Tragic news.

[RLWP]

Indeed ....... Maybe now,this thread may get back to the original discussion, about a 36 yr old man who died tragically. This thread is NOT about you 'Dickie' !

 

Well, that's put me firmly in my place. I look forward to watching your progress on this site with interest

 

Richard

 

Edited July 6, 2011 by RLWP

[LoneWolf]

OK Patrick, please present the facts of the case as used in the trial. Then we can properly criticise the judge and the sentence

 

Otherwise, it's all hot air and speculation

 

Richard

 

and the pre-sentencing report of course

 

 

Ah Richard , but we know that you are NEVER wrong though don't we ? You do like the sound of your own voice now don't you ?

 

Very silly to join in on the distractions of a troll, really very silly ...........You are just taking this thread 'off topic' ( and seemingly enjoying it too ) , May i remind you , this thread is about a man who died in tragic circumstances., so grow up mate! Maybe his family , and certainly his friends ( on here ) will read this thread. They will of course make their own mind up about you and your cronies as I have. Your behaviour is disgraceful and shameful.You are a bore .............. let's at least hear something interesting and original from you for a change, instead of jumping into personal criticism or weak attempts at ascerbic wit ! Oddly, you can never carry it off !

 

back under your bridgehole, i wont be feeding you

[BelgiumBrit]

Well, that's put me firmly in my place. I look forward to watching your progress on this site with interest

 

Richard

 

 

Says the forum 'bully' ! Yes,Dickie , I too will be interested to see that !Sink or swim eh ? Already had a few pm's , you are not as popular as you like to think.I suggest you learn some respect for others, and take a break. People are 'tiring' of the old bore apparently ! Just takes some 'new blood' to make a challenge sometimes.

Edited July 6, 2011 by BelgiumBrit

[Guest]

Says the forum 'bully' ! Yes,Dickie , I too will be interested to see that !Sink or swim eh ? Already had a few pm's , you are not as popular as you like to think.I suggest you learn some respect for others, and take a break. People are 'tiring' of the old bore apparently ! Just takes some 'new blood' to make a challenge sometimes.

Edited July 7, 2011 by MJG

[nb Innisfree]

 

Richard the forum 'bully' - get real ...

 

Stop beating round the bush

 

Quoted text only edited

Edited July 7, 2011 by NB Alnwick

[Smelly]

Wow... I nearly missed a fight!

 

The word "assumption" is being mistakenly.used. BB's position is an inference rather than assumption; it is based on evidence, albeit inconclusive, rather than simple assumption with no basis in fact.

 

I have had the unenviable privelege of walking past a Merc that had; a few hours previously, thrown a housemate of mine at Uni over a 15ft hedge. I was under no illusion that the impact.that killed her outright made a hell of a noise. Suffice to say.I would've stopped,.and looked around.

 

Admittedly.I've.not.read all of this, but people I usually.respect.seem to.be erring from their usual reason for the sake of argument that is not, in rational thinking, justified.

 

Take a breath (and Belgium, shut up for a.bit; folk can't see your argument.for your.arguing; it doesn't help...)

 

I typed that before reading the end of.the thread...

 

Belgium I will not be derogatory and stand by my comments above; it's not surprising.you've got some.backs up... Take a breath, or.take more water with it!

[magpie patrick]

Says the forum 'bully' ! Yes,Dickie , I too will be interested to see that !Sink or swim eh ? Already had a few pm's , you are not as popular as you like to think.I suggest you learn some respect for others, and take a break. People are 'tiring' of the old bore apparently ! Just takes some 'new blood' to make a challenge sometimes.

 

I'm not that keen on pursuing this sort of discussion on this thread, so I'll keep it to this. Most of the big hitters on here (and I suspect you are on your way to being one) probably have been the subject of PM's such as you describe, it can get quite amusing when two land in the ol' inbox, One from A telling me that B is a twonker and one from B telling me that A is a few sausages short of a BBQ.

 

I'm sure someone has said such about me, probably rightly...

[Barry]

Are you not capable of reading the entire thread before commenting ? Check page one ( O.P ) and beyond ......... that is where my info comes from ! Keep up !

