Traditional Stern where do you stand...

[Phil Speight]

I prefer to be away from the arc of the tiller because it can sweep you into the cut quite easily in the event of an emergency maneover or fouling of the rudder. i would find a close encounter with a spinning propeller unpleasant.

My feelings exactly. Steer from infront of the tiller , on the step in the hatches or even sitting ( on a pleasant day ) on the edge of the roof with your feet in the cabin. You can even steer with the small of your back while nonchalantly rolling a cigarette - oh those were the days....................

Phil

[ditchcrawler]

I'm stating the obvious, I'm sure, but I certainly would no longer want to stand in the hatches of a boat where if I slipped off, I ended up on a prop shaft, or (more particularly), the nasty moving parts associated with it, (all those nuts and bolts on a flexible coupling, for example).

 

 

snip

 

If you need to uncover things to do emergency maintenance, then if at all possible, tie up somewhere first.

 

As to the original question, people have been killed by being swept of the back of a boat by the swing of the tiller, some within the last few years.

I think the last one that I heard about was a chap going over top of the rail on the back of a cruiser stern vessel. A few years ago a young lady went under the prop and was killed in Birmingham

Brian

[Chris J W]

Well i spent the morning trying to steer from inside. I just cant get comfy, after 5 days traveling my arm muscles are giving out so i had to go back to the side but made sure i had a leg and an arm inside just incase. This afternoon has been spent making a start on the Tardebigge so i was back to inside again. I'm on lock dutie the rest of this afternoon so i dont have to worry about it for the rest of today.

Dads going to build me a proper step when we get home so i feel safer inside.

 

Yes, it certainly helps when you've more space under your feet. I was going to extend my back step forward somehow, but then I was given a beer crate that's just the right height and means I can now stand properly without the tiller-arm digging into my back.

 

It does take some getting used to, but work at it and you'll soon wonder how you could have done it any other way!

[blackrose]

I tried to stand on the stern of someone's trad the other day while we went a short distance down the tidal Thames.

 

I'm afraid I have to say, as much as I've often longed for an engine room to store all my junk I'm so glad I opted for a cruiser stern on my own boat. There was hardly enough room for one, let alone two on deck, so I had to stand on the steps to the engine room. The steerer admitted to having to step around the back of the tiller sometimes (as this was easier for him than ducking under it), and although dangerous that might be acceptable on a canal, it most definately isn't on a tidal river.

[Chickadee]

I tried to stand on the stern of someone's trad the other day while we went a short distance down the tidal Thames.

 

I'm afraid I have to say, as much as I've often longed for an engine room to store all my junk I'm so glad I opted for a cruiser stern on my own boat. There was hardly enough room for one, let alone two on deck, so I had to stand on the steps to the engine room. The steerer admitted to having to step around the back of the tiller sometimes (as this was easier for him than ducking under it), and although dangerous that might be acceptable on a canal, it most definately isn't on a tidal river.

 

Blimey, that sounds a bit dangerous! Never attempted anything like that.

 

Wish I was steering this afternoon, did Tardebigge and Stoke Prior. Fell on my knee again this afternoon. Think i might need a holiday after all this!

[Richard T]

What is really important is to have the tiller the right height and length for your boat. The tiller need to be a couple of inches higher than the cabin top and be long enough to extend over the backdoors by about 6ins. That way you can do as Phil suggests and steer with the small of your back whilst opening a tinny or bottle of your chosen poison!! You can also steer by sitting on the roof. As the slide runners eventually cut off all circulation to legs, you can make a nice padded seat. I've made a pair for several boats which get a lot of use.

Incidentally trad hire boats often have a little sign over the top step saying 'steering position'

[Liam]

The tiller need to be a couple of inches higher than the cabin top and be long enough to extend over the backdoors by about 6ins.

 

I agree, but you need to make sure that when you put the tiller hard over, that the whole thing stays within the profile of the boat or there is a possibility of it getting caught in locks etc. Tiller strings come in handy for this.

[NB Alnwick]

I tried to stand on the stern of someone's trad the other day while we went a short distance down the tidal Thames.

 

The stern deck of a traditional boat is not designed for standing on when the boat is moving and it is certainly not a good place for a party. Of course that doesn't stop us trying

[Liam]

Yeah, the gunnel comes in handy for that, just ahead of the steering position.

[blackrose]

The stern deck of a traditional boat is not designed for standing on when the boat is moving and it is certainly not a good place for a party. Of course that doesn't stop us trying

 

You mean you have to sit on the roof? I'd always assumed those people were posing I saw the same guy going past twice, sitting on his roof steering with his foot & eating a bowl of cereal (or was it soup?) Anyway, he was definately a poser.

 

So if you're not supposed to stand on the stern deck where do you step ashore from?

Edited April 16, 2008 by blackrose

[Liam]

The stern deck of a traditional boat is not designed for standing on when the boat is moving and it is certainly not a good place for a party. Of course that doesn't stop us trying

 

You obviously have to 'put your foot down' on the stern deck but it's not for standing on as you go along...

[SteveE]

The problem with keeping out of the arc of the tiller is that all the steering actions have to be with the arm and shoulder and this may result in the discomfort in these areas mentioned above. My own view is that the risk of hit by the tiller when going forward is negligible and I tend to push the tiller with my hip and pull it with my upper arm. This has the added advantage that the hands can be kept in the pockets for most of the time. Different techniques employed for winding or reversing.

 

Short stature can certainly be a problem when looking ahead and a safely secured heightener is certainly recommended.

SteveE

[Liam]

If it wasn't for me standing infront of the tiller I would of either have got wet or quite badly hurt...

