making wheelhouse collapsible

[EllaGlssp]

I have inherited a wheelhouse that looks like it was formerly collapsible - all the sides are hinged. However, it seems that the roof has been replaced and bolted on . How would I go about making the roof easily removable to make the wheelhouse collapsible again?

Edited November 11, 2022 by EllaGlssp

[Guest]

13 minutes ago, EllaGlssp said:

I have inherited a wheelhouse that looks like it was formerly collapsible - all the sides are hinged. However, it seems that the roof has been replaced and bolted on . How would I go about making the roof easily removable to make the wheelhouse collapsible again?

 

 

You would need to use screw operated or clip type  'quick' release catches or quick release 'toggles'.

 

But then you have the issue of where to store the thing. Most collapsible wheel houses seem to have one when the roof folds forward (or backwards) on legs or frame onto the cabin roof.

 

 

Edited November 11, 2022 by M_JG
To add a bit

[David Mack]

Looking at the first picture and those bolts above the porthole, I suspect this may always have been a fixed roof with fixed corner pillars and windows that fold down.

The problem with a collapsible wheelhouse is that the roof is usually quite heavy, so to raise and lower it you either need the sort of mechanism Martin describes, or a team of people to assist. I have seen fabric roofs suggested, but then your wheelhouse becomes a sort of hybrid pram hood.

Edited November 11, 2022 by David Mack

[PaulJ]

I have done this on an old Broads Cruiser- as David Mack says weight is crititical.

A new light (as could be made) roof was made and some upside down 'L' shaped arms used.

The 'L' shape was needed to lift the roof off the screens when being taken off and then to lower back on when putting back on. It also meant the arms where less in the way when the roof was stored on the aft cabin roof. 

[Higgs]

I'd put a cratch-type covering on. I once got hold of a solid detachable roof, like yours. Just don't be holding on to it when the wind gets underneath it.

 

 

[David Mack]

A friend of mine was bow hauling a broken down boat past a load of boats moored against the towpath. One was an old fashioned wooden centre cockpit cruiser with a raised wheelhouse over the cockpit. My friend struggled to flick the rope over the top of the wheelhouse, then rope then got caught, and as the momentum of the towed boat carried it forward he found out that it was indeed a collapsible wheelhouse!

[EllaGlssp]

38 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Looking at the first picture and those bolts above the porthole, I suspect this may always have been a fixed roof with fixed corner pillars and windows that fold down.

The problem with a collapsible wheelhouse is that the roof is usually quite heavy, so to raise and lower it you either need the sort of mechanism Martin describes, or a team of people to assist. I have seen fabric roofs suggested, but then your wheelhouse becomes a sort of hybrid pram hood.

I would love to replace it with a fold down type of one but I have no idea who could help with that or how much it would cost..

39 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Looking at the first picture and those bolts above the porthole, I suspect this may always have been a fixed roof with fixed corner pillars and windows that fold down.

The problem with a collapsible wheelhouse is that the roof is usually quite heavy, so to raise and lower it you either need the sort of mechanism Martin describes, or a team of people to assist. I have seen fabric roofs suggested, but then your wheelhouse becomes a sort of hybrid pram hood.

It definitely was collapsible. There is a picture of the boat when it was first built - the roof looks different in it. And the wheelhouse sides don’t budge now- there is no way of opening them or using the hinges 

27 minutes ago, PaulJ said:

I have done this on an old Broads Cruiser- as David Mack says weight is crititical.

A new light (as could be made) roof was made and some upside down 'L' shaped arms used.

The 'L' shape was needed to lift the roof off the screens when being taken off and then to lower back on when putting back on. It also meant the arms were less in the way when the roof was stored on the aft cabin roof. 

This kind of thing would work well- I’ll have to look into someone who could help with that for a reasonable price

[Higgs]

11 minutes ago, EllaGlssp said:

I would love to replace it with a fold down type of one but I have no idea who could help with that or how much it would cost..

 

What is the fillet with the porthole made of. Can't tell. Is it plastic or aluminium?

 

 

Edited November 11, 2022 by Higgs

[EllaGlssp]

1 minute ago, Higgs said:

 

What is the fillet with the porthole made of. Can't tell. Is it plastic or aluminium?