 

I apologise to Travis

 

His first post was dated November and when the thread was started again yesterday I picked it up from Josher's post without going back and reading the first two pages again so I had forgotten that Travis knew the guy. I feel awkward about forgetting that.

[carlt]

I objected, when we weren't allowed to discuss the canal related murder/manslaughter, some time ago.

 

This thread has convinced me that the mods were right, in that case, and have allowed this thread to go on for far too long.

 

My thoughts are with the man killed, and his friends and family who have been deprived of his company....

 

I don't know enough to judge whether the punishment was just or not, but considering the small percentage of death through dangerous driving convictions that lead to a custodial sentence, I don't find it surprising.

Edited July 7, 2011 by carlt

[Gibbo]

Says the forum 'bully'...

 

Already had a few pm's...

 

you are not as popular as you like to think...

 

People are 'tiring' of the old bore apparently !...

 

Aren't there internet "guidelines" regarding these sort of comment? Something along the lines of "I'm a beginner at this usenet forum thingy so I don't know that it's obvious to everyone else that I made them all up and/or used old tired insults from the very early days".

[Travis]

Thank you Bazza.

 

Thank you Carl.

 

Andy.

[Guest]

I apologise to Travis

 

Ditto - I shouldn't have got into toll feeding in this thread in particular.

[magpie patrick]

Ditto - I shouldn't have got into troll feeding in this thread in particular.

 

Me too: Travis, apologies and condolences. I know your loss was some months ago but with court cases I guess the grieving process gets dragged out, which must be unpleasant

[mayalld]

Aren't there internet "guidelines" regarding these sort of comment? Something along the lines of "I'm a beginner at this usenet forum thingy so I don't know that it's obvious to everyone else that I made them all up and/or used old tired insults from the very early days".

 

Back in the good old usenet days it would have been

 

"Ah yes, the lurkers support you by e-mail"

[Neil2]

I find it very difficult to articulate my feelings on this issue, it raises feelings that are beyond my ability to express but I wanted to make a few points anyway.

 

I've been a cyclist all my life, in fact for twenty years or so it was my life, when I was a racing man, but sadly, I have to all intents and purposes given up road cycling now.

 

Over the years many of my friends and aquaintances have been injured by motorists, and a number have been killed. One good friend died in circumstances very similar to those described in this thread. The culprits were never caught on that occasion but to this day they have to live with the fact that they must know they killed another human being. You have to be pretty solid for that not to affect you. A family man, Steve was universally popular and the entire club turned out for his funeral, one of the most emotional gatherings I have ever attended. The strength of feeling was such that a new memorial trophy was founded, which apart from honouring the memory of a genuinely nice bloke serves as a reminder of how lives can be wrecked by the carelessnes and selfishness of others. Every year the trophy is awarded I hope this is what people reflect on.

 

I had "my" accident in the late 1980's when I was hit by a driver exiting a side road. I was lucky to get away with a broken collar bone and cheek bone. The driver claimed not to have seen me, the universal excuse.

 

I personally never cycle(d) in so called cycle lanes. Many of the accidents I know of have happened to cyclists travelling within these lanes, and it's because the motorist doesn't feel so obliged to make room. A few years ago a race I was competing in was stopped when a Porsche hit a competitor from behind. The driver apparently admitted the cyclist had been within a designated cycle lane. You tell me...

 

If I were to detail all the incidents I know of personally this would turn into a very long post, but basically I came to the conclusion this year that cycling on the roads of this country is now far too dangerous an activity. You will see every day how close motorists come to causing an accident and in fact many do without even realising it. Yes, you can hit a cyclist a glancing blow in a car and not be aware of it - it happens all the time.

 

The culture of this country has turned well and truly in favour of the motorist, largely because of the overwhelming number of vehicle drivers and the relatively small number of folk who travel by bicycle. It isn't surprising that the legal system reflects this. So there is no point in expecting justice in these situations.

 

Whatever the ins and outs of the incident under discussion here, no-one can deny that it was an avoidable trajedy. The vast majority of these cases are.

