Realistic Cruising Times on the Huddersfield Narrow Canal

[Captain Pegg]

I'm looking at my options for a trip to the north from June to September. I'd like to include Standedge tunnel which of course means booking a passage and as I'm not a liveaboard I'll be progressively moving the boat along a series of short term paid moorings (I generally only leave the boat on the towpath in places I know well).

 

Hence I need some realistic cruising times and I'm not sure I can rely on CanalPlan defaults for that when it comes to the Huddersfield narrow.

 

It's 13 miles and 32 locks from Dukinfield Junction to Diggle and if that were a Midlands canal I'd be happy to do that sort of distance and number of locks in one day. But given what I might reasonably expect to find in June/July how long do those in the know think I should allow on the basis of having one person to steer and one to work the locks?

 

And the same question for the descent over 8 miles and 42 locks, which again is a long day on a Midlands canal.

 

For planning I'll assume the tunnel itself is a day on it's own. I'd be delighted if folks think 5 days is sufficient to cover the whole lot.

 

 

 

 

 

[IanD]

7 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

I'm looking at my options for a trip to the north from June to September. I'd like to include Standedge tunnel which of course means booking a passage and as I'm not a liveaboard I'll be progressively moving the boat along a series of short term paid moorings (I generally only leave the boat on the towpath in places I know well).

 

Hence I need some realistic cruising times and I'm not sure I can rely on CanalPlan defaults for that when it comes to the Huddersfield narrow.

 

It's 13 miles and 32 locks from Dukinfield Junction to Diggle and if that were a Midlands canal I'd be happy to do that sort of distance and number of locks in one day. But given what I might reasonably expect to find in June/July how long do those in the know think I should allow on the basis of having one person to steer and one to work the locks?

 

And the same question for the descent over 8 miles and 42 locks, which again is a long day on a Midlands canal.

 

For planning I'll assume the tunnel itself is a day on it's own. I'd be delighted if folks think 5 days is sufficient to cover the whole lot.

 

 

From our HNC experiences the locks themselves are mostly no worse (or better) than many others, the most likely cause of unexpected delays is pounds with low water levels, because there are so few boats moving on the HNC to ensure that the levels stay up. We've had delays like this on every HNC trip, with delays ranging from half an hour to half a day.

 

The problem nowadays with Standedge is the extremely limited number of passages allowed (3 per week each way, one per day on three days IIRC) -- so getting a passage when you want one will be hard enough, and if you get delayed and miss your slot you could have to wait a long time for the next free one. Unless another booked boat is delayed and misses theirs and you can nick it... 😉

 

We did a one-way trip (effectively 6.5 days) over the HNC (hire from Shire) from Ashton to Sowerby Bridge with four of us on the boat, it was quite hard work but we loved it 🙂

Edited March 13, 2023 by IanD

[Captain Pegg]

1 minute ago, IanD said:

 

From our HNC experiences the locks themselves are mostly no worse (or better) than many others, the most likely cause of unexpected delays is pounds with low water levels, because there are so few boats moving on the HNC to ensure that the levels stay up. We've had delays like this on every HNC trip, with delays ranging from half an hour to half a day.

 

The problem nowadays with Standedge is the extremely limited number of passages allowed (3 per week each way, one per day on three days IIRC) -- so getting a passage when you want one will be hard enough, and if you get delayed and miss your slot you could have to wait a long time for the next free one. Unless another booked boat is delayed and misses theirs and you can nick it... 😉

 

Thanks for the response. That's kind of what I expected and I may have to take the risk that if I get heavily delayed I'll just have to forego the tunnel, turn around and visit some place else.

 

Looking at the CRT online booking site it appears there are 2 passages available in each slot and the date(s) I had in mind are still available.

 

My ideal scenario is to set off from somewhere top end of Macc/Peak Forest on one weekend and be in Huddersfield (or some other suitable mooring site) by the next weekend.

 

However I do note there is/was a marina at Greenfield which would considerably de-risk things but it's online presence has evaporated. Does anyone know of it's status?

 

[IanD]

16 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

 

Thanks for the response. That's kind of what I expected and I may have to take the risk that if I get heavily delayed I'll just have to forego the tunnel, turn around and visit some place else.

 

Looking at the CRT online booking site it appears there are 2 passages available in each slot and the date(s) I had in mind are still available.

 

My ideal scenario is to set off from somewhere top end of Macc/Peak Forest on one weekend and be in Huddersfield (or some other suitable mooring site) by the next weekend.