 

 

It’s metal (not sure what kind though)

[Higgs]

6 minutes ago, EllaGlssp said:

It’s metal (not sure what kind though)

 

The roof obviously gives the structural rigidity. If you did get rid of the solid roof, you could get away with bracing the panels, which would also be acting as support for a less substantial roof, but one that would lessen the problems of handling the solid one. 

 

 

 

Edited November 11, 2022 by Higgs

[Tracy D'arth]

1 hour ago, EllaGlssp said:

I have inherited a wheelhouse that looks like it was formerly collapsible - all the sides are hinged. However, it seems that the roof has been replaced and bolted on . How would I go about making the roof easily removable to make the wheelhouse collapsible again?

Frogall tunnel will do it fastest!

[Bee]

Toggle clips / catches otherwise known as over centre clips etc. they are the best bet, So far as weight is concerned it doesn't look too big unless its been made with oak beams.

[GUMPY]

Parglena had a canvas wheelhouse roof.

Only downside was condensation sorted by fitting some plastic insulating panels under the canvas .

[Phoenix_V]

If you want to just replace the screwed on brackets with clamps have a look at the protex website, probably  something like this https://www.protex.com/8903-1069MSZN-YP-catchbolt-with-90-degree-keeper-and-safety-catch-mild-steel-zinc-plate-passivate-yellow

 

We have a canvas roof which is fine and has withstood all recent gales, BUT it does have a frame above the side windows and cross beams for bracing and to provide a rain shedding curve to the canvas

[EllaGlssp]

20 minutes ago, Phoenix_V said:

If you want to just replace the screwed on brackets with clamps have a look at the protex website, probably  something like this https://www.protex.com/8903-1069MSZN-YP-catchbolt-with-90-degree-keeper-and-safety-catch-mild-steel-zinc-plate-passivate-yellow

 

We have a canvas roof which is fine and has withstood all recent gales, BUT it does have a frame above the side windows and cross beams for bracing and to provide a rain shedding curve to the canvas

helpful- thanks! i imagine the current roof is wayyyy to heavy to lift on my own (though i haven’t tried). in which case i’d really need it replacing. Canvas could work though I like to use the wheelhouse as kind of an extra room, so ideally i’d have something like thin wood i can take off in panels. I’m also a little confused about how the metal porthole bits are removed as they are not hinged . 

[Phoenix_V]

1 minute ago, EllaGlssp said:

helpful- thanks! i imagine the current roof is wayyyy to heavy to lift on my own (though i haven’t tried). in which case i’d really need it replacing. Canvas could work though I like to use the wheelhouse as kind of an extra room, so ideally i’d have something like thin wood i can take off in panels. I’m also a little confused about how the metal porthole bits are removed as they are not hinged . 

I'll try and find some photos (might not be today) though mine is not the best design having "evolved" rather than thought out, the full width front and rear windows act as a frame and then there are 2 beams running front to back above the side windows  and doorwith cross beams just slotted in to them. If the weather is cold such that you are getting condensation then you probably don't want to be using the wheelhouse as a room, in summer it is fine. If you use panels as some do then the issue is going to be leaks along the joins, which probably ends up with the complication of a canvas covering over the panels.

It looks like the blue frame for the portholes acts as a stiffener to the whole construction so the bolts attaching it could be replaced by clips if you retain that feature.

Perhaps a start would be to  take the roof off (with help) and review how many changes you need to make. The 3 way protex clips are very good and hold in 3 planes where required rather than just 2 but  probably not a significant time saver over undoing a few nuts and screws, main consideration is how to make the roof design more easily manageable and retain stiffness of the structure.

[PaulJ]

25 minutes ago, EllaGlssp said:

helpful- thanks! i imagine the current roof is wayyyy to heavy to lift on my own (though i haven’t tried). in which case i’d really need it replacing. Canvas could work though I like to use the wheelhouse as kind of an extra room, so ideally i’d have something like thin wood i can take off in panels. I’m also a little confused about how the metal porthole bits are removed as they are not hinged . 

Never done it but how about a canvas roof supported by a timber or two in the middle to stop it sagging etc but with celotex/roof vinyl glued on the inside.

Warm, lightweight and reasonable cost.