 

The answer lies in making the vehicle driver entirely culpable unless it can be proven that the victim, whether cyclist, pedestrian, horse rider or whatever has behaved in a reckless manner so as to place his/herself at risk.

Only by such a change of emphasis will motorists start to take their responsibilities seriously.

 

For me, the risks involved in cycling now far outweigh the pleasure and I see no likelihood of this changing in anything like the near future. Depressing but true.

[Guest]

I had "my" accident in the late 1980's when I was hit by a driver exiting a side road. I was lucky to get away with a broken collar bone and cheek bone. The driver claimed not to have seen me, the universal excuse.

 

I can say with some authority, having many years ago pulled out in front of a cyclist and him hitting my car side that it is possible to 'not see' an oncoming cyclist even when they are patently right there bearing down on you. There is a name for the phenomena but I can't recall it at the mo.

 

I knew from the clatter he'd ran into me though.

 

I was incredibly lucky as he had managed to swerve and hit my car with a 'glancing' blow, he still ended up on the road. Both him and his bike were undamaged and he quickly got to his feet.

 

The whole thing was witnessed by a mini bus full of police officers which was following the cyclist and they of course stopped. I expected to be cautioned and charged with something but they must have had bigger fish to fry as having satisfied themselves both the cyclist and his bike were OK and we'd exchanged details they sped off.

 

I consider myself to be incredibly lucky that I had not injured or even killed him...

[nb Innisfree]

The road where Mike died is straight, 40ft wide and has a yard wide bike lane.

 

The man who killed him stopped in sight of the accident, just a couple of hundred yards up the road. There he re-attached his front bumper and threw the loose bits of his car behind the local bus stop shelter. When found the pieces had Mikes blood on them. One of the first people who stopped to help Mike saw the accused's van.

 

He then drove up to the local factory, made his delivery and drove back down the same road, right past where people were trying to revive Mike. And still he drove back to Hyde.

 

He didn't go to trial, he pleaded guilty earlier, not surprising when he was caught bang to rights.....he was sentenced this week.

 

So....he is guilty, Mike is dead and family and friends feel cheated.

 

And NB innifree, I think you are a mouthy tw*t. Please feel free to pop into Barnoldswick when your ccing, the whole town would love to hear your pathetic points.

 

Andy.

 

I have obviously upset some people with my posts and I do apologise to you and anyone who is personally involved, my intention was not to upset those involved so as a gesture I will stop posting on the forum for a while at least and let things calm down. My wife and I very much enjoyed our stay in Barnoldswick last year just before the tragic incident and I do hope not to be greeted negatively if and when we visit again.

 

Yes you are right I can be a mouthy tw*t at times.

[andywatson]

I find it very difficult to articulate my feelings on this issue, it raises feelings that are beyond my ability to express but I wanted to make a few points anyway.

 

I've been a cyclist all my life, in fact for twenty years or so it was my life, when I was a racing man, but sadly, I have to all intents and purposes given up road cycling now.

 

Over the years many of my friends and aquaintances have been injured by motorists, and a number have been killed. One good friend died in circumstances very similar to those described in this thread. The culprits were never caught on that occasion but to this day they have to live with the fact that they must know they killed another human being. You have to be pretty solid for that not to affect you. A family man, Steve was universally popular and the entire club turned out for his funeral, one of the most emotional gatherings I have ever attended. The strength of feeling was such that a new memorial trophy was founded, which apart from honouring the memory of a genuinely nice bloke serves as a reminder of how lives can be wrecked by the carelessnes and selfishness of others. Every year the trophy is awarded I hope this is what people reflect on.

 

I had "my" accident in the late 1980's when I was hit by a driver exiting a side road. I was lucky to get away with a broken collar bone and cheek bone. The driver claimed not to have seen me, the universal excuse.

 

I personally never cycle(d) in so called cycle lanes. Many of the accidents I know of have happened to cyclists travelling within these lanes, and it's because the motorist doesn't feel so obliged to make room. A few years ago a race I was competing in was stopped when a Porsche hit a competitor from behind. The driver apparently admitted the cyclist had been within a designated cycle lane. You tell me...

