Smoking Beta BD3

[Domino_2]

Our engine smokes.

 

It smokes a little when idel, smokes alot when going at tick over, & just over.

 

If you reve the engine right up (eg on rivers), get thick black smoke, and after a good long blast, the smoking reduces for a short while.

 

Its been serviced regulalry, all filters done.....its got the right oils

 

Tried fuel additives.

 

Moved pipe that goes from the rocker cover to the air intake and fitted a oil catcher tank.

 

Have had the injectors out, had them cleaned and serviced (which improved the smoking for a month)

 

We do alot of cruising (only in a marina for 3 months over winter), and rest of the time we are cruising.

 

The smoking has been going on for years.....just feel like we have tried all we can think of........so please

[ditchcrawler]

So does mine unless its working

[magnetman]

Is this because Beta Marine modified the engine to run at a tickover which is lower than its original designed minimum operating speed, for the 'vintage effect' ?

I don't know, but there have been suggestions that there is something odd about this engine and I've seen a lot of them smoking more than you would expect.

[ditchcrawler]

Just look at an old Ford Dexta Tractor sitting in a field ticking over and smoking

[MtB]

Our engine smokes.

 

It smokes a little when idel, smokes alot when going at tick over, & just over.

 

If you reve the engine right up (eg on rivers), get thick black smoke, and after a good long blast, the smoking reduces for a short while.

 

Its been serviced regulalry, all filters done.....its got the right oils

 

Tried fuel additives.

 

Moved pipe that goes from the rocker cover to the air intake and fitted a oil catcher tank.

 

Have had the injectors out, had them cleaned and serviced (which improved the smoking for a month)

 

We do alot of cruising (only in a marina for 3 months over winter), and rest of the time we are cruising.

 

The smoking has been going on for years.....just feel like we have tried all we can think of........so please

 

 

This is not normal. At 3,500 hours mine used to chuck out a thin grey haze from the exhaust no matter how much power was wound on, or off.

 

It smelt awful though, and was one of the reasons I changed it for the Kelvin.

 

 

MtB

[MoominPapa]

 

 

It smelt awful though, and was one of the reasons I changed it for the Kelvin.

 

I've noticed that different makes/types of diesels have different smelling exhausts. Generally, old engines smell better then new ones.

 

Given that they're all burning the same diesel, I wonder what affects the smell of the exhaust. Maybe peak pressure/temperature in the cylinder?

 

MP.

[MtB]

I've noticed that different makes/types of diesels have different smelling exhausts. Generally, old engines smell better then new ones.

 

Given that they're all burning the same diesel, I wonder what affects the smell of the exhaust. Maybe peak pressure/temperature in the cylinder?

 

MP.

 

Yes it's weird isn't it.

 

The exhaust from my Kelvin is crystal clear at all revs and loads, and smells only of fresh air.

 

The Gleniffer exhaust is smokey and stinks of diesel in a mild and innocuous way. I don't mind it at all, unlike the BD3 exhaust which was seriously unpleasant.

 

 

MtB

[Taslim]

Just look at an old Ford Dexta Tractor sitting in a field ticking over and smoking

Ignorace is bilss but assuming the OPs engine is baced on the Ford.

 

A farm I used to hang out on had a Dexter as the yard tractor. It smoked a bit. when the boss thought it was too bad we hitched a plough to it and gave it 'an Italian tune up' by ploughing up some pasture for re- seeding. It stopped the engine farting in Church but only for a few months.

 

Eventualy we split the tractor with a view to rebore & new pistons, bearings & such.

 

When measured the bores were fine but VERY polished though the pistons were in poor shape. Glaze bust the bores, new standard pistons & we had a 'new' tractor.

[Domino_2]

Is this because Beta Marine modified the engine to run at a tickover which is lower than its original designed minimum operating speed, for the 'vintage effect' ?

I don't know, but there have been suggestions that there is something odd about this engine and I've seen a lot of them smoking more than you would expect.

 

 

We got Beta Marine "opened it up", it ticks over 400 revs, and will run to 2200 revs now.

 

 

 

 

 

This is not normal. At 3,500 hours mine used to chuck out a thin grey haze from the exhaust no matter how much power was wound on, or off.

 

It smelt awful though, and was one of the reasons I changed it for the Kelvin.

 

 

MtB

 

 

I'm begning to suspect that this is a Beta BD3 problem.........

 

 

Ignorace is bilss but assuming the OPs engine is baced on the Ford.

 

A farm I used to hang out on had a Dexter as the yard tractor. It smoked a bit. when the boss thought it was too bad we hitched a plough to it and gave it 'an Italian tune up' by ploughing up some pasture for re- seeding. It stopped the engine farting in Church but only for a few months.