[StortSaunterer]

On 12/11/2022 at 13:25, Phoenix_V said:

I'll try and find some photos (might not be today) though mine is not the best design having "evolved" rather than thought out, the full width front and rear windows act as a frame and then there are 2 beams running front to back above the side windows  and doorwith cross beams just slotted in to them. If the weather is cold such that you are getting condensation then you probably don't want to be using the wheelhouse as a room, in summer it is fine. If you use panels as some do then the issue is going to be leaks along the joins, which probably ends up with the complication of a canvas covering over the panels.

It looks like the blue frame for the portholes acts as a stiffener to the whole construction so the bolts attaching it could be replaced by clips if you retain that feature.

Perhaps a start would be to  take the roof off (with help) and review how many changes you need to make. The 3 way protex clips are very good and hold in 3 planes where required rather than just 2 but  probably not a significant time saver over undoing a few nuts and screws, main consideration is how to make the roof design more easily manageable and retain stiffness of the structure.

 

Hi @Phoenix_V, sorry to revive an old post but your hybrid wheelhouse/pram hood setup sounds exactly what I'm looking to do on my new boat! Do you have any photos?

 

Mine has a collapsible wooden house with folding front and back panels and roof and side panels which lift off. Problem is the side panels are totally rotten and it's all too awkward for me to do on my own.

 

I was thinking keep the front and back and have some kind of frame like you described with canvas top and side panels 

 

[Onewheeler]

Our french boat has a wheelhouse something like that. Toggle clips hold the roof on and it was a two person lift to get it off (plus some hassle with the back door). Now, with solar panels on top, it's a four man lift. Never taken it down though, there's enough air draft everywhere in France to let us through.

[TandC]

On 12/11/2022 at 12:46, Phoenix_V said:

If you want to just replace the screwed on brackets with clamps have a look at the protex website, probably  something like this https://www.protex.com/8903-1069MSZN-YP-catchbolt-with-90-degree-keeper-and-safety-catch-mild-steel-zinc-plate-passivate-yellow

 

We have a canvas roof which is fine and has withstood all recent gales, BUT it does have a frame above the side windows and cross beams for bracing and to provide a rain shedding curve to the canvas

Thanks for sharing the Protex link - they have some great products on there. 

 

Sometimes, the biggest challenge to a project is that you know what you want to achieve, but have no idea of what hardware solutions are available.   Those latches with the 90-degree keeper plate are ideal. 

[Phoenix_V]

In case it is of interest the basic design of our wheelhouse as follows ;

The heavy front and back windows hinge forward and are supported by struts, once up a beam is attached each side front to back, 4 curved beams are then place into slots on this beam going from side to side essentially to stop the canvas roof sagging. The side windows are on lift of hinges so they can be removed, it would be nicer if they could just hinge down but the cabin gets in the way. When replacing them they are held at an angle, slotted into the hinges and then raised to verical and clipped to the fore aft beams and each other with protex clips. Once all windows are in place the canvas is rolled over the roof structure and secured all along the edges with turnbuttons  (see picture) but requires sewing

I have attached some pictures. Note that we put a couple of straps over the roof in winter as our mooring is very exposed, I d not think these are really necessary, the wheelhouse feels quite solid once all clipped together it is just belt and braces.

The canvas cover can be made from tent material which is very lightweight but we used lorry type vinyl  using a hot air blower to weld hems all round and a clever little punch from J Clarke Marine to make the holes for the trunbuttons. (see  picture)

 

[StortSaunterer]

48 minutes ago, Phoenix_V said:

 

 

 

Looks a good system. How easy is it to take up and down, can it be done by one person?

 

[Phoenix_V]

1 hour ago, StortSaunterer said:

 

Looks a good system. How easy is it to take up and down, can it be done by one person?

 

To be honest it takes me a good hour slightly less if someone is there to assist, but I dont do it very often, if I was constructing it again I would try and make the front to back beam lighter maybe aluminium and use perspex in the side windows which is lighter than glass. It would also be nice to design the framing so that the front and back windows could be lowered without the rest of the wheelhouse. If you want quick teardown (which on the Stort you probably do)  I think a pram hood is the only option but they do look ugly imho, there are one or two threads on here about them including one widebeam.