Liveaboards other than residential

[12uthy]

Hi folks

We are thinking of selling up and going liveaboard in a couple of years time. Ideally we would like to get a residential mooring but if that is not possible (as we know how difficult these are to find) what exactly are our options? We don't much fancy CCing as our older two children will either be at work or college at the time.

What do others do?

[dor]

Comfy chair, popcorn, large G&T...

 

Never thought I would be one of those people who wrote that.

 

OP: Please have a look through some fairly recent discussions on the forum.

Edited August 27, 2011 by dor

[Ex- Member]

Hi folks

We are thinking of selling up and going liveaboard in a couple of years time. Ideally we would like to get a residential mooring but if that is not possible (as we know how difficult these are to find) what exactly are our options? We don't much fancy CCing as our older two children will either be at work or college at the time.

What do others do?

 

Unless you have a residential mooring and don't want to cc you're really only left with Non residential moorings.

 

 

 

What is the difference between Residential and non-Residential?

Residential moorings are those with planning permission for residential use - in other words the owners of the boats can live on them. Other moorings are non-residential and the owners cannot live aboard, though they can spend the occasional night on the boat. Just how many nights can be spent on a boat before the use can be described as residential is a point of debate. Generally speaking one or two nights per week or the occasional longer stay would not be considered residential use - more frequent nights spent aboard would be more questionable.

 

There's no other options I'm aware of other than a private mooring, but their generally attached to a residence I think!

 

BW do have winter moorings available, and I've heard of people bidding on BW moorings, other members will know much more than me though.

 

 

 

[NB Alnwick]

Hi folks

We are thinking of selling up and going liveaboard in a couple of years time. Ideally we would like to get a residential mooring but if that is not possible (as we know how difficult these are to find) what exactly are our options? We don't much fancy CCing as our older two children will either be at work or college at the time.

What do others do?

 

You do not need to have a residential mooring to live aboard your boat for most of the time. It is possible to live aboard on a leisure mooring or in a marina - there may be difficulties if the boat is used as the sole (or only) residence - but, in practice, almost all boaters spend some time living aboard their boats and there is no way that the authorities can discriminate between someone who enjoys a weeks holiday moored on a 'leisure mooring' and another boater who is there most of the time but can provide evidence that they have another place where they can live, which may be a parent's or relative's home that is used as a postal address and where they can occasionally stay . . .

[carlt]

You do not need to have a residential mooring to live aboard your boat for most of the time.

Then again...do you need it at all?

 

Clicky

 

Driffield Canal boat owner wins planning appeal

 

A houseboat owner who was facing eviction from his mooring on an East Yorkshire canal has won a legal battle against council planners.

 

East Riding of Yorkshire Council said the boat at Hempholme amounted to a "new dwelling", so was in breach of planning guidelines.

 

After a three-day public inquiry Dennis Norris, who owns the boat, has been told he can stay.

 

Mr Norris said he and his partner Andrea Gayton were "ecstatic".

 

The couple said they nearly separated because of the stress caused by the issue and they had to borrow money for the legal fight.

 

Mr Norris said: "It's unbelievable. I'm still trying to take it in.

 

"[The council's] argument just seemed a bit lame, and a waste of taxpayer's money to me.

 

"I'm relieved it's now all over with."

 

Enforcement notice

The council issued enforcement notices to the couple and to Gordon and Eileen Taylor, who also live on the canal.

 

The notices said they had to "permanently cease the use of the land for the stationing of boats used for human habitation purposes and remove them from the land".

 

Mr and Mrs Taylor's case also was heard at the public inquiry. They are still waiting for a decision from The Planning Inspectorate in respect of their case.

 

John Murray, for The Planning Inspectorate, disagreed with the council's argument that the use of boats on the canal as permanent homes required planning consent because it amounted to a change of use of the land.

 

He allowed Mr Norris's appeal and said the enforcement notice would be quashed.

 

The council said it was "considering the implications of the decision, and would not wish to make any further comment at this stage as there is a second appeal for another boat at the site currently under consideration."

[mrsmelly]

Hi folks

We are thinking of selling up and going liveaboard in a couple of years time. Ideally we would like to get a residential mooring but if that is not possible (as we know how difficult these are to find) what exactly are our options? We don't much fancy CCing as our older two children will either be at work or college at the time.