 

However I do note there is/was a marina at Greenfield which would considerably de-risk things but it's online presence has evaporated. Does anyone know of it's status?

 

 

I'd say you should be fine, but don't push the timing especially on the way up to the tunnel, and bear in mind where you can moor and what time you have to be there -- we moored up near the Navigation (excellent food but you need to book) and went up the locks to the tunnel the next morning by ourselves, CART say you now need to be at 24W at 8am and they'll take you up.

 

Then after the tunnel you can moor at Marsden, and stroll down to the Riverhead Brewery Tap in the evening... 🙂

 

5 days from Dukinfield to Huddersfield should be plenty even with two of you, Standedge and low pounds...

Edited March 13, 2023 by IanD

[Hudds Lad]

Keep an eye on Stanley Dawson Lock (1E), they are limiting passage there as well.

 

 

Lock 1E, Stanley Dawson Lock – Booking information for passage – Monday 20th March 2023 to November 2023

Due to fluctuating water levels caused by several factors including the overall design of the canal in the area. It is necessary to limit passage to boaters and for one of our operatives or volunteers to operate the lock for you.

Lock 1 East will be available for passage from 20th March 2023 to November 2023

Passage is available at 9am and 3pm slots for either  direction of travel Monday to Sunday.

Bookings are made on online (https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/enjoy-the-waterways/boating/go-boating/planning-your-boat-route/booking-your-passage-online) or by calling the office on 03030 404040 within working hours with 48 hours notice given. Please indicate in the notes section when booking online whether you are travelling upstream or downstream as this helps our operators prepare the water levels for use.

We appreciate your patience with this. The booking system is aimed at helping you arrange an ontime passage in advance of your arrival. Bookings can be made up to a minimum of 48 hours prior to use of the lock.  Please be aware you will only be able to go as far as lock 32E without a Standedge Tunnel booking.

We look forward to meeting you on the Huddersfield Narrow Canal.

 

 

 

Edited March 13, 2023 by Hudds Lad
remove multiple 'as well' 's

[Adam]

5 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

I'd say you should be fine, but don't push the timing especially on the way up to the tunnel, and bear in mind where you can moor and what time you have to be there -- we moored up near the Navigation (excellent food but you need to book) and went up the locks to the tunnel the next morning by ourselves, CART say you now need to be at 24W at 8am and they'll take you up.

 

Then after the tunnel you can moor at Marsden, and stroll down to the Riverhead Brewery Tap in the evening... 🙂

Where did you find this info? I'm booked for the tunnel shortly and was considering going up to the summit a couple of days before. I don't think I have read it in anything they have sent me. It was the case 10-15 years ago from memory.

 

 

 

 

Op our itinerary is as follows:

 

Day 1 -Marple aqueduct / dukinfield to Roaches lock (15w I think)

Day 2 - Roaches to Diggle 

Day 3 - Tunnel / down the Marsden flight

Day 4 - Marsden flight to Slaithwaite / Huddersfield

 

 

Many years ago we did Marsden summit to Mirfield in one very long day. 

[Captain Pegg]

3 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

I'd say you should be fine, but don't push the timing especially on the way up to the tunnel, and bear in mind where you can moor and what time you have to be there -- we moored up near the Navigation (excellent food but you need to book) and went up the locks to the tunnel the next morning by ourselves, CART say you now need to be at 24W at 8am and they'll take you up.

 

Then after the tunnel you can moor at Marsden, and stroll down to the Riverhead Brewery Tap in the evening... 🙂

 

So CRT escort boats up the last eight or nine locks then? I missed that detail. Overall though that makes the trip a bit easier and a therefore a little more reliable I'd have thought.

 

[IanD]

1 minute ago, Adam said:

Where did you find this info? I'm booked for the tunnel shortly and was considering going up to the summit a couple of days before. I don't think I have read it in anything they have sent me. It was the case 10-15 years ago from memory.

 

Op our itinerary is as follows:

 

Day 1 -Marple aqueduct / dukinfield to Roaches lock (15w I think)

Day 2 - Roaches to Diggle 

Day 3 - Tunnel / down the Marsden flight

Day 4 - Marsden flight to Slaithwaite / Huddersfield

 

Many years ago we did Marsden summit to Mirfield in one very long day. 

 

You can't go to Diggle on Day 2, you have to moor overnight below 24W going up, CART then take you up and through the tunnel from there the following morning.

