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    Le Séga
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  1. Phoenix_V

    Brexit 2017

    Oh good we dont need Brexit anymore then perceived problem has been solved.
  2. It used to be free parking if you were crewing a boat.
  3. Phoenix_V

    Resign Threshold - TSB

    Havent been able to use internet banking for a month now which is a bit of a nuisance as we were abroad. Phoned helpdesk which advised delay 30 minutes plus due to "high call volume" and hung up. Upon our return went to the local branch were they were sympathetic and helpful as always. They were blocked from resetting my password so they rang the IT desk which replied after over an hour of holding on and told them to ring a different number. So it seems a long way from being fixed. Still musn't grumble some folks seem even worse off. https://www.mirror.co.uk/money/tsb-hell-victim-reveals-how-12591083
  4. Phoenix_V

    Looking Forward to a Trump Visit .

    My recollection is that there was a lot of discontent about the ban and there was a poll which voted to reinstate political threads "will of the people" and all that, therafter all went quiet, when I asked what had been decided I was told that as the brexit thread was running the ban had obviously been lifted but as you say there was never any official announcement, nor were those members who had been banned ever reinstated, perhaps best not to reopen the can of worms eh?
  5. Phoenix_V

    Passport Petition

    Don't worry our new immigration rules wont let them in we will just sit in the dark, bit like now.
  6. Phoenix_V

    European withdrawal bill effect on boating

    Technically I am visiting, boat is UK built registered and vat paid and will return to UK one day - i hope not too soon. Meantime if I go into France in say 2022 what is to say there will not be consequences, if I return to UK and then back to Belgium what then. I am not a Belgian resident so n under their rules no need to reregister in Belgium. What exactly do you object to in asking the government to negotiate some free movement rules for boats (and people)? Quite so
  7. Phoenix_V

    European withdrawal bill effect on boating

    here's one to be going on with "(a) the ability of recreational craft to retain Union Goods status;" OK I'm already in Europe so I might be alright Jack or I might not, who knows? but what about movement between EU and UK in future, or CWDF members planning to do so in the future
  8. Phoenix_V

    European withdrawal bill effect on boating

    No, it is possible for our government to mitigate the worst of those consequences if persuaded to, without betraying the "will of the people"
  9. Phoenix_V

    European withdrawal bill effect on boating

    I was replying to this comment "but of little relevance to this forum. " it clearly is relevant.
  10. Phoenix_V

    European withdrawal bill effect on boating

    Indeed some of the stories of how we treat foreigners are shameful, is there some reason why we should not expect better of our government Bully for you, if you don't stay over 3 months it is hard to see how you will be affected
  11. Phoenix_V

    European withdrawal bill effect on boating

    Not sure why you are not interested in the fate of those who may wish to move to Europe in the future, but in the here and now what happens if Belgium customs inspect my boat after brexit and say I have to pay duty on it, if I return to UK, your boat has been gone over 3 years please pay duty on it, if I return to UK and then back to Euroland. Nor am I happy that I will presumably not be allowed to stay over 3 months even if my boat is. If you don't care about the effects of Brexit on your fellow countrymen then please ignore this thread.
  12. Phoenix_V