 

Eventualy we split the tractor with a view to rebore & new pistons, bearings & such.

 

When measured the bores were fine but VERY polished though the pistons were in poor shape. Glaze bust the bores, new standard pistons & we had a 'new' tractor.

 

 

The Beta BD3 is based on the ford tractor engine.

 

Does sound like drastic action, as would need to take the engine out to get to the pistons.

[Tony Brooks]

There is a general point here but the comment about the Kelvin & Glenister shows it is not universal.

 

There are two types of diesel engine. Direct injection favoured in trucks and mots, if not all, vintage engines and indirect injection used in most modern engines with glowplugs. That is apart from very modern car diesels. Direct injection engines inject direct into the cylinder while indirect inject into a spherical chamber in the cylinder head with a small port connecting it to the cylinder.

 

To burn diesel efficiently you need a high degree of swirl in the air through and around the burning fuel. If it is not sufficient some fuel droplets use up all the oxygen that surrounds them and goes out. This causes smoke. Direct injection engines by and large do not produce sufficient swirly at low speeds so tend to smoke a bit on idle and low speed. This is worse with small cylinder capacities. The comment about the BD3 having a lower than designed tickover would tend to reduce the swirly even further.

 

To overcome the tenancy to smoke at low speed the indirect system was developed. The small port or throat ensures air at high velocity is always swirling around the spherical chamber, even at low speed so tend to run with clean exhausts at low speeds.

 

Of course it all depends upon degree of smoke but it should be expected on small direct injection engines designed before computer modelling etc. If you have one that does not just be thankful.

[MtB]

There is a general point here but the comment about the Kelvin & Glenister shows it is not universal.

 

There are two types of diesel engine. Direct injection favoured in trucks and mots, if not all, vintage engines and indirect injection used in most modern engines with glowplugs. That is apart from very modern car diesels. Direct injection engines inject direct into the cylinder while indirect inject into a spherical chamber in the cylinder head with a small port connecting it to the cylinder.

 

To burn diesel efficiently you need a high degree of swirl in the air through and around the burning fuel. If it is not sufficient some fuel droplets use up all the oxygen that surrounds them and goes out. This causes smoke. Direct injection engines by and large do not produce sufficient swirly at low speeds so tend to smoke a bit on idle and low speed. This is worse with small cylinder capacities. The comment about the BD3 having a lower than designed tickover would tend to reduce the swirly even further.

 

To overcome the tenancy to smoke at low speed the indirect system was developed. The small port or throat ensures air at high velocity is always swirling around the spherical chamber, even at low speed so tend to run with clean exhausts at low speeds.

 

Of course it all depends upon degree of smoke but it should be expected on small direct injection engines designed before computer modelling etc. If you have one that does not just be thankful.

 

I don't think this holds universally true.

 

Kelvins are direct injection and have a widespread reputation for crystal clear exhaust. Even the manufacturer boasted of this as a selling point!

 

MtB

[Tony Brooks]

I deliberately only talked in general terms and anyway I rather suspect the Kelvin has a very large capacity for it's power output so would tend to burn cleaner than a small capacity engine.

[MtB]

I deliberately only talked in general terms and anyway I rather suspect the Kelvin has a very large capacity for it's power output so would tend to burn cleaner than a small capacity engine.

 

Yes it does. Mine is 3.75 litres. 21 HP.

 

MtB

[Dinz]

 

 

 

It smelt awful though, and was one of the reasons I changed it for the Kelvin.

 

 

MtB

 

If you put a cap of Castrol R in your fuel would it smell of a racetrack?

[magnetman]

or a cup of veg oil in it and it'll smell like a fish and chip shop

[BD3Bill]

I have taken to running our BD3 on pump ULSD, there is an improvement in the smoking, but it still does it.

 

I try to cruise at a speed that doesn't create a wash, about 750rpm seems to be the sweet spot with little smoke.

 

After a flight of locks a burst of throttle ( often in neutral ) clears the 'throat'.

 

Warming the engine up well before getting underway may help too.

[Tony Brooks]

I have taken to running our BD3 on pump ULSD, there is an improvement in the smoking, but it still does it.

 

I try to cruise at a speed that doesn't create a wash, about 750rpm seems to be the sweet spot with little smoke.

 

After a flight of locks a burst of throttle ( often in neutral ) clears the 'throat'.

 

Warming the engine up well before getting underway may help too.

 

I think that you will find the red stuff is all ULSD now and has been for several years. The only quetsion about it is "does it have biodiesel in it or not". For red we can not be sure, for DERV it will have.

[BD3Bill]

 

I think that you will find the red stuff is all ULSD now and has been for several years. The only quetsion about it is "does it have biodiesel in it or not". For red we can not be sure, for DERV it will have.