[Captain Pegg]

4 minutes ago, Hudds Lad said:

Keep an eye on Stanley Dawson Lock (1E), they are limiting passage there as well.

 

 

Lock 1E, Stanley Dawson Lock – Booking information for passage – Monday 20th March 2023 to November 2023

Due to fluctuating water levels caused by several factors including the overall design of the canal in the area. It is necessary to limit passage to boaters and for one of our operatives or volunteers to operate the lock for you.

Lock 1 East will be available for passage from 20th March 2023 to November 2023

Passage is available at 9am and 3pm slots for either  direction of travel Monday to Sunday.

Bookings are made on online (https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/enjoy-the-waterways/boating/go-boating/planning-your-boat-route/booking-your-passage-online) or by calling the office on 03030 404040 within working hours with 48 hours notice given. Please indicate in the notes section when booking online whether you are travelling upstream or downstream as this helps our operators prepare the water levels for use.

We appreciate your patience with this. The booking system is aimed at helping you arrange an ontime passage in advance of your arrival. Bookings can be made up to a minimum of 48 hours prior to use of the lock.  Please be aware you will only be able to go as far as lock 32E without a Standedge Tunnel booking.

We look forward to meeting you on the Huddersfield Narrow Canal.

 

 

 

 

I noted that. I'll see about booking that at the same time allowing probably a day in between the tunnel and 1E.

 

I won't even set off in that general direction without a booking and west to east is my plan.

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

12 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

 

My ideal scenario is to set off from somewhere top end of Macc/Peak Forest on one weekend and be in Huddersfield (or some other suitable mooring site) by the next weekend.

Are you doing this journey alone?

my stops, working alone would be

say, top of Marple as a Start

then over night at

Duckingfield

Stalybridge  preferably Roaches lock if I were making good headway

Uppermill or Wool End

If I had day to spend I’d stop over at Marsden otherwise keep on til Slaithwaite 

Titanic Mill

Huddersfield

 

or summat similar. 
 

Three days up three days down 🤷‍♀️

[Captain Pegg]

3 minutes ago, Adam said:

Where did you find this info? I'm booked for the tunnel shortly and was considering going up to the summit a couple of days before. I don't think I have read it in anything they have sent me. It was the case 10-15 years ago from memory.

 

 

 

 

Op our itinerary is as follows:

 

Day 1 -Marple aqueduct / dukinfield to Roaches lock (15w I think)

Day 2 - Roaches to Diggle 

Day 3 - Tunnel / down the Marsden flight

Day 4 - Marsden flight to Slaithwaite / Huddersfield

 

 

Many years ago we did Marsden summit to Mirfield in one very long day. 

 

That looks good, noting that I have less far to go on the first two days and depending on tunnel timing and lock 1E booking I'll probably have some contingency to stop and visit a couple of places. I am familiar with the surroundings though. I spent the wettest day of my life surveying in Milnsbridge.

[IanD]

10 minutes ago, Adam said:

Where did you find this info? I'm booked for the tunnel shortly and was considering going up to the summit a couple of days before. I don't think I have read it in anything they have sent me. It was the case 10-15 years ago from memory.

 

Op our itinerary is as follows:

 

Day 1 -Marple aqueduct / dukinfield to Roaches lock (15w I think)

Day 2 - Roaches to Diggle 

Day 3 - Tunnel / down the Marsden flight

Day 4 - Marsden flight to Slaithwaite / Huddersfield

 

Many years ago we did Marsden summit to Mirfield in one very long day. 

https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/places-to-visit/standedge-tunnel-and-visitor-centre/boating-through-standedge-tunnel

Edited March 13, 2023 by IanD

[Adam]

9 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

You can't go to Diggle on Day 2, you have to moor overnight below 24W going up, CART then take you up and through the tunnel from there the following morning.

 

 

They must not of incurred a water shortage yet. Is there other space to moor up there other than the tunnel moorings? I did note they had winter moorings there this year.

 

 

Quote

Site Information

For Marsden to Diggle passages, please arrive at the Marsden tunnel portal for 8:00am on the morning of your passage. You may moor up beside the tunnel entrance after 5pm the day before your transit, but not before.

For Diggle to Marsden passage please arrive at the Diggle tunnel portal for 11:30am on the morning of your passage.

Please note that the tunnel keepers may measure your boat prior to entry to the tunnel.

Petrol engines and fibre glass boats cannot pass through the tunnel.