    European withdrawal bill effect on boating

    Mine neither, might send him a copy of this
  13. Phoenix_V

    European withdrawal bill effect on boating

    Sorry I thought this was "canalworld forum" not "little englander canal forum" There are quite a few members on here that boat inland in Europe and I would hope the rest of you might have at least a little sympathy/interest in the predicament we have been put in.
  14. From hansard 227BB: After Clause 9, insert the following new Clause— “Recreational boating (1) Before exit day, a Minister of the Crown must lay before both Houses of Parliament a report setting out the extent to which, and how, the rights currently enjoyed by recreational boaters from the United Kingdom in the EU will be maintained after exit day.(2) The report under subsection (1) must include consideration of—(a) the ability of recreational craft to retain Union Goods status;(b) the ability of UK recreational craft that do not have Union Goods status to continue to be able to visit the EU without being subject to an 18-month restriction on Temporary Admission procedures for relief on customs duties and VAT provided they do not change ownership;(c) the ability of recreational craft to travel between the United Kingdom and the EU without being subject to border controls;(d) the ability of UK citizens who are accredited as Royal Yachting Association instructors to continue to work on a seasonal basis in EU member States for such purposes.” Lord Fox (LD) Share this contribution My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Berkeley, is unable to attend, so I will move Amendment 227BB in his stead. This amendment represents something of a change of scene from what we have been discussing this evening, relating as it does to the future of the recreational boating sector following the UK’s departure from the EU. But this is an important sector for us. It is not just about the estimated 3.5 million people who take part in boating activity in the UK every year. It is also a thriving business sector, with the recreational boating and marine sectors being a success story in the UK. In 2015-16, the marine industry contributed about £1.3 billion to the UK economy, which adds up to around 33,000 full-time employees and more than 4,500 businesses. We should realise also that this is often in areas where alternative employment is not always available, so the sector is very important to the communities in which it exists. The industry currently enjoys the benefits of free movement of people and the absence of customs borders between the UK and other EU countries. There are then, unsurprisingly, a number of issues arising from Brexit, causing significant uncertainty to both recreational boaters and the marine industry. I know that the Royal Yachting Association, the RYA, and British Marine have been in contact with DExEU and other government departments in relation to these issues. Briefly, and for the benefit of the House, I will set out the key issues. The first is the ability of recreational craft to retain what is called Union goods status, which allows continuous free navigation around the waters of the EU. The second is the nature of the maritime border control regime between the UK and the EU after Brexit. The third is the ability of UK citizens who have RYA qualifications to travel freely to and from the EU for work that is often seasonal. The Union goods issue requires a little explanation, so I will go into that detail, if noble Lords will excuse me. Vessels and all the equipment on them, such as computers and electronic gear, that enter the EU from non-EU countries are required to pay customs duties and VAT unless the owner can show that they are entitled to exemption. This is not the case if the equipment has Union goods status, which means that it is treated as duty paid. Pre Brexit, vessels moving between the UK and the rest of the EU are treated as Union goods, provided that VAT and customs duties were paid when the vessel first entered the EU. After Brexit, vessels moving between the EU and the UK, and vice versa, should qualify for a temporary relief from duty—but only if the vessel stays for fewer than 18 months in the country in question. So UK citizens who keep their boats in, say, Greece, would find that they would have to pay all the duties or move completely outside the EU before they could re-enter for another 18 months. The result of this is clearly not good for the Britons who have to keep moving their boats around to avoid paying up to 20% of the boat’s value in duties. It is also not good for countries such as Greece that are hosting this tourist trade. Additionally, when boats are moving in long-term passage within EU waters, there might also be customs duty when moving from one EU country to another EU country. It is not clear how that will unfold. Noble Lords will appreciate that these issues may not necessarily be front of mind and addressed in the broader negotiations on customs and border controls. Accordingly, this amendment asks the Government to produce a report to Parliament in advance of 29 March 2019. This report would set out the rights and freedoms that recreational boaters currently enjoy and how they would be maintained after the UK’s withdrawal from the EU. It would provide a clear opportunity for the Government to offer much-needed certainty to the thousands of recreational boaters—and of course to the marine businesses as well. Without that reassurance, there is potential for significant damage. Very briefly, that significant damage comes in terms of costs and the administrative burden faced by boaters and business, with associated significant damage to the resale market for boats. It also causes new maritime border controls, which could be disproportionate and compromise navigational safety—and, as I said before, RYA instructors could find it difficult to do seasonal work elsewhere. The RYA and British Marine have been in touch, and I know that they are ready to negotiate. None the less, the importance of this sector to communities all around the country should not be overlooked when there is so much else going on. We have talked about the need to negotiate everything in such a short time, and this is just one more thing that the Government need to place on their list. Before the formal departure from the EU it is vital that the Government commit publicly to setting out how they will defend the interests of UK boaters and marine businesses. I will be interested to hear the Minister’s response to this amendment. Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con) Share this contribution My Lords, my name is not associated with this amendment but I am a regular attender of the London Boat Show at the invitation of British Marine. I have a specific question for the Minister to answer when he sums up. The record figures for the export of yachts and recreational craft this year were spectacular. But a source of concern to British Marine once Britain has left the European Union is the extent to which Britain will remain aligned with the legislation. I mention that because we transposed the recreational craft directive onto the statute book. The British Marine Federation was instrumental in making sure that that directive did not cause too much damage to our industry in terms of the standards with which it had to comply. Will the Minister assure the House that we will continue to align ourselves with future legislation to make sure that our main export market for recreational craft will still be there and that we will have some means of ensuring that the concerns of the British marine industry can be made known when future statutory instruments are being negotiated? Lord Tunnicliffe (Lab) Share this contribution My Lords, I declare my interest as a recreational boater and I thank the noble Lord, Lord Fox, for proposing the amendment of my noble friend Lord Berkeley. Everything that he said seemed entirely reasonable and I am sure that the whole House awaits the Minister’s concession on this point. Lord Duncan of Springbank Share this contribution My Lords, in moving this amendment, the noble Lord, Lord Fox, said that it may not be at the front of everyone’s minds. But as often happens in these circumstances, this particular issue is almost the nexus of all the key issues affecting withdrawal from the EU, whether it be our mutual recognition of certain types of goods for the purposes of customs duty, the precise arrangements and procedures for ensuring cross-border security or the mutual recognition of professional qualifications. So in truth, one might argue that this is a key amendment in many respects. The noble Lord, Lord Fox, is right to remind us of the significance of this sector. It is a substantial contributor to the Exchequer and a major employer. It is also, as a number of noble Lords have noted, a source of much pleasure, and we should not lose sight of that. In responding to this debate it is important that I am very clear, so perhaps I may turn directly to the specific question raised by my noble friend Lady McIntosh. She asked whether we will continue to align with future legislation within the EU. I am afraid that that is a commitment I cannot give at this moment because it will be determined by the ongoing negotiations and our future relationship at that point. However, it is important to stress that we are in very regular contact with the British marine sector and are attentive to the issues that it is raising. I hope that in saying that, my noble friend will recognise that it is our intention to be very careful as we take this matter forward. 9.30 pm I shall address some of the other issues raised by the noble Lord, Lord Fox. It is important to stress that the effect of withdrawal on recreational boating will, along with many other matters, depend upon the outcome of the UK’s negotiations, and I am sure that the noble Lord will respect that. In truth, I believe that there is an appetite on both sides of the discussion to ensure that the relationship is workable and I hope that that will be maintained and sustained going forward. The noble Lord raised some specific issues with regard to the recognition of qualifications, in particular those associated with the Royal Yachting Association. It is important to note that Royal Yachting Association certificates are not covered by the mutual recognition of professional qualifications directive. As a consequence, holders of these certificates need to check the certification requirements of the local port state control administration prior to entering its jurisdiction. I think that that is something we should have been able to do in the past, but we have not been able to address it at this moment. On the mutual recognition of certain types of goods, that refers specifically to the customs question. I am sure that the noble Lord is aware that that is perhaps the beating heart of much of what being discussed in your Lordships’ House. I wish that I could give greater solace to the noble Lord in this regard, but unfortunately in this instance many of these issues must await the outcome of the negotiations. However, I stress that he should be aware that the issue of the wider boating question is one which the UK Government take very seriously indeed and we will not lose sight of it as the negotiations unfold. I hope, on the basis of my response, that he will feel able to withdraw his amendment. Lord Tunnicliffe Share this contribution The noble Lord started by saying that this is the nexus of the issues virtually across the piece. He is painting a very dull picture of the future if he cannot assure us that in this area we are able to achieve the objectives of the amendment. Lord Duncan of Springbank Share this contribution I thank the noble Lord for his probe in this regard. This is, if you like, the epitome of the challenges we are facing, but unfortunately it is larger than the individual amendment can recognise and what it seeks to do, which is to have Ministers place before us a single report setting out both the current arrangements and thereafter the arrangements that we secure through negotiation. The arrangements we secure through negotiation will be detailed for this House and will be iterated so that we understand what they are, and they will emerge from that negotiation. It is not our intention to downplay the significance of these issues, but we must recognise that they play a part in a wider question, in particular when it comes to the customs issues. On that basis, I still hope that the noble Lord will be able to withdraw his amendment. Lord Fox Share this contribution My Lords, I thank the Minister for demonstrating his sensitivity to this issue, which will be reassuring to some extent for boat owners and boating businesses around the UK, so there may be some solace in that. The amendment is not seeking a running commentary on the negotiations. The Minister is correct to say that this goes to the nub of the customs and free movement issues as they unfold, but I think that providing a promise of some kind to keep the industry informed about what is going on is very important. Obviously we will look at the Minister’s response in detail in Hansard, and with that, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment. Amendment 227BB withdrawn.
  15. It doesn't don't ask me how I know this

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