leaving the locks

[Dharl]

As long as you let the other boat know what you are doing you can do this

 

 

 

poetry in motion!

[frahkn]

 

Well, I've been in the fortunate position of boating with people who are much more experienced than me and who I know and trust. I still think that's rather a sad comment though. After all, if they didn't trust me, how would I learn?

 

Well I suppose most of what we learn (those of us who learn anything) is by experience and by watching others. Certainly I have learnt an enormous amount from careful observation of those around me.

 

Equally I am content to pass such information as I possess to anyone who asks, but only if they ask; I'm not interested in telling people how to run their boat, their life or anything else.

 

But none of this addresses the issue of meeting a stranger at a lock and agreeing to tie his boat to yours, thus limiting your own freedom of action in an emergency. For me this is a step to far, for others it would not be. You enjoy the benefit of people that you know and trust - alas I do not.

 

Don't be sad on my account - you have had a great summer's boating.

 

[NickF]

 

Well I suppose most of what we learn (those of us who learn anything) is by experience and by watching others. Certainly I have learnt an enormous amount from careful observation of those around me.

 

Equally I am content to pass such information as I possess to anyone who asks, but only if they ask; I'm not interested in telling people how to run their boat, their life or anything else.

 

But none of this addresses the issue of meeting a stranger at a lock and agreeing to tie his boat to yours, thus limiting your own freedom of action in an emergency. For me this is a step to far, for others it would not be. You enjoy the benefit of people that you know and trust - alas I do not.

 

Don't be sad on my account - you have had a great summer's boating.

 

I am with you on this one Frahkn, I am happy to enter or leave a lock at the same time as another boat as i always have the option to bottle out if i am not happy, tying myself to another boat is one step too far for me.

[Chertsey]

I am with you on this one Frahkn, I am happy to enter or leave a lock at the same time as another boat as i always have the option to bottle out if i am not happy, tying myself to another boat is one step too far for me.

 

I think you have both missed the point. No one as far as I'm aware is advocating breasting up with a boat you've just met. There wouldn't be much point or benefit anyway. It's hard enough getting the idea across of going in and out together.

 

But if you're travelling with someone you know and trust then it's great. And if I were single handed, and had shared the first few locks of a flight with someone who clearly knew what they were doing, I wouldn't be averse to suggesting it for the rest of the flight. Would you? What does it take before you trust someone?

[NilesMI]

But if you're travelling with someone you know and trust then it's great. And if I were single handed, and had shared the first few locks of a flight with someone who clearly knew what they were doing, I wouldn't be averse to suggesting it for the rest of the flight. Would you? What does it take before you trust someone?

 

I was single handing down Hatton flight and arranged to pair up with another boat. It was a boat I hadn't shared locks with before, but had seen the chap (also single handed) around the place and had got the idea he knew what he was about. He also said he had a mate coming to help him through the locks.

 

Well, at the top lock we had a chat and decided to breast up. Initially with him driving my boat, so actually it was me who was taking more risk that he could pilot the pair into the locks driving an unfamiliar boat. With two to work the locks and one on the boat, we flew down and the Japanese tourists took far more than the usual number of pictures of us. We switched half way, so that I drove the boats (still using my boat as the powered one) and he did the locking.

 

It has to be said that we were both pretty able steerers of the breasted pair, although for me at first it was a bit like ballet dancing with a pig strapped to my back. We must have developed some kind of rapport because we met up again at Long Itch and spent a highly agreeable evening in the pub there before breasting up again to go up through Stockton.

 

I suppose I could have been twitchy at the suggestion of breasting up through the locks, but I will tend to give new things a try rather than die wondering. I would certainly do the same again, given the chance, but only with someone who I felt was competent, having seen them at work. On the other hand, there are one or two people out there who I would be apprehensive about even sharing a lock with... again.

[NickF]

I think you have both missed the point. No one as far as I'm aware is advocating breasting up with a boat you've just met. There wouldn't be much point or benefit anyway. It's hard enough getting the idea across of going in and out together.

 

But if you're travelling with someone you know and trust then it's great. And if I were single handed, and had shared the first few locks of a flight with someone who clearly knew what they were doing, I wouldn't be averse to suggesting it for the rest of the flight. Would you? What does it take before you trust someone?

Fair point, some one I knew or had come across regularly would be a different story.

