Sign Of The Times (Burgulary)

[Alan de Enfield]

There are numerous threads started on the topic of "is it safe to moor here" etc. - is it any safer in a house ?

 

In the last couple of months one of the pubs in the village has been broken into 3 times, another has been broken into twice.

 

We live out in the 'sticks' about a mile from the village and our nearest neighbour (half a mile away) has been broken into 5 times. The house is unoccupied whilst its being refurbished and they have taken everything from the builders tools to the copper piping. Having no telephone line, the Police left a radio-controlled alarm system after the second break-in, that was stolen during the third break in and dumped in a field.

 

It does make one a little nervous to leave the place un-occupied.

 

Sign of the times ?

[Frankieboy]

I know this may bring forth many different views, but my honest opinion is that it is a sign of the times.

It seems these days that the police often have their hands tied, or too much paperwork to be able to deal with various things efficiently. Couple that with the lenient sentences people get who are actually caught and all of a sudden, burglary may even seem like a worthwhile occupation. It shouldnt be, but I think the problem is the potential outcome of ay a burglary, can be seen to outweigh the risks and consequences of getting caught.

If you ask me, we should bring back harsher sentences, and give the local bobbies the right to give a young hoodlem a quick cluib round the ear if theyre up to no good.

[Chris Pink]

Bring back flogging I say.

 

And why stop there, transportation to the colonies was one of the things that made this country what it is today.

 

Ooo...and don't you just love a good hanging? That bit when you think they're dead and then they twitch a bit more.

 

That'll stop the little bastards.

[NB Alnwick]

Bring back flogging I say.

 

And why stop there, transportation to the colonies was one of the things that made this country what it is today.

 

Ooo...and don't you just love a good hanging? That bit when you think they're dead and then they twitch a bit more.

 

That'll stop the little bastards.

 

I have two community payback lads working with me at the moment - surely the harshest of punishments ever . . .

[Sir Nibble]

and give the local bobbies the right to give a young hoodlem a quick cluib round the ear if theyre up to no good.

This is one that always amazes me, summary corporal punishment. Suppose you're driving along and a copper pulls you over, says your driving is erratic and breath tests you. You pass, so the copper says that your driving is nonetheless erratic, punches you hard in the face and says don't do it again.

A silly example of course, so he shouldn't hit that hard, how hard should he hit? in joules, who measures it? who decides if what is administered is a punitive "clip" or police brutality? How about if the driver is over 90, no way that bloke should be assaulted, so at what age do you cut off? How about if the bobby is mistaken? or predjudiced? Summary punishment without recourse to law is not justice, it's anarchy of the worst kind.

[sociable_hermit]

Not sure why you're focussing on the negative there, Chris.

 

The main point he seems to be making is that crime is becoming more attractive.

 

That can be tackled in two ways. Firstly, by making the penalties for crime more severe, and secondly, by making the non-criminal alternatives more attractive and more accessible.

 

Though even then, there are some people who are 'career criminals' and always will be.

[Strads]

sounds like one set of scroats running a small patch.. not a wide problem,,,,

[carlt]

Sign of the times?

 

When I was a lad repeat burglaries were commonplace.

 

Turn a place over, wait a few weeks for the stuff to get replaced on the insurance, then hit the place again.

 

Sign of the times, my Dad told me.

 

Now when he was a lad places used to get robbed for basic household stuff and sold down the pub, when the rations weren't enough.

 

Sign of the times, my Grandad said.

 

Now when he was a lad it was okay for a policeman to beat children and they still had the death penalty.

 

Crime was non-existent, then....oh, hang on, no it wasn't.

Edited April 6, 2011 by carlt

[jonk]

Bring back flogging I say.

 

And why stop there, transportation to the colonies was one of the things that made this country what it is today.

 

Ooo...and don't you just love a good hanging? That bit when you think they're dead and then they twitch a bit more.

 

That'll stop the little bastards.

 

I think that this reversed a while back didn't it?

[canaldrifter]

Sign of the times?

 

When I was a lad repeat burglaries were commonplace.

 

Turn a place over, wait a few weeks for the stuff to get replaced on the insurance, then hit the place again.

 

Sign of the times, my Dad told me.

 

Now when he was a lad places used to get robbed for basic household stuff and sold down the pub, when the rations weren't enough.

 

Sign of the times, my Grandad said.

 

Now when he was a lad it was okay for a policeman to beat children and they still had the death penalty.