What do others do?

 

Another wind up......

[12uthy]

Another wind up......

No I can assure you that we are very sincere. Try to remember that not everyone has the time to trawl through every thread on the offchance that it will answer a question. Unless the OP and title suggests that it is about what we want to know I don't necessarily read through them all.

I'm sorry if I have somehow offended anyone although I can't imagine how I have!

I only asked!

[Roy]

Another wind up...

 

In this day and age when somebody is new to the forum and asks a genuine question and may not know if the question has been asked before you would think that you would get a genuine answer. As most people would do this it is surprising that certain people have to be negative and give silly answers.

I always thought these forums were designed to gain useful information and knowledge instead of being upset by silly remarks

 

As Ruthy has asked a genuine question, you'd think she would get a genuine answer. Everyone has to start somewhere. Remember that some people on this forum may not have boats yet and come here to do the right thing and gain knowledge so that when they are on the water, they don't upset other boaters.

 

Roy

 

Hi Ruthy, keep asking the questions, I'm sure you will get sincere and genuine answers eventually

[dor]

And the advice is to do a search of the forum as this subject has been done to death far too many times.

[Caprifool]

As a boatless foreign noob (heck I'm not even in you country) I find that the mooring topic is a bit cloudy. The do's and don'ts are clear to see. But then.....people are obiously finding their own alternatives in some way or a nother. So to me, the question and it's posible answers is of interest. Please, trollspotters and popcorn eaters. Could you just point those who dare ask old questions over again just point the OP in the right direction. Being unexperienced is no reason to be made to feel stupid or unwelcome.

[blackrose]

Comfy chair, popcorn, large G&T...

 

Never thought I would be one of those people who wrote that.

 

What about your tin hat? Isn't that one of the things you're supposed to write?

 

Anyway, why is one supposed to eat popcorn when you read these threads?

 

Old knackered sofa, cheese & onion crisps, can of lager...

[Chris Pink]

As a boatless foreign noob (heck I'm not even in you country) I find that the mooring topic is a bit cloudy. The do's and don'ts are clear to see. But then.....people are obiously finding their own alternatives in some way or a nother. So to me, the question and it's posible answers is of interest. Please, trollspotters and popcorn eaters. Could you just point those who dare ask old questions over again just point the OP in the right direction. Being unexperienced is no reason to be made to feel stupid or unwelcome.

 

The problem is that when you are discussing things where the legality or otherwise is a 'bit cloudy' then it would be an unwise person who comes onto an internet forum known to be monitored by BW to say "I do this".

 

There is plenty of discussion in previous topics about the socio-political and legal aspects of the issues involved.

 

For a nuts and bolts approach this is the wrong place to ask, talking to people on the towpath is the only way to gather info (sorry about that Scandanavians) .

 

 

For the aforementioned abstracts, searches will turn up many many variations on the same old same old, the positions are pretty clear and, in fact, expressed in the OP.

 

http://kanda.boatingcommunity.org.uk

http://lilo.org.uk

http://www.waterscape.co.uk

 

for some other views on the subject

[12uthy]

 

 

 

 

Hi Ruthy, keep asking the questions, I'm sure you will get sincere and genuine answers eventually

 

 

As a boatless foreign noob (heck I'm not even in you country) I find that the mooring topic is a bit cloudy. The do's and don'ts are clear to see. But then.....people are obiously finding their own alternatives in some way or a nother. So to me, the question and it's posible answers is of interest. Please, trollspotters and popcorn eaters. Could you just point those who dare ask old questions over again just point the OP in the right direction. Being unexperienced is no reason to be made to feel stupid or unwelcome.

 

Thanks Roy and Caprifool

 

I admit that having read a few of the threads I am still a bit hazy as to understanding exactly what the options are and how do-able each option is. Not all the threads explain them in simple terms. There is a lot of terms banded about such as CCing, residential mooring, leisure mooring, visitors mooring etc but I was unsure of the legality and availability of each type.

 

I'm only just beginning to understand the differences so please don't hate me for being a newby.

Thank you also NB Alnwick for your help, I appreciate it.

[Caprifool]

The problem is that when you are discussing things where the legality or otherwise is a 'bit cloudy' then it would be an unwise person who comes onto an internet forum known to be monitored by BW to say "I do this".