 

If I were to detail all the incidents I know of personally this would turn into a very long post, but basically I came to the conclusion this year that cycling on the roads of this country is now far too dangerous an activity. You will see every day how close motorists come to causing an accident and in fact many do without even realising it. Yes, you can hit a cyclist a glancing blow in a car and not be aware of it - it happens all the time.

 

The culture of this country has turned well and truly in favour of the motorist, largely because of the overwhelming number of vehicle drivers and the relatively small number of folk who travel by bicycle. It isn't surprising that the legal system reflects this. So there is no point in expecting justice in these situations.

 

Whatever the ins and outs of the incident under discussion here, no-one can deny that it was an avoidable trajedy. The vast majority of these cases are.

 

The answer lies in making the vehicle driver entirely culpable unless it can be proven that the victim, whether cyclist, pedestrian, horse rider or whatever has behaved in a reckless manner so as to place his/herself at risk.

Only by such a change of emphasis will motorists start to take their responsibilities seriously.

 

For me, the risks involved in cycling now far outweigh the pleasure and I see no likelihood of this changing in anything like the near future. Depressing but true.

 

I am a long term cyclist with similar experiences including friends killed and injured so I concur with your views.

 

As I said in my previous post I am not surprised by the lenient sentence.

It seems to me that it's currently worth leaving the scene of an accident because some excuse or extenuating circumstances can always be found and exploited.

Until the courts start taking this crime seriously this type of event will continue.

 

My wife has started cycling having recently given up serious running.

I worry about what might happen to her more than myself.

[NB Alnwick]

It appears that there was a heated exchange in the early hours that resulted in the posting of personal insults and inappropriate language. Some of these posts have been edited or deleted and official warnings will be issued if this behaviour is repeated.

[Guest]

It appears that there was a heated exchange in the early hours that resulted in the posting of personal insults and inappropriate language. Some of these posts have been edited or deleted and official warnings will be issued if this behaviour is repeated.

 

Why has the post calling Richard a bully been allowed to remain?

 

Is not calling somebody a bully a personal insult?

[carlt]

Why has the post calling Richard a bully been allowed to remain?

 

Is not calling somebody a bully a personal insult?

Perhaps because calling Richard a 'bully' is so silly that it could only have been uttered in jest?

[Barry]

Hear hear!

[Clivo]

I could be forgiven for thinking that we have a two tier judicial system.

 

Screw with the establishment and they'll always find a prison cell for you. Take a life and they seem to think a slap on the wrists is appropriate.

 

I seem to recall only a few years ago that a pensioner (female) only increased her council tax payment by exactly the same percentage as her pension went up, which left her paying short of the required amount. She was sentenced to 3 months. Got out a week or two later after a well wisher stepped in with a financial gesture.

 

Anybody else remember that one ???

 

Clivo

[Laurie Booth]

A 75-year-old woman has started a prison sentence after being convicted of non-payment of council tax.

Mary Rooney was led away in handcuffs from Warley Magistrates' Court to serve a seven day sentence at Brockhill Prison near Redditch in Worcestershire.

 

She claimed to have lost part of her garden in a boundary dispute with neighbours in 1991.

 

As a result she paid Council Tax for Band A not the higher Band B and Sandwell Metropolitan Council, north of Birmingham, sued her for the difference which amounted to £360 over the intervening period.

 

Condemnation

 

Her seven day sentence was condemned by neighbours and by Help the Aged, and has divided Sandwell's ruling Labour administration.

 

Sentencing her, the chairman of the bench said: "In a democratic society, we have a duty to ensure payment of council tax so that appropriate services can be provided."

[Gibbo]

Screw with the establishment and they'll always find a prison cell for you. Take a life and they seem to think a slap on the wrists is appropriate.

 

Absolutely. It isn't an accident. It is a deliberate ploy by the government. They absolutely refuse to be messed with (unless you're rich in which case you can do what you want) and they want everyone to know that.

 

Broken finger edit.

Edited July 7, 2011 by Gibbo