[frahkn]

I think you have both missed the point. No one as far as I'm aware is advocating breasting up with a boat you've just met. There wouldn't be much point or benefit anyway. It's hard enough getting the idea across of going in and out together.

 

But if you're travelling with someone you know and trust then it's great. And if I were single handed, and had shared the first few locks of a flight with someone who clearly knew what they were doing, I wouldn't be averse to suggesting it for the rest of the flight. Would you? What does it take before you trust someone?

Ok, we are at cross purposes but I don't think I have missed any point.

 

I was replying to Mike Todd's post and he was responding to the OP. Neither had suggested knowing or trusting anybody. The OP seemed to be talking about the advantages of the two boats entering a lock together and Mike took it to the next stage, where the two tied together.

[Geo]

lol Whenever I have done it it was without breasting the boats. Two boats two skippers and a lock just big enough for two.

[Mike Todd]

Ok, we are at cross purposes but I don't think I have missed any point.

 

I was replying to Mike Todd's post and he was responding to the OP. Neither had suggested knowing or trusting anybody. The OP seemed to be talking about the advantages of the two boats entering a lock together and Mike took it to the next stage, where the two tied together.

Indeed - neither of us was implying anything to do with compulsion. As with anything to do with going through a lock (and anything else for that matter) the person in charge of a boat is sovereign, however much others might like to rant and rave, including those appointed to assist) Like most others, I have been known to offer advice at times, especially to those who admit to having just taken over a boat with no tuition, but when waiting for those who have an 'unusual' way of doing things that they insist on, then the best thing is to stand back and let them get on with it - but try to avoid it looking like a sulk! (It has been said on another recent thread I think, but I do react less than well to those who sit above or below and doing nothing to offer to help!

 

Incidentally, I am always amused when I say to a boat that I am waiting to finish, that the person working the lock is free to step aboard and I will finish it for them. Little do they know that this is enlightened self interest as it gets them on their way much quicker!

[ditchcrawler]

 

Well I suppose most of what we learn (those of us who learn anything) is by experience and by watching others. Certainly I have learnt an enormous amount from careful observation of those around me.

 

Equally I am content to pass such information as I possess to anyone who asks, but only if they ask; I'm not interested in telling people how to run their boat, their life or anything else.

 

But none of this addresses the issue of meeting a stranger at a lock and agreeing to tie his boat to yours, thus limiting your own freedom of action in an emergency. For me this is a step to far, for others it would not be. You enjoy the benefit of people that you know and trust - alas I do not.

 

Don't be sad on my account - you have had a great summer's boating.

 

If I was single handing I would be much happier with my boat tied to someone else's so I was at the top of the lock with control of the paddles. I even get off if it a Volocky working them.

[Guest]

If possible much the easiest way. Keeps both boats under better control the whole time.

 

It is important to wait in the tail of the lock as some short intermediate pounds have significant swirling currents which are hard enough on your own but much harder when two together. Hence the need to go at a reasonable pace between the locks, timing arrival for the opening of the gates.

 

One of the points to say to someone nervous (or unused) of doing this is that it is easier to judge the left-right position with two as you know that both will fit! Hence, each only need to look at their nearside for position. The better steerer can also help to correct any errors by the other by gently maintaining the right approach with a slight nudge if necessary.

 

Of course, a more traditional approach would be to go strapped together but that is less than easy if different lengths.

 

Also provides good opportunities to talk steerer to steerer!

 

However, do remember to agree who will signal to approaching boats especially if there are two using the same technique. One pair has to part to let the other through the middle so a hand signal is appropriate. usually the pair that leave scond take the middle path - but if one pair is deep draughted then they will usually need to take priority.

Done this a few times on wide lock flights, but some boaters are reluctant for some reason? It releases one steerer to act as extra lock crew.

[frahkn]

If I was single handing I would be much happier with my boat tied to someone else's so I was at the top of the lock with control of the paddles. I even get off if it a Volocky working them.

 

Supposing the boat you were tied to was the boat which was cilled and sank, the subject of a recent thread?

[furnessvale]

 

Supposing the boat you were tied to was the boat which was cilled and sank, the subject of a recent thread?

If you are tied together properly, if he cills, you cill as well so you both go under!

 

More seriously, make sure YOU are the one left on the boats steering while the other steerer goes on the bank locking and all will be well.

 

George ex nb Alton retired

[Chertsey]

Yes, I would be a bit choosy!

