Radio on the canal

[Harmony]

Hi All

I have been using an air scanner (bit sad I know but. it passes the time)and like listening to aircraft as well as some of the "public" bands as well as the ham radio guys. I have a narrowboat and was wondering is there a channel the Canal boats use (probably on a CB band) I dont mean the dedicated marine band for weather and sea going vessels I mean a band for narrowboats for instance if I was travelling the Trent and Mersey through Stoke etc I could "tune into ???? and see any problems stoppages etc."

I have never heard of like this but someone out there might have. PLEASE only serious answers

 

Thanks

[Ally]

yes there is, it's called Canal Side, it's an internet station.

[Harmony]

yes there is, it's called Canal Side, it's an internet station.

 

 

Thanks for that Ally I have tuned into this when travelling up the Macc. but I was thinking of a system like the lorry drivers use. If I met an obstruction I could "call it in" to forewarn others behind me if you "see" my drift.

[john6767]

Hi All

I have been using an air scanner (bit sad I know but. it passes the time)and like listening to aircraft as well as some of the "public" bands as well as the ham radio guys. I have a narrowboat and was wondering is there a channel the Canal boats use (probably on a CB band) I dont mean the dedicated marine band for weather and sea going vessels I mean a band for narrowboats for instance if I was travelling the Trent and Mersey through Stoke etc I could "tune into ???? and see any problems stoppages etc."

I have never heard of like this but someone out there might have. PLEASE only serious answers

 

Thanks

 

There have been a number of discussions on here in the past about the use of 2 way radio on the canal, a search will find you those. Basically the answer is there is no generally used channel or even system in use, the nearest perhaps is PMR446 used for communication at locks etc by some.

 

 

 

[by'eck]

Marine VHF channels 6, 8, 72 & 77 are available for intership comms although general chit chat is frowned upon. Both boat and user need to have a license of course.

[Dyad]

There have been a number of discussions on here in the past about the use of 2 way radio on the canal, a search will find you those. Basically the answer is there is no generally used channel or even system in use, the nearest perhaps is PMR446 used for communication at locks etc by some.

 

Yes, there was talk of using ch8 on both CB and PMR446 for boat to boat comms but it met with some quite bizarre opposition on here.

[Harmony]

Yes, there was talk of using ch8 on both CB and PMR446 for boat to boat comms but it met with some quite bizarre opposition on here.

 

 

Why was that Kev ?

[Guest]

Why was that Kev ?

 

I don't recall 'opposition' as such - just some questions about the value of such an initiative.

[alan_fincher]

Yes, there was talk of using ch8 on both CB and PMR446 for boat to boat comms but it met with some quite bizarre opposition on here.

I don't recall opposition.

 

A lack of enthusiasm is not in itself opposition, is it ?

[jelunga]

I am very keen on using radios.

When we di our volunteer lock keeping on the non tidam River Trent, the boats that call ahead to the locks on marine VHF channel 74 get the lock set for them with fates open. Those that do not can find the lock against then and lose 40 min or more to wait for the lock to fill.

You can also use a mobile phone. Mind you, after 30th Oct to Narch you will have to do ht yourself anyway!

[Guest]

I am very keen on using radios.

When we di our volunteer lock keeping on the non tidam River Trent, the boats that call ahead to the locks on marine VHF channel 74 get the lock set for them with fates open. Those that do not can find the lock against then and lose 40 min or more to wait for the lock to fill.

You can also use a mobile phone. Mind you, after 30th Oct to Narch you will have to do ht yourself anyway!

 

VHF is not what the OP is about though. He was talking CB.

 

Even just listening to VHF in our neck of the woods is valuable -

[Nickhlx]

VHF is not what the OP is about though. He was talking CB.

 

Even just listening to VHF in our neck of the woods is valuable -

 

I was one of those with a keen interest in using / promoting use of radio on the canals..

 

As a radio ham I use the amateur bands when possible partly out of interest on how the improved signal propagates from the naturally wetter environs, and was also looking forward to discussions with other like minded boaters, either on or off the water at the time...

I also use 446 when on the boat and moving, listening out on channel 8 code 0, but we use it for locking etc especially when e.g. a lock and a liftbridge are adjacent, but around the corner so not in view of each other, and we wait to be called through "when the bridge is open"...

 

I regret to report that the usage seems so low that not in a long while have we encountered any other nearby users, so generally end up talking to the (usually) Americans who generally find it interesting to find themselves talking to a canal boater in little ol' England...