 

I ment cloudy as unclear, not in "the gray zone" Like garden moorings, boat clubs, private arms, end of field, river moorings.... All available, if you know they are there. And if you don't ask......

[Chris Pink]

I ment cloudy as unclear, not in "the gray zone" Like garden moorings, boat clubs, private arms, end of field, river moorings.... All available, if you know they are there. And if you don't ask......

 

Trouble is Britain now is like Italy in the 1970s, if it moves there's a law against it, or 6 forms to fill in, or a tax, so people tend to be a bit quiet in public about anything less than a completely formal arrangement/ Bureaucracy is out of control and does what it does best, grows exponentially.

 

I know this to be true because of the difference between what i read on here and other places and what happens on my rounds. You won't read of any private arms, farmers doing deals, river moorings on a public forum. You need to talk to people.

[14skipper]

[

Edited August 28, 2011 by 14skipper

[Caprifool]

Ehem.....all I know, came from here. A public forum.

[Chris Pink]

Well, exactly.

[sueb]

Hello for information on living aboard join RBOA.org.uk The residential boaters owners association.

Good luck Sue

[TimD]

Not all the threads explain them in simple terms. There is a lot of terms banded about such as CCing, residential mooring, leisure mooring, visitors mooring etc but I was unsure of the legality and availability of each type.

 

I'm only just beginning to understand the differences so please don't hate me for being a newby.

Thank you also NB Alnwick for your help, I appreciate it.

OK put simply, the main options are

1) Have a residential mooring: rare and expensive, but you can expect a PO box and can register to vote at your mooring address.

2) Have a leisure mooring in a marina, but live on the boat full time. Common, but you will either be addressless or need a friend/relative to pick up the mail, put you on the electral register etc. OK if the marina owner "turns a blind eye" but you could be turfed out on short notice if you don't conform.

3) Offside private mooring. Rare unless you own the property, but if you can get it it's up to the land owner whether you can live aboard part/full time or not.

4) Have a leisure mooring on tow path, but live on the boat full time. Similar to 2) but BW will almost certainly turn a blind eye, but you get very few facilities.

5) leisure mooring and you only live aboard part time: no legal issues, but you need a place to live when you're not on the boat.

6) continuously cruise (CC). Legally you need to move at least every 2 weeks and you "must" be genuinely cruising the network. In practise the latter is a grey area, if you only move 2 miles every fortnight you might get hassled by BW or even taken to court, but more importantly you'll incur the wrath of many boaters who resent the fact that you are neither paying for a mooring nor genuinely CCing. Again the CC licence doesn't give you a permanent address.

 

 

Please don't take the bad replies to heart as there are many people on this forum willing to help and give really good advice especially to newbies and I for one am VERY grateful to those who have helped me on this forum.

[sueb]

With 2 & 3 if a neighbour wants to go to the council and say you haven't got planning permission you will be told to leave your mooring.

Sue

[carlt]

With 2 & 3 if a neighbour wants to go to the council and say you haven't got planning permission you will be told to leave your mooring.

Only if planning permission is required.

 

The link I gave in post #5 tells of boaters whoe won a case because it was found that mooring a boat, that is your home, against land tat did not have residential planning permission, did not not constitute a change of use therefore planning permission was not required.

[12uthy]

Thank you so much Tim

You have given me precisely what I was looking for; a concise and simple answer to a genuine question. You've been a great help, thank you.

 

I wonder if the moderators would consider moving this thread to the FAQ section as I'm sure it will be of help to other newbys too.

[carlt]

 

I wonder if the moderators would consider moving this thread to the FAQ section as I'm sure it will be of help to other newbys too.

Unfortunately it is a FAQ that has no definitive answer.

 

Contrary to popular opinion you are not breaking the law, if you are living on land which has no residential planning permission and if somebody complains to the planning authority you will not be "told to leave your mooring", by the planning officer, you will be told to apply for retrospective planning permission. The landowner may not want the hassle and turf you off, of course.

 

I lived for many years next to an offside BW mooring, with no residential planning permission.

 

No laws were broken and the mooring is still occupied by liveaboards, 5 years later, with no hassle.

[Sunset Rising]

It is also worth saying that you can often/sometimes get around the 'residential' laws when living in a leisure marina by taking your boat out for a tour for a couple of weeks twice a year.