litres per hour at £1.00/litre

Say 3 hours per day = £4.50 /day = £135 / month

 

The amount of time used to re-charge your batteries will depend on the usage you have - fridges, freezers, washing machines etc are very heavy users and you may well need to run the engine for 8 hours every few days to top the battery up.

The good news is that you should also get hot water (assuming you have a calorifier) whilst the engine is running so if you time your showers and washing the pots correctly the hot water is 'free'.

 

The 'oil fired' boiler / stove will obviously also consume "an amount" of diesel per hour when you have the heating on. I dont know the 'amount' but I'm sure other users can comment.

 

Your water supply is 'free' from water points along the system.

 

You will need some method of getting rid of 'bodily waste', you will either have a 'porta-potti / cassette thingy that you'll need to empty every 3 or 4 days (depending on your consumtion) - these are normally 'free' to empty at emptying points around the system. If you have a holding tank and pump out system this will last to several weeks (depending on size) but will cost you £15 - £20 a time to have it pumped out (view it as your water rates - sewage charge)

 

Ditchcrawlers got faster fingers than me !!

Edited January 11, 2012 by Alan de Enfield

[Lady Muck]

Interesting to note but I know two ccers locally who have both recently got moorings, because they reckon it is cheaper - less wear and tear and engine maintenance for the boat.

 

If you are on a mooring and you have engine problems, then you can sort them at your leisure/as your wallet allows.

 

If you cc, forget it you will be endlessly hassled by patrol officers probably fined if you can't move and under pressure to pay through the nose to get problems sorted quickly.

[matty40s]

Cheers

The running costs seem a little higher than what I thought, bearing in mind

 

BWL £931 or £831 paid up front

Insurance £261

and being classed as a continous cruiser no mooring fees.

 

Compared with running the house

 

£1800 rates pa

£53 per month gas

£53 per month electric

A bill just in for £231 water rates

Mortgage £180 per month

 

I thought I was going to save a lot more living on a boat.

 

One thing there concerns me, you are buying a boat to save money?????

Boats are a bottomless money pit, especially if you are CC-ing, you tend to use fuel, and bash things more often!!!

You also probably need gas to cook with, factor in travel costs if you are moving around (fetching car/hiring car/getting to work if you still have to do that).

I bought my 70footer to liveaboard, I then decided(or redundancy decided for me) to CC. It is not cheap, it is not simple, especially in the Winter, but it opens up a whole new outlook on life and the importance of nature.

[MoominPapa]

I find a good way to calm down when looking at the cost-per-unit on my home electricity bill is to do a quick calculation of the cost of generating electricity on the boat. It makes Scottish Power's rate look very reasonable.

 

MP.

[mrsmelly]

Cheers

The running costs seem a little higher than what I thought, bearing in mind

 

BWL £931 or £831 paid up front

Insurance £261

and being classed as a continous cruiser no mooring fees.

 

Compared with running the house

 

£1800 rates pa

£53 per month gas

£53 per month electric

A bill just in for £231 water rates

Mortgage £180 per month

 

I thought I was going to save a lot more living on a boat.

 

This question arises quite often. I havnt looked at your figures but I have said before, after many years of liveaboard it is NOT cheaper living on a boat its just BETTER..........

[bottle]

Les

 

My first post was a rough figure and I did say including mooring.

 

You can knock off about £1,000 if CCing

 

Now using your own figures for the cost of the house, which did not include the unexpected, you are paying out £5463 per annum.

 

That will cover the boat, now you just need to find the money for other things, like food, clothing etc.

 

Others have given better breakdowns and as explained living on a boat is not the cheap option.

 

I CC and run my generator for about 3 hours per day (if I do not move) it uses about 1.25 litres per hour so 3.75 a day at today's cost of 88p per litre (domestic rate not propulsion), £3:30 per day, £1204:50 per year.

 

If you do not have a generator and three stage/intelligent charger then using your engine will cost he same per hour but you may well have to run it longer.

 

Your propulsion engine will use about the same litre per hour but the cost is about £1:40 per litre.

 

Blacking the boat every two years, depending on boat length and yard doing it, about £600.

 

This cost, like all others,will not go down.

 

Boating is fun and a way of life, it is not a cheap option.

 

Good luck.

 

ps. We hope to be on the Gloucester, Sharpness about June this year, you are welcome to visit.

[Lady Muck]

Blacking the boat every two years, depending on boat length and yard doing it, about £600.

 

or DIY - phone different boatyards because they charge different rates for drydock/crane out - in London it varies from £150 to £600 to get a boat out of the water.

 

AFAICR it cost us about £300 to reblack DIY last time - incl. dry dock booking, tins of blacking and paint rollers/brushes.

[bottle]

True but................................I am a lazy b*gg*r and can afford for someone to do it for me.

[lesrollins]

Well thanks to everyone who as helped give me some sort of idea about costings, as the house is now under offer I have been given a time scale of about eight weeks so I best start planning fast.

 

I have seen a nice seventy foot 2005 boat but I thought £70k was a bit steep it as been for sale for over 12 months and I suppose the call for seventy footers is not great. But for what I want a seventy footer will be ideal.

[mrsmelly]

Well thanks to everyone who as helped give me some sort of idea about costings, as the house is now under offer I have been given a time scale of about eight weeks so I best start planning fast.