 

 

Honestly it wouldn't surprise me if they sneak an awful lot of biodiesel into the Gasoil/Red.

 

I have Bug, I deal with it regularly. The BD3 has the cone type separator before the CAV filter, very little gets through to that. Plus I run off the bottom of the tank regularly. Not broken down...

 

The pump ULSD/DERV is cleaner burning and less 'aromatic' IMHO only, just thought it might be of help to the OP.

 

I do cut it about 75/25 with red at the moment, but that Red comes from a very high turnover PFS forecourt source at 99p and no silly forms. My view is if I am buying DERV for propulsion I ain't diddling HMRC.

 

I hate to think of the state of the bottom of some marina's bulk tanks!

 

At least PFS's are taking action to minimise it in their tanks... and they DO have it in a big way.

 

How long before the Oil Companies HAVE to start adding biocides ????

 

My background in Groundscare/Irrigation/Agriculture/HGV has taught me a lot about diesel contamination over the years.

 

I was talking to the guy servicing the AGA at my bosses house and they are getting Bug/Contamination problems in Kerosene fired stuff now, they is no escape from it !!

 

Cheers Bill

[MtB]

What is a PFS?

 

MtB

[BD3Bill]

Petrol Filling Station mate.

 

How are ya? :0)

[Stilllearning]

Petrol Filling Station?

 

Damn, got beaten to it!

[MtB]

Petrol Filling Station mate.

 

How are ya? :0)

 

R!!!

 

I wondered about that but we were talking diesel, and I don't know any that sell it red and untaxed for 99p!

 

I'm fine thanks. Hanging around Oxford way for a few months. How are you?

 

MtB

[Domino_2]

 

 

Honestly it wouldn't surprise me if they sneak an awful lot of biodiesel into the Gasoil/Red.

 

I have Bug, I deal with it regularly. The BD3 has the cone type separator before the CAV filter, very little gets through to that. Plus I run off the bottom of the tank regularly. Not broken down...

 

The pump ULSD/DERV is cleaner burning and less 'aromatic' IMHO only, just thought it might be of help to the OP.

 

I do cut it about 75/25 with red at the moment, but that Red comes from a very high turnover PFS forecourt source at 99p and no silly forms. My view is if I am buying DERV for propulsion I ain't diddling HMRC.

 

I hate to think of the state of the bottom of some marina's bulk tanks!

 

At least PFS's are taking action to minimise it in their tanks... and they DO have it in a big way.

 

How long before the Oil Companies HAVE to start adding biocides ????

 

My background in Groundscare/Irrigation/Agriculture/HGV has taught me a lot about diesel contamination over the years.

 

I was talking to the guy servicing the AGA at my bosses house and they are getting Bug/Contamination problems in Kerosene fired stuff now, they is no escape from it !!

 

Cheers Bill

 

 

We tend to get our Red from a local garage forecourt (via drums), or from Marinas. Only in dire emergency do we get fuel from a fuel boat. We would like to support them, but with the contant motion of the boat, the sediment in the fuel doesn't get a chance to settle. When we do use a fuel boat - we again use drums, so that we can let the fuel settle.

 

We have tried using white deisel (nice handly tesco station at Reading), but didn't notice much on an improvement.

[BD3Bill]

 

 

We tend to get our Red from a local garage forecourt (via drums), or from Marinas. Only in dire emergency do we get fuel from a fuel boat. We would like to support them, but with the contant motion of the boat, the sediment in the fuel doesn't get a chance to settle. When we do use a fuel boat - we again use drums, so that we can let the fuel settle.

 

We have tried using white deisel (nice handly tesco station at Reading), but didn't notice much on an improvement.

Fairplay, just a thought.

 

I do wonder have you tried running without the air filter? Just to see if there is a difference?

 

R!!!

 

I wondered about that but we were talking diesel, and I don't know any that sell it red and untaxed for 99p!

 

I'm fine thanks. Hanging around Oxford way for a few months. How are you?

 

MtB

We're good too thanks pal.

 

We are talking Sussex PFS ere mate!

 

Can't believe we never bumped into you over the summer.

 

Take care

 

CHEERS!

Edited December 5, 2014 by BD3Bill

[BD3Bill]

I also worry that my silencer is too restrictive. the exit pipe through the roof is only 1 ½" !

 

I rather fancy a 2 ¾ " pipe into a plain expansion chamber (have an old helium gas bottle handy) to 2 ¾ exit might aid breathing/sootyness?

 

It is a big engine after all.

 

Ford 3000 tractors DON'T have tiny exhausts.

Edited December 5, 2014 by BD3Bill