 

 

Edited March 13, 2023 by Adam
Email screenshot

[IanD]

1 minute ago, Adam said:

 

 

They must not of incurred a water shortage yet. Is there other space to moor up there other than the tunnel moorings? I did note they had winter moorings there this year.

 

CART say you have to stay above 42E (Marsden top lock), we moored just above it outside the pub so I assume this is still possible.

[Captain Pegg]

2 minutes ago, Goliath said:

Are you doing this journey alone?

my stops, working alone would be

say, top of Marple as a Start

then over night at

Duckingfield

Stalybridge  preferably Roaches lock if I were making good headway

Uppermill or Wool End

If I had day to spend I’d stop over at Marsden otherwise keep on til Slaithwaite 

Titanic Mill

Huddersfield

 

or summat similar. 
 

Three days up three days down 🤷‍♀️

 

I'll have some help. Either my dad to steer (too old to work locks) or if my folks aren't up to it I'll commandeer my lad to help.

 

Reality is such that I can't hang about.

 

 

[Pete of Ebor]

The issue we had in May '22 was that C&RT were reluctant to let us pass  Stanley Dawson 1E - even though we had a booking for the tunnel. What happened was that a lock near Dobcross [30W] had failed so they cancelled our tunnel passage and our passage of 1E without telling either us or Shire Cruisers who we had hired from. We arrived at 1E to be told we had no booking and that another boat was booked instead. The chap on the ground was fine - he rang and eventually found out that we had had a booking which they had cancelled - so after much to-ing and fro-ing with his boss, he eventually  persuaded them to  let us up. It turned out that lock 30W was still being fixed when we got to  Slaithwaite, so they would not let us go any further. Just be aware that almost any failure on the HNC will see them stopping booked passages.

Edited March 13, 2023 by Pete of Ebor

[Captain Pegg]

12 minutes ago, Pete of Ebor said:

The issue we had in May '22 was that C&RT were reluctant to let us pass  Stanley Dawson 1E - even though we had a booking for the tunnel. What happened was that a lock on the west side near Diggle had failed so they cancelled our tunnel passage and our passage of 1E without telling either us or Shire Cruisers who we had hired from. We arrived at 1E to be told we had no booking and that another boat was booked instead. The chap on the ground was fine - he rang and eventually found out that we had had a booking which they had cancelled - so after much to-ing and fro-ing with his boss, he eventually  persuaded them to  let us up. It turned out that the diggle lock was still being fixed when we got to  Slaithwaite, so they would not let us go any further. Just be aware that almost any failure on the HNC will see them stopping booked passages.

 

I have to say that in planning a trip it does feel like CRT make things off-putting.

 

At present the CRT website suggests there are no passages over the eastern L&L after this week. I'm sure that's not the case but it does not give confidence that I can reliably plan to spend three months doing a big ring across the Pennines and back. And that's before I consider it hasn't rained much this winter. Well not in my part of the country anyway.

 

ETA (because the software has merged my responses):

 

So this business about locks 24W to 32W seemed to apply to morning passages.

 

At present the west to east passage is only available in the afternoon so boaters make their own way up to Diggle by 1130.

 

Again that gives a bit more time to get there and given there will be very long hours of daylight I'm sure I'll manage.

 

I'm encouraged by folks feedback. Thanks all, and isn't it great to discuss stuff about simply going boating?

 

Edited March 13, 2023 by Captain Pegg

[IanD]

19 minutes ago, Adam said:

 

 

They must not of incurred a water shortage yet. Is there other space to moor up there other than the tunnel moorings? I did note they had winter moorings there this year.

 

 

 

 

I believe the information you showed is out of date, the one I posted is up to date.

 

 

I expect that means that if you're at 24W by 0800 you *will* get through the tunnel because the CART team will make sure you do.

Edited March 13, 2023 by IanD

[Pete of Ebor]

I don't want to put you off.. The HNC is well worth the effort. You just need to be aware of it's  [many] issues. Our crew has been boating for 30 years, and Standege was one of the few remaining things we've never managed. Following all the issues last year, we decided our trip this year would be an easy pootle around the little-used bits of the BCN. Naively, we thought BCN because if there's a lock failure there may well be another way round it..

and now we find that the Farmer's Bridge flight is closed... maybe we're just jinxed !

