Theo Posted July 12, 2011 Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 I have the impression that a horse boat and a butty are the smae thig except that the butty is towed by a monkey boat and the horse boat by a horse. Am I right? Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlt Posted July 12, 2011 Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 No (in my opinion) a butty is always paired with a motor (buttying up). I would assume that horseboats that ended up buttying to a motor would then be called a butty. Happy to be contradicted, btw (and expect to be). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Schweizer Posted July 12, 2011 Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 I have the impression that a horse boat and a butty are the smae thig except that the butty is towed by a monkey boat and the horse boat by a horse. Am I right? Nick It has always been my understanding that the term butty derives from an old Northern mining expression meaning friend or workmate, hence it's associaon with partnering a motor boat. Therefore, a single boat, whether bow hauled or towed by a horse cannot be a Butty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BelgiumBrit Posted July 12, 2011 Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 I have the impression that a horse boat and a butty are the smae thig except that the butty is towed by a monkey boat and the horse boat by a horse. Am I right? Nick Ask Sir David Attenborough ? He'd know for sure ........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitman Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 It has always been my understanding that the term butty derives from an old Northern mining expression meaning friend or workmate, hence it's associaon with partnering a motor boat. Therefore, a single boat, whether bow hauled or towed by a horse cannot be a Butty. My mate's dad always says 'alright chip butty!?' to me when he says hello. Never understood it, but when I found out that Butty possibly meant 'mate' it sort of figured. Maybe 'Buddy' is from the same word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magpie patrick Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 It's not just northern England, in south Wales a butty is a mate "Chw Mae me butt" isn't an invitation for a bite of me arse but a greeting to a friend. Wye Valley Brewery honour this tradition with a beer named "Butty Bach" or little mate On one level Theo they are more or less the same vessel with different terminology, although I suspect tht if you started designing from first principles there would be detail differences: a butty is pulled by the boat in front, sometimes on cross straps, a horse drawn boat from the bank, always on a long line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanalWalker Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 I have only ever heard Butt or Butty in the south west or south wales. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxglove Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 So how about Iona , the horsedrawn trip boat on the River Wey ? She's the GU small woolwich 'Bellerophon' , built and worked as a butty . Now working with one horsepower . Butty or horseboat ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlt Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 So how about Iona , the horsedrawn trip boat on the River Wey ? She's the GU small woolwich 'Bellerophon' , built and worked as a butty . Now working with one horsepower . Butty or horseboat ? Once a butty, now a horseboat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan_fincher Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 So how about Iona , the horsedrawn trip boat on the River Wey ? She's the GU small woolwich 'Bellerophon' , built and worked as a butty . Now working with one horsepower . Butty or horseboat ? Butty being used as a horseboat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Schweizer Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 So how about Iona , the horsedrawn trip boat on the River Wey ? She's the GU small woolwich 'Bellerophon' , built and worked as a butty . Now working with one horsepower . Butty or horseboat ? Boat originally built as a Butty, but now used as a Horse boat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitman Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 I have only ever heard Butt or Butty in the south west or south wales. My mate's dad is from cov, but was originally from a traveling family Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlt Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 My mate's dad is from cov, Wouldn't he call you a 'Chip Batch' then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy-Neil Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 On one level Theo they are more or less the same vessel with different terminology, although I suspect tht if you started designing from first principles there would be detail differences: a butty is pulled by the boat in front, sometimes on cross straps, a horse drawn boat from the bank, always on a long line A horse boat wouldn't have the tunnel hooks on the rear for breasting up.... I've never quite worked out why motor boats had the mast and luby though, lest it was that early diesels were unreliable. What's an unpowered boat called when it's being bowhauled.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitman Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 Wouldn't he call you a 'Chip Batch' then? Amongst other things, he's bonkers. Spends most of his time living up in Kirkcudbright now with all the other crazy people lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlt Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 What's an unpowered boat called when it's being bowhauled.... If it's a motor, with no mast and Luby, I used to call them a right pain in the arse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timleech Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 A horse boat wouldn't have the tunnel hooks on the rear for breasting up.... Why are they called tunnel hooks, then? Originally fitted when horse boats were towed through tunnels in trains, AIUI. Ok early horse boats would not have had them What's an unpowered boat called when it's being bowhauled.... Broken down. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twbm Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 I have the impression that a horse boat and a butty are the smae thig except that the butty is towed by a monkey boat and the horse boat by a horse. Am I right? Nick Monkey boat? What's an unpowered boat called when it's being bowhauled.... A heavy, difficult to control, bastard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek R. Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 As the use of a Tunnel hook would prevent the line to the boat behind from fouling the Ram's Head, which would have been the case if towing from the 'T' stud forward of the pintle, why would early horse boats NOT have had Tunnel hooks? Or did certain builders leave the hook off as they were not thought to have worked tunnels? That doesn't sound likely to me. Does the practice of horse boats built without tunnel hooks reach back to the 'Legging' years, before tugs took over? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twbm Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 Broken down. Tim Umm - how does a boat with no engine break down? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magpie patrick Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 Monkey boat? Another, not often used, name for a motor. I think it's a reference to a Mr Monk? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek R. Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 Monkey boat? Think we've been here before: Cabins designed by a chap called Monk. First Motor built by a Mr. Monk. Lots of kids popping out of cabins like Monkeys. Bolinder engines making boats jump up and down like the Monkey on an Organ grinders instrument (careful now . . .) And others. Umm - how does a boat with no engine break down? By decomposition whilst sat on the bottom, difficult to move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timleech Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 As the use of a Tunnel hook would prevent the line to the boat behind from fouling the Ram's Head, which would have been the case if towing from the 'T' stud forward of the pintle, why would early horse boats NOT have had Tunnel hooks? Or did certain builders leave the hook off as they were not thought to have worked tunnels? That doesn't sound likely to me. Does the practice of horse boats built without tunnel hooks reach back to the 'Legging' years, before tugs took over? Exactly, no tugs means no need for tunnel hooks. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steilsteven Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 If it's a motor, with no mast and Luby, I used to call them a right pain in the arse. You must've been doing it wrong then, any pain should have been in your shoulders Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Sinclair Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 It's not just northern England, in south Wales a butty is a mate "Chw Mae me butt" isn't an invitation for a bite of me arse but a greeting to a friend. Wye Valley Brewery honour this tradition with a beer named "Butty Bach" or little mate On one level Theo they are more or less the same vessel with different terminology, although I suspect tht if you started designing from first principles there would be detail differences: a butty is pulled by the boat in front, sometimes on cross straps, a horse drawn boat from the bank, always on a long line Butty is a very old English word for Friend or Companion. The Americans corrupted it into Buddy. A boatman had his horse and the towed Butty boat A motor and butty worked as a pair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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