 

Crime was non-existent, then....oh, hang on, no it wasn't.

 

Wots changed since the days when folks left their front doors unlocked, is that now neighbours don't watch out for each other so much, the community spirit is disappearing, the punishment does not fit the crime, and there is far less policing.

 

The main problem is the lack of policing. Doesn't matter what the punishment is if you are not going to get caught.

 

Today's story of the soldier who rushed out into the street, naked, and punched a car thief through the car window until he ran off is heart warming..... but the soldier will be lucky not to get done for assault.

 

punch here

 

Tone

[choogh]

My daughter-in-law, went to check the boat last night while I'm away. She got as far as unzipping the front cover before she was challenged by a boater, who demanded to know who she was, and what right she had to be where she was....... Seem's it's not all bad..

[Sunset Rising]

And bacjk into Victorian times with the like of Oliver Twist etc.

 

Always been there.

 

Dont make it right, or even ok, though.

[Chris Pink]

I have two community payback lads working with me at the moment - surely the harshest of punishments ever . . .

 

What crime did you commit to get that unnatural and cruel punishment?

 

Not sure why you're focussing on the negative there, Chris.

 

The main point he seems to be making is that crime is becoming more attractive.

 

Well of course it is, it's not rocket science, amplify the wage differentials in society to ridiculous levels, disenfranchise most of the youth, make renting or buying a property an unreachable goal, entrench an overpaid, self serving bureaucracy and let the rich get away with tax crime and expenses fraud - what do you expect?

 

 

 

that can be tackled in two ways. Firstly, by making the penalties for crime more severe,

 

 

Flogging the peasants won't stop the crime but it makes for good sport.

Edited April 6, 2011 by Chris Pink

[Tiny]

Unfortunately we live in a soft Nanny state country. I was fascinated to see some uni girl on TV who, having collapsed after drinking not much the night before and refused a trip to hospital decided next day that maybe she should be checked for spiked drinks and called for a paramedic. (one got the impression she expected an ambulance to whisk her off.

 

When the medic arrived one might expect him to ask why the poor thing didn't go to A&E herself as she was tieing up resources. But no, he is so tied up in possible reprecussions that if she says shes got a headache he has to assume the worst and she gets an ambulance.

 

In the same episode an old lady who had fell and maybe broke her nose plus possible internal injuries just wanted to get home and have a cuppa and really needed a lot of persuasion that she should trouble the health service. Of course she was not brought up in the nanny state unlike the student who's not much drink seemed an awful lot the the paramedic and who proved not to have been drugged. In contrast the old lady did have damage though not to her nose so her trip to hospital was much more necessary.

 

 

 

 

 

at

Edited April 6, 2011 by Tiny

[Lady Muck]

Unfortunately we live in a soft Nanny state country. I was fascinated to see some uni girl on TV who, having collapsed after drinking not much the night before and refused a trip to hospital decided next day that maybe she should be checked for spiked drinks and called for a paramedic. (one got the impression she expected an ambulance to whisk her off.

 

When the medic arrived one might expect him to ask why the poor thing didn't go to A&E herself as she was tieing up resources. But no, he is so tied up in possible reprecussions that if she says shes got a headache he has to assume the worst and she gets an ambulance.

 

Well I'm of the attitude that it isn't a medics job to make judgements. I suspect I was spiked once, because I had two glasses of wine in a pub, left at nine, got in a taxi and was found unconscious in a West End street hours later by two men who called an ambulance. Ironically I'd left early because I was with colleagues who were all heavy drinkers (I was not)and I didn't want to get drunk. I still wonder whether I was one of John Warbuoys victims, the more I think about it, the more I think I might've been. Something seems familiar.

 

I probably looked like I'd been binge drinking. My partner said my behaviour was very odd though, I was very docile and open to suggestion. I can't remember anything from when I got in the taxi until the following morning. My memory is a blank. My colleagues were really shocked as I was sober when I left them.

 

I'm grateful that no one judged what they saw and that I was rescued. Imagine if I'd been left there in the street because I was an 'irresponsible binge drinker'. It was a nightmare and I shudder to think what could've happened to me.

Edited April 6, 2011 by Lady Muck

[Québec]

"What is happening to our young people? They disrespect their elders, they disobey their parents. They ignore the law. They riot in the streets inflamed with wild notions. Their morals are decaying. What is to become of them?"

