Chinese diesel heater woes.

[Bacchus]

21 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Yes the documentation seems to be the problem, not the heaters.

 

This has been an ongoing problem for 30 years initially with Japanese products and now Chinese, which seem even worse. This is possibly the first shot across the bows that the Chinese must document their products properly instead of treating the manual and user instructions as the optional 'nice to have but not essential' attitude they currently have.

 

This thread illustrates the currently poor standard of documentation and technical support, but I guess that is one of the ways they manage to be so cheap. 

 

As a person considering doing a bit of freelance technical authoring, I sense an opportunity.

 

I just need to learn Chinese...

 

 

[MtB]

12 minutes ago, nicknorman said:

I’m going to disagree with the boilerman. The temperature sensor is just about the water overheating. And normally there are 2 sensors, one to reduce the output when it gets “quite hot” and another, that should never activate, when the water gets “way too hot!” which shuts if off. Shades of a LiFePO4 system!

 

There will be a flame detector that “sees” the flame, an LDR or other type of optical sensor. This is what will trigger the “flameout” fault code, not a coolant underheat. The only question is whether it is an actual flameout caused by a fuel issue, or a sensor fault seeing an “imaginary flameout”. I would start out by locating the optical flame sensor and cleaning it / any glass between it and the flame.

 

Twaddle. Having dismantled my first one down to its bones before deciding to go ahead and fit it, I can confirm it has one heat sensor and no flame monitoring. 

 

It relies wholly on data from the one heat sensor to figure out what is going on. Another way they make it so cheap! 

 

 

[TheBiscuits]

1 hour ago, nicknorman said:

I’m going to disagree with the boilerman. The temperature sensor is just about the water overheating.

 

Are you sure?  Most of the standalone diesel heaters are air blowers not wet CH systems.

[peterboat]

9 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

Are you sure?  Most of the standalone diesel heaters are air blowers not wet CH systems.

Much used in campervan and very good they are.

[Tom and Bex]

What length ducting are you using with it, and how many outlets?

 

Neither of ours (5kw) will run at full power with just 1 outlet for more than 10-20 mins without shutting down (can't remember error code). The heater with 2 outlets can run on full power for hours with both outlets open. 

[rusty69]

7 hours ago, Tom and Bex said:

What length ducting are you using with it, and how many outlets?

 

Neither of ours (5kw) will run at full power with just 1 outlet for more than 10-20 mins without shutting down (can't remember error code). The heater with 2 outlets can run on full power for hours with both outlets open. 

It only has one outlet connected via the ducting that came with it, maybe 1m,though I have tried it without. 

 

Interesting that yours shuts down too. Maybe they aren't supposed to run on full power. 

Edited December 12, 2022 by rusty69

[Tracy D'arth]

I run one of the cased ones in a workshop, flat out most of the day. Never missed a beat. Its on a battery with a small charger attached.

Burns dirty reclaimed diesel, sump oil and kerosene mix, whatever is around.

[MtB]

14 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

I run one of the cased ones in a workshop, flat out most of the day. Never missed a beat. Its on a battery with a small charger attached.

Burns dirty reclaimed diesel, sump oil and kerosene mix, whatever is around.

 

Does it run ok on water and diesel bug mixture? 

 

 

[Tracy D'arth]

1 hour ago, MtB said:

 

Does it run ok on water and diesel bug mixture? 

 

 

That's silly, of course not, you can't mix bug and diesel, the bugs can't swim.

[rusty69]

14 hours ago, Quattrodave said:

Just a thought, what power heater is it and what size fuel pump have you got?

Here is the information from the pump body.

13 hours ago, MtB said:

 

21c, 52k Ohms. 

 

Seems to be dropping slightly as my meter warms up (was outside in the -3c rain room) 

 

 

 

5 degrees C, 105 K . I would measure it at 21C, but the heaters broken.

[MtB]

2 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

5 degrees C, 105 K . I would measure it at 21C, but the heaters broken.

 

Light the oven. That's what its for innit?

Or another suggestion would be to install a Squirrel, and light that...

 

[rusty69]

2 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Light the oven. That's what its for innit?

Or another suggestion would be to install a Squirrel, and light that...

 

I don't have any chinese squirrels to set fire to.

 

Ok, so, i'm now gonna have to heat the damn broken heater up to get a comparable measurement with yours.

Or maybe you could cool yours down to 5 degrees C? 🙂

[MtB]

3 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

I don't have any chinese squirrels to set fire to.

 

Ok, so, i'm now gonna have to heat the damn broken heater up to get a comparable measurement with yours.

Or maybe you could cool yours down to 5 degrees C? 🙂

 

Ok lets swap. I'll put mine out in the freezing rain room for ten minutes and measure. You warm your sensor up in your hand for ten mins which will bring it up to 25c-ish. Then test. Cheaper than lighting squirrels.