 

I have seen a nice seventy foot 2005 boat but I thought £70k was a bit steep it as been for sale for over 12 months and I suppose the call for seventy footers is not great. But for what I want a seventy footer will be ideal.

 

70 footers are definately the best to live on and as there are not so many of them they do sell well to the people who want one. There are very few places you cant go on one. The reason whatever boat it is you have seen is still for sale is simple, its 2012 and a hell of a lot of boat owners refuse to accept that their boat is worth much less than it was in 2007. Boats still sell well if priced TO SELL rather than being for sale. I sold my 70foot Steve Hudson last summer to a cash buyer without survey in 3 weeks of being on the market, Im no marketing genius I just accept the facts of the market place. A 2005 boat at 70k would have to be absolutely mint condition with a very posh engine and top end builder for me to even look at it.....if I were in the market that is. Your boats out there and you will find it.

[Chickadee]

You really need to factor in things like having the boat bottom re blacked. It's a necessary part of owning a boat and it takes a couple of days in a dock when you can't live on board.

 

 

Depends how and where you black your boat. We DIY'd it and lived on board it was so much fun, the dry dock is at a beautiful spot on the Avon. It was most weird being on board without the boat moving. I didn't sleep well at all those few days.

 

I'd say our 42ft boat costs us about as much as a small flat in Cheltenham where I had been living but I wouldn't have been able to afford a flat to own and I wouldn't have had a massive back garden to go play in right outside my door.

I think although I don't really save money being on the boat atleast its not going into some landlords pocket and I will have something to show for it if we decided to sell up.

[lesrollins]

Well even as a new boater I wouldn,t part with £60 - £70k without a full survey that,s madness. It might look good where you can see it but what about the parts that are out of view, in the water !

And I do think sometimes things sell to reflect the times I had to drop my house price to achieve a sale. There,s even a figure i wouldn,t have gone below, but if I would of asked the price that it would of fetched in the peak times I think it would still be on the market today.

When I first moved here 11yrs ago if houses came on the market in this cul de sac which was not very often they were snapped up, I can probably count on both hands all the sales of the 50 houses in the past 11 yrs. But times have changed the guy below me as just taken his house of the market after 18 months unsold and I must say it was well priced.

 

Cheltenham I feel as always been overpriced when we moved to Gloucester there was always a big difference that,s why we chose to live in Quedgeley but even that is starting to get over developed, hence why we have decided to sell up and move onto a boat for a bit of peace and tranquility.

Edited January 13, 2012 by lesrollins

[Chickadee]

Ah ha your at Quedgeley. You will get peace on the canal, I love the still and quiet esspecially the great sunsets.

 

I would invite you to come and have a look at our boat but if your getting a 70ft it really wont help as its a world away from that! Hopefully we'll be upgrading to a bigger one in the next few months though so I will extend the invite for then.

[Laurie Booth]

The cost of running your boat will be the same as a 2 bed flat in Quedgeley.

[i love my narrowboat]

This question arises quite often. I havnt looked at your figures but I have said before, after many years of liveaboard it is NOT cheaper living on a boat its just BETTER..........

 

 

I second that, we have lived on ours a year come May and we love it. We do not regret selling the house for one second.

 

We are in the process of selling our house to buy a narrow boat to liveaboard. We have chosen a seventy foot boat to give us maximum living space as we do not intend to cruise the whole system. I just wondered if anyone could help with a few questions.

 

1 What sort of running costs would run a boat this size. It as a corner oil stove and a mikuni mx60 oil boiler for the central heating and hot water. I know about the licence, insurance etc.

 

2 What will I be able to run on the boat, which is fitted with a travelpower 3.5kva, 3 x 220a/h domestic batteries, victron inverter 12/1600/70 and are solar panels worth the money not fitted yet but something I would like to consider for the future.

 

3 How many running hours will the engine need between services.

 

I,m sure I have loads of questions if anyone can help.

 

Thanks

 

 

Have sent you a PM

[lesrollins]

Cheers I can cope with the running costs of a two bed flat. Sorted Where about are you guys on sharpness ? Its a cracking canal nice and wide

[Chickadee]

We're in the marina at the moment but leaving next week.

[sheriff]

You really need to factor in things like having the boat bottom re blacked. It's a necessary part of owning a boat and it takes a couple of days in a dock when you can't live on board.

 

Boating is a way of life but not necessarily a cheap style, if you try to be too cheap then things bite back - hull corrosion, battery failure, and hundreds of other things need to be attended daily.

 

Houses don't sink. Houses tend to rise in value boats fall in value, ...

you can live on board in some places...the place I wanted mine done was booked up all year..and you cannot stay on boat,they do the job....I went to cowroast and did it myself..and no problem to stay onboard..I do agree with the rest of your post.its very important to keep on top of maintance etc

[Pentargon]

Well even as a new boater I wouldn,t part with £60 - £70k without a full survey that,s madness. It might look good where you can see it but what about the parts that are out of view, in the water !

 

hence why we have decided to sell up and move onto a boat for a bit of peace and tranquility.

 

Les Good luck with the quest. Check this link from my own website which may give you a little shock http://pentargon.webs.com/daybeforethesurvey.htm Like you, I'm a newbie involved in trying to purchase a boat. Like you,I would not dream of buying without a survey. The link shows details a newbie would never know about.

Edited January 13, 2012 by Pentargon