 

Plato, 4th Century BC

 

http://www.anxietyculture.com/antisocial.htm

[Chris Pink]

Unfortunately we live in a soft Nanny state country.

 

So we we live is such a 'soft nanny state" how come it's full of right wing Daily Mail crap like the stuff you've just spouted?

[carlt]

Of course she was not brought up in the nanny state

 

How old was the old lady, when they invented alcohol and alcohol related accidents, then?

 

I had an old aunty who used to neck one of those plastic barrels of cheap sherry, a day. Remember them?...oh no, you wouldn't would you? Cheap booze is a product of today's broken society, isn't it.

 

When she took a fall, and thought she'd broke her hip, I don't recall the pre-nanny state ambulance men, refusing to transport her to A&E.

[Chertsey]

Perhaps someone would care to post the burglary statistics for the last few decades so that we can see whether it is actually getting worse? All this pontificating is meaningless without the context of some facts.

[Québec]

Unfortunately we live in a soft Nanny state country.

 

I assume you're using the Royal 'we', as I would rather not be included in your borrowed headline opinions and prejudices.

And what, precisely, is this 'Nanny State' supposed to be?

And what sort of state would you like to live in?

I'm assuming it's something along the lines of the 'get-on-yer-bike', 'pull yourself up by your own bootstraps', 'the strongest will survive', 'there's no such thing as society' view of society that wreaked so much damage.

 

The shadow of Mrs. T. looms large.

[Québec]

Perhaps someone would care to post the burglary statistics for the last few decades so that we can see whether it is actually getting worse? All this pontificating is meaningless without the context of some facts.

 

source:

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/hub/crime-justice/crime/property-crime/index.html

click on 'Overview'

 

interesting to observe that the rates rose significantly during the long rule of an avowedly anti-Nanny state government.

Edited April 6, 2011 by Québec

[muddywaters]

I know this may bring forth many different views, but my honest opinion is that it is a sign of the times.

It seems these days that the police often have their hands tied, or too much paperwork to be able to deal with various things efficiently. Couple that with the lenient sentences people get who are actually caught and all of a sudden, burglary may even seem like a worthwhile occupation. It shouldnt be, but I think the problem is the potential outcome of ay a burglary, can be seen to outweigh the risks and consequences of getting caught.

If you ask me, we should bring back harsher sentences, and give the local bobbies the right to give a young hoodlem a quick cluib round the ear if theyre up to no good.

Oh yes the harsher punishment argument again.

Never has and never would work.

At one time we had public hangings for pickpockets and what happened.

While the hangings where taking place people where in the crowd picking pockets.

So how much of a deterrent was that

[Chris Pink]

Oh yes the harsher punishment argument again.

Never has and never would work.

At one time we had public hangings for pickpockets and what happened.

While the hangings where taking place people where in the crowd picking pockets.

So how much of a deterrent was that

 

Rather hang them than have them clogging up prisons costing us money.

 

At least when they're hung they stay hung and cause no trouble no more.

 

Flog' 'em until they squeal then hang them high.

[Guest wanted]

Going on the young people that I work with everyday I would say that about 4 out of the 53 young people (16-18) that we have had through our doors since May last year were involved in the Youth offending team. I can't remember the last time someone came home drunk and I have seen a damn sight more inspiration in the face of adversity than I imagine a lot of the doom peddlers would.

 

Never mind an increasing level of crime, I am getting hacked off with the increasing intolerance that I read and see most days.

I was on a bus going through Hounslow at the weekend and saw two police officers searching a young lad in the street. Much to my disgust they proceeded to undo his trousers and pull them down to search his boxers. Would this have happened to a 45 year old white bloke who had been stopped for speeding? I doubt it very much.

 

The answer, in my opinion is to remember that the young people today are YOU in 20 years time.

 

It's a no brainer that with increasing levels of poverty comes crime.

 

Distribute wealth and promte tolerance I say,

[Iain_S]

Oh yes the harsher punishment argument again.

Never has and never would work.

At one time we had public hangings for pickpockets and what happened.

While the hangings where taking place people where in the crowd picking pockets.

So how much of a deterrent was that

 

The missing factor is probability of conviction. If this is low, the punishment has to be severe to preserve a negative cost benefit. If the burglar was caught and convicted after every job, a light sentence, (with no concurrent sentencing) would probably be enough to deter. This does not happen if the conviction rate (NOT detection rate) is low.

 

Iain