[rusty69]

1 minute ago, MtB said:

 

Ok lets swap. I'll put mine out in the freezing rain room for ten minutes and measure. You warm your sensor up in your hand for ten mins which will bring it up to 25c-ish. Then test. Cheaper than lighting squirrels.

But, but, mine is inside the heater.

[Mad Harold]

These heaters are usually very reliable.I had one in my last boat and it was fine.

Looking on You Tube there are a few "rogue" ones, as yours is relatively new, could you contact the supplier to exchange yours for a new one.

Most suppliers "say" they have a guarantee, but sometimes this is a load of horse manure.

Might be worth a try.

[rusty69]

1 minute ago, Mad Harold said:

These heaters are usually very reliable.I had one in my last boat and it was fine.

Looking on You Tube there are a few "rogue" ones, as yours is relatively new, could you contact the supplier to exchange yours for a new one.

Most suppliers "say" they have a guarantee, but sometimes this is a load of horse manure.

Might be worth a try.

Probably could have done before I started taking it apart.

[rusty69]

1 hour ago, MtB said:

 

Ok lets swap. I'll put mine out in the freezing rain room for ten minutes and measure. You warm your sensor up in your hand for ten mins which will bring it up to 25c-ish. Then test. Cheaper than lighting squirrels.

Right, so my hand could only get it up to 17 C, and 66.4K, so I'm gonna suggest that is working ok, or they are both broken.

Edited December 12, 2022 by rusty69

[MtB]

12 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Right, so my hand could only get it up to 17 C, and 66.4K, so I'm gonna suggest that is working ok, or they are both broken.

 

 

And this one here is 156k Ohms in the garden. Prolly about 2c

 

[rusty69]

7 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

 

And this one here is 156k Ohms in the garden. Prolly about 2c

 

Just run it again. Error 8 after 10 minutes. The temperature is 5 C, the lowest setting it will go to is 8C, so I can't even run it on low now.😂

[Jess--]

15 hours ago, nicknorman said:

I’m going to disagree with the boilerman. The temperature sensor is just about the water overheating. And normally there are 2 sensors, one to reduce the output when it gets “quite hot” and another, that should never activate, when the water gets “way too hot!” which shuts if off. Shades of a LiFePO4 system!

 

There will be a flame detector that “sees” the flame, an LDR or other type of optical sensor. This is what will trigger the “flameout” fault code, not a coolant underheat. The only question is whether it is an actual flameout caused by a fuel issue, or a sensor fault seeing an “imaginary flameout”. I would start out by locating the optical flame sensor and cleaning it / any glass between it and the flame.

I will disagree with you as the heaters we are talking about are diesel air heaters, there is no coolant and there is no optical sensing

 

they work by heating the glowplug for a certain time, then spinning the fans up and pumping fuel in.

If they don't detect heat with a short time of adding fuel (using the single heat sensor) they shut down with a failed ignition code (and usually retry 1 more time)

as long as the heat sensor detects that there is heat (burner firing) but not too much heat the heater will carry on running at whatever fan speed and pump pulse rate it is set for

if it detect too much heat or a sudden loss of heat it will shut down with either an overheat of flameout error.

 

one thing for the OP to check... are the air inlets clear (burner and heater) if the burner intake (underneath) is restricted then it may not be getting enough air to burn at full speed and slowly chokes itself with unburnt fuel (expect white smoke from the exhaust)

if the heater inlet is restricted then the heater could be overheating and shutting down

[rusty69]

1 hour ago, rusty69 said:

Just run it again. Error 8 after 10 minutes. The temperature is 5 C, the lowest setting it will go to is 8C, so I can't even run it on low now.😂

I've just changed it to hz mode, and is now running on low again. 

 

Will check the air intake at next shutdown. 

Edited December 12, 2022 by rusty69

[MtB]

hz mode? Wossat then??!!

 

 

[rusty69]

4 minutes ago, MtB said:

hz mode? Wossat then??!!

 

 

Well, i'm not certain, but think its the pump frequency (pulse) setting, as opposed to the temperature setting. Whether they equate to the same thing is anyones guess.

[Jess--]

the heaters have 2 modes

temperature mode : the heater adjusts it's output based on the thermostat in the control panel (increasing heat output when it is below the set temp)

Hz mode : the heater runs at a preset speed based on the number of pulses of the fuel pump per second (ranges from 0.6Hz up to over 5Hz from memory), Higher pulse per second = higher fan speeds & higher heat output / fuel consumption.

[Mad Harold]

19 hours ago, rusty69 said:

 

 

Its only actually done about 30 hours, so is pretty new. I had trouble with my last one too, so won't be buying another one.

Have you installed this heater the same as the last one you had trouble with?

Try running with the combustion air pipe removed, (the corrugated one next to the exhaust pipe)

If it has the plastic silencer on the end this may be restricting the amount of combustion air, and could account for it running at a low setting, but not a high one.

Also check the heat exchanger air inlet and outlet for any restriction.

If none of the suggestions you have received work, then you may have a "rogue" one, so you have my sympathy.