 

I was pootling along passed some moorings, when there was a big bang and the tiller shot off to the side and the engine stopped. If I would of been stood on the same side that the tiller shot over too, you would need to call me flat stanley, as there was only a few inches between the tiller and the back rail. A log had ended up trying to through through the prop, but had been knocked up into the weedhatch, through the blades of the prop. It took me ages to get the bugger out with a lump hammer.

[NB Alnwick]

Short stature can certainly be a problem when looking ahead and a safely secured heightener is certainly recommended.

 

Sometime in the early to mid sixties, I have a vague memory of seeing a little chap of about nine or ten years old steering the motor while standing on one of those wooden Corona pop bottle cases - bright orange in colour it was.

 

That is the box not the boy!

[blackrose]

You obviously have to 'put your foot down' on the stern deck but it's not for standing on as you go along...

 

You trad stern people obviously inhabit a different world - I had no idea you weren't supposed to stand on your own deck. It sounds a bit like a self-imposed hardship...

 

Have any of you thought about a bucket seat perched up high on the tiller arm which you sit in and swing around with the tiller, steering by means of a rope in each arm which is attached to the boat

Edited April 16, 2008 by blackrose

[Liam]

I did try that, but kept on hitting my head on the bridges!!

 

The only reason I do not stand on the back deck whilst cruising is for safety reasons only, the same as you wouldn't stand on a Pelican crossing, apart from to cross from one side to the other!

[Chickadee]

You trad stern people obviously inhabit a different world - I had no idea you weren't supposed to stand on your own deck. It sounds a bit like a self-imposed hardship...

 

Have any of you thought about a bucket seat perched up high on the tiller arm which you sit in and swing around with the tiller, steering by means of a rope in each arm which is attached to the boat

 

Like mr bean with the arm chair on the mini?

[Chris J W]

Have any of you thought about a bucket seat perched up high on the tiller arm which you sit in and swing around with the tiller, steering by means of a rope in each arm which is attached to the boat

 

Now there's an idea! Could make going 'hard over' for, such as, winding even more fun!

[Bones]

i had no idea whatsoever that it was dangerous to stand on the back deck. I do now, but I didn't. And some boat builders build seats especially for being on the back deck - or does sitting not count as standing....

[Postcode]

Now there's an idea! Could make going 'hard over' for, such as, winding even more fun!

 

The first time I have been on a trad as crew for any length of time was last weekend and it confirmed to me the benefits of a semi trad.

 

Discussing it with Chris I like the idea of a slide that has both a semi trad opening or a trad hatch. With some design there is a great compromise possible.

Edited April 16, 2008 by st170dwl

[alan_fincher]

And some boat builders build seats especially for being on the back deck - or does sitting not count as standing....

Erm, good point!

 

Possibly if you are sitting on some of those things, ("Taff Rails aren't they called ?"), then the maximum swing of some tillers might not be quite enough to topple you over, and push you in. But, I'm not sure - I think I have seen some where you could be in some danger if your rudder struck an edge is a bout of uncontrolled reversing...

 

And on how many boats that have them, can you sit there and safely reach throttle or gears ?

 

I'm sure there are those that love them, but if I had them my first reaction would be to reach for a hacksaw, I'm afraid.

 

I do agree, that the idea of having a large push back hatch, with a smaller traditional sized one built in sounds to give the best of both worlds.

 

I'm not sure they always look to pretty, but it definitely has it's advantages if you want to accommodate passengers sagely at the "blunt" end.

 

Alan.

[NB Alnwick]

i had no idea whatsoever that it was dangerous to stand on the back deck.

 

Its especially dangerous for skeletons . . .

 

But seriously, I've struggled to find historical images but I know I have dozens in books that show the professional steerers standing inside the cabin doors with the doors secured behind them and the rope coiled up on the cabin roof when underway. Except during the warmest weather, I am sure this was the way it was. Many more photographs taken at or near locks show the cabin doors open but I am sure these would have been closed but for the fact that the steerer is about to step on or off.

 

Edited April 17, 2008 by NB Alnwick

[DHutch]

i had no idea whatsoever that it was dangerous to stand on the back deck. I do now, but I didn't. And some boat builders build seats especially for being on the back deck - or does sitting not count as standing....

Yeah its not somthing you would think of if not told prehaps, or seen it happen.

- There was a fully blow investication i think into the death of a hire boater who was knocked off the back by the tiller while the boat was hard astern.

- That was actaully a cruiser stern where the same applys (keep out of tillers swing) knocked backwards over the taff rails and into the stream of water.

 

Someone will be able to find the thread, but i must get to bed!!

 

 

 

Daniel

[Chertsey]

Erm, good point!

 

Possibly if you are sitting on some of those things, ("Taff Rails aren't they called ?"), then the maximum swing of some tillers might not be quite enough to topple you over, and push you in. But, I'm not sure - I think I have seen some where you could be in some danger if your rudder struck an edge is a bout of uncontrolled reversing...

 

And on how many boats that have them, can you sit there and safely reach throttle or gears ?

 

I'm sure there are those that love them, but if I had them my first reaction would be to reach for a hacksaw, I'm afraid.

 

Had a boat with them once and thought they were a liability. They left a really narrow space to squeeze through to get on and off. with the danger of getting your clothes caught on the corners of the hatches. Sure too that they wouldn't have stopped you being swept off, just ensured that you'd fall from a greater height and head first. Never tried sitting on them - that sounds like asking for trouble.

[Chickadee]

I saw a guy yesterday with a bar stool out on his trad stern deck. This must be the most stupid way ever. Least i have a chance to keep myself on when stood up.