[IanD]

2 minutes ago, Pete of Ebor said:

I don't want to put you off.. The HNC is well worth the effort. You just need to be aware of it's  [many] issues. Our crew has been boating for 30 years, and Standege was one of the few remaining things we've never managed. Following all the issues last year, we decided our trip this year would be an easy pootle around the little-used bits of the BCN. Naively, we thought BCN because if there's a lock failure there may well be another way round it..

and now we find that the Farmer's Bridge flight is closed... maybe we're just jinxed !

 

Agreed, probably the most enjoyable stretch of canal we've done (twice), and Standedge is an experience not to be missed. But then we *love* locks... 😉

Edited March 13, 2023 by IanD

[Captain Pegg]

9 minutes ago, Pete of Ebor said:

I don't want to put you off.. The HNC is well worth the effort. You just need to be aware of it's  [many] issues. Our crew has been boating for 30 years, and Standege was one of the few remaining things we've never managed. Following all the issues last year, we decided our trip this year would be an easy pootle around the little-used bits of the BCN. Naively, we thought BCN because if there's a lock failure there may well be another way round it..

and now we find that the Farmer's Bridge flight is closed... maybe we're just jinxed !

 

It only takes a weekend to explore the BCN. I recommend 27th/28th May.

 

My reasons for doing Standedge are similar. I used to visit parts of the Huddersfield narrow and Rochdale canals before they were restored on Sunday trips out when I lived in York. I wouldn't have believed they'd have been open well within a decade of that time. In fact I'm not sure that I believed either would ever reopen throughout.

9 minutes ago, IanD said:

I believe the information you showed is out of date, the one I posted is up to date.

 

 

I expect that means that if you're at 24W by 0800 you *will* get through the tunnel because the CART team will make sure you do.

 

That's a level of detail that isn't present on the notice on the stoppages site (unless I've not read it all).

 

It doesn't really matter because the trip is definitely a weekend start from the Marple area (I'm eying up New Mils for proximity to the railway station) and midweek through Standedge. There's time either way providing I'm at least at 24W by the previous evening.

 

ETA - is the discrepancy because your information is literally current (albeit moot because the canal is closed) whereas I'm reading the notices that apply for the 2023 season that is yet to start?

Edited March 13, 2023 by Captain Pegg

[Adam]

11 minutes ago, IanD said:

I believe the information you showed is out of date, the one I posted is up to date.

 

 

I expect that means that if you're at 24W by 0800 you *will* get through the tunnel because the CART team will make sure you do.

Info I copied from my booking email. I have emailed them with your link asking to confirm this years procedure. I will update the thread with their response 

[magpie patrick]

I've done it in both directions (on the same trip!) 

 

Dukinfield to Uppermill

Uppermill to Marsden including the Tunnel

Marsden to Linthwaite

Linthwaite to Huddersfield 

 

Then Back

Huddersfield to Slaithwaite

Slaithwaite to Marsden

Marsden to Roaches Lock

Roaches Lock to Marple

 

I think the main point is you can do each side in less than two days, but you can't do either of them in one day and once you add in the tunnel you're on 3-4 days end to end 

[Jon57]

21 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

 

I have to say that in planning a trip it does feel like CRT make things off-putting.

 

At present the CRT website suggests there are no passages over the eastern L&L after this week. I'm sure that's not the case but it does not give confidence that I can reliably plan to spend three months doing a big ring across the Pennines and back. And that's before I consider it hasn't rained much this winter. Well not in my part of the country anyway.

 

ETA (because the software has merged my responses):

 

So this business about locks 24W to 32W seemed to apply to morning passages.

 

At present the west to east passage is only available in the afternoon so boaters make their own way up to Diggle by 1130.

 

Again that gives a bit more time to get there and given there will be very long hours of daylight I'm sure I'll manage.

 

I'm encouraged by folks feedback. Thanks all, and isn't it great to discuss stuff about simply going boating?

 

Welcome to the northern waterways you’ll have mussels in your spit by the time you’ve finished.👍😜

[Mac of Cygnet]

Looks like I experienced the best days of the HNC.  There were some restrictions on the Marsden flight the first couple of times (2007 and 2008) and of course you had to be pulled through the tunnel by electric tug, but for most of my time I just went where and when I liked.  There were closures and obstacles and other problems of course, but I never planned so it didn't matter.  I did it in less than 5 days once singlehanded.  Another time I took a month over it, not because I was stuck, but because I liked the HNC so much.  And left my boat for a week at a time both on the East and West.   With the various restrictions that seem to be in place now, I don't think it would have been my usual route South and back over the years.