 

Must admit though that in my recent travels I was happy to let the other, more experienced, steerer take responsibility for both boats.

[furnessvale]

Yes, I would be a bit choosy!

 

Must admit though that in my recent travels I was happy to let the other, more experienced, steerer take responsibility for both boats.

Indeed, if you know the other steerer it is no problem.

 

When others breast up to Badger, they tend to demur to the "heavy a***d Josher" and allow me to steer, especially if I play my "bad back" card for handling big daft GU gates!

 

George ex nb Alton retired

[ditchcrawler]

 

Supposing the boat you were tied to was the boat which was cilled and sank, the subject of a recent thread?

If you are on the paddle it wont get cilled

[frahkn]

If you are on the paddle it wont get cilled

 

If you are sharing then it must be a wide lock. I can't be on both bottom paddles so don't have complete control of the water leaving the lock.

 

Similarly, I am too far away from the top paddles to be of much use there.

 

The best solution for me is not to be tied to the other boat - then paddles are irrelevant because my boat will be away from the cill throughout the operation of the lock.

 

It (for me) is an issue of responsibility for my boat at all times - I cannot exercise that responsibility if I do not have control of the boat.

[Geo]

I am sorry two unknowing of each other boats breasted through locks going down. To me that is wrong I cannot ask another helm to be responsible for my boat nor me for his/her's. Boats going into together unbreasted two helms, helms look after their own boats and crews operate locks. It is not difficult each helm just steers their boat so the outside of each boat clears the gates by about 2 inches and the boats will slip in easily.

[frahkn]

I am not sure that I completely follow your meaning but to the extent that I do, I completely agree.

 

But I could be wrong.

[MissMax]

Why is it called 'Breast' ?

Sorry it's a off topic question, just I don't want to say the wrong thing when meeting grown up boaters

[Chertsey]

 

If you are sharing then it must be a wide lock. I can't be on both bottom paddles so don't have complete control of the water leaving the lock.

 

Similarly, I am too far away from the top paddles to be of much use there.

 

The best solution for me is not to be tied to the other boat - then paddles are irrelevant because my boat will be away from the cill throughout the operation of the lock.

 

It (for me) is an issue of responsibility for my boat at all times - I cannot exercise that responsibility if I do not have control of the boat.

Some people seem to be so nervous I don't know how they manage to enjoy boating at all. It must just be one constant worry.

I am sorry two unknowing of each other boats breasted through locks going down. To me that is wrong I cannot ask another helm to be responsible for my boat nor me for his/her's. Boats going into together unbreasted two helms, helms look after their own boats and crews operate locks. It is not difficult each helm just steers their boat so the outside of each boat clears the gates by about 2 inches and the boats will slip in easily.

Neither I, nor to my knowledge, anyone else, has suggested breasting up with an completely unknown boat/steerer, but when I am with someone who has a similar boat to mine and many years more experience, I am more than happy for them to take responsibility. There are certainly benefits in that you can have another person on the bank helping to work or prepare the locks. If you don't know anyone you trust that much, I guess that's a bit of a shame.

 

But we had this discussion two pages back and agreed that we were talking about two different things.

 

Do neither of you ever ler anyone else steer your boat? Would you not accept a tow from an unknown boat if you broke down? Or a snatch if you were stuck on the bottom?

Why is it called 'Breast' ?

Sorry it's a off topic question, just I don't want to say the wrong thing when meeting grown up boaters

I don't actually know. But breasting up it is, and then untying from each other is singling out.

Edited September 13, 2016 by Chertsey

[dogless]

Why is it called 'Breast' ?

Sorry it's a off topic question, just I don't want to say the wrong thing when meeting grown up boaters

I guess it's derived from the expression two abreast.

 

Besides, bollocking up sounds rude.

 

Rog

[MissMax]

I guess it's derived from the expression two abreast.

Besides, bollocking up sounds rude.

Rog

No comment ( because it hurts when I laugh )

[Chertsey]

I've also just thought, if something *did* go wrong in a lock, the person on the lockside actually has a better chance of doing something about it! So on that basis perhaps I'd rather be operating the paddles while my boat was in the lock rather than being trapped impotently at the bottom of it

[Chertsey]

I guess it's derived from the expression two abreast.

 

Besides, bollocking up sounds rude.

 

Rog

I do a fair bit of that too. Probably more, if I'm honest.