 

I was left with the impression that many were unable to see that radio brought anything useful to what has been done quite successfully for decades without - either that or they were mic-shy, couldn't afford the tenner for a 446 set, or had extreme techno-fear

 

Nick

[Dyad]

I don't recall opposition.

 

A lack of enthusiasm is not in itself opposition, is it ?

 

Upon reflection perhaps my choice of words were not quite right, I'm not as wordy as some.

 

I did find it a bit odd that some would enter a thread about radios just to say "you don't want to be messing with those".

But that's a discussion forum I guess, just me being too sensative.

[dor]

I regret to report that the usage seems so low that not in a long while have we encountered any other nearby users, so generally end up talking to the (usually) Americans who generally find it interesting to find themselves talking to a canal boater in little ol' England...

 

I was left with the impression that many were unable to see that radio brought anything useful to what has been done quite successfully for decades without - either that or they were mic-shy, couldn't afford the tenner for a 446 set, or had extreme techno-fear

 

We bought a pair of 446 radios several years ago with the idea that they would be useful when locking or in the Llangollen narrows but we found the range pretty limited. However i think what really killed off the interest in PMR was the rise of inclusive minutes on mobiles. It is much easier now just to call with the mobile, and even with a PAYG it is pretty cheap now to make a quick call.

[jelunga]

We bought a pair of 446 radios several years ago with the idea that they would be useful when locking or in the Llangollen narrows but we found the range pretty limited. However i think what really killed off the interest in PMR was the rise of inclusive minutes on mobiles. It is much easier now just to call with the mobile, and even with a PAYG it is pretty cheap now to make a quick call.

But Dor, I think you are missing the point about radios, be they Marine VHF, CB or PMR. These broadcast the message so anyone within range and on the same frequency can hear. So warnings, questions, calls for help, fisherman obstructions etc can be transmitted and ANYONE can hear them and gain advantage. Mobile phones are sekective one to one private conversations which cannot broadcast warnings. (ok, technically they could but private users can maybe set up conference calls not not much else)

So the question is which is the best system to use?

I have all three, not Amateur Radio though. Each has pros and cons and I think they are :-

 

PMR. Cheap no license, good range of channels, restricted range, anybody can use and abuse.

CB. More expensive reasonable choice of channels longer range but very much more open to interference. No license required.

Marine Vhf. Same sort of price as CB. Dedicated channels for purposes. Licence required (now FOC) for radio. Certificate of competancy required for user. Good range low number of idiot users designed for the job.

 

For me there is no choice. Marine VHF is the best choice. Ch 16 for calling, ch 72 for talking.

[alan_fincher]

For me there is no choice. Marine VHF is the best choice. Ch 16 for calling, ch 72 for talking.

But, apart from the need for everybody using to have passed the exam, and hold the right certificate, I don't think it is really legitimate to be babbling away on marine band if you are having discussions just about working canal locks, or even what you have forgot to buy at the local Tesco, is it ?

 

The appeal, (and hence also the sometimes downfall!), of PMR446, or possibly CB, to many is you can just use it for any old chit chat you like with no training required. You can literally buy a couple of rigs, and hand to any crew member to attempt to use.

 

Alan (G0BVX)

 

who can use any of Amateur, Marine, PMR446, CB, or even mobile phone, but (other than marine on Rivers), seldom bothers!

[Harmony]

But, apart from the need for everybody using to have passed the exam, and hold the right certificate, I don't think it is really legitimate to be babbling away on marine band if you are having discussions just about working canal locks, or even what you have forgot to buy at the local Tesco, is it ?

 

The appeal, (and hence also the sometimes downfall!), of PMR446, or possibly CB, to many is you can just use it for any old chit chat you like with no training required. You can literally buy a couple of rigs, and hand to any crew member to attempt to use.

 

Alan (G0BVX)

 

who can use any of Amateur, Marine, PMR446, CB, or even mobile phone, but (other than marine on Rivers), seldom bothers!

 

 

I am sorry to have caused this big discussion I dont want to "go all out" for using marine band and obtaining a licence after taking exams and all that stuff I just wanted to know if someone up the canal had any problems with kids throwing stones, a big fishing match or the lock was out of order. If I was a lorry driver and I needed help I could use band 19 ( I think that is the channel) to get help or warn other drivers of impending dangers. Sorry to have "opened" old wounds but it was a thought I had.

[alan_fincher]

I am sorry to have caused this big discussion I dont want to "go all out" for using marine band and obtaining a licence after taking exams and all that stuff I just wanted to know if someone up the canal had any problems with kids throwing stones, a big fishing match or the lock was out of order. If I was a lorry driver and I needed help I could use band 19 ( I think that is the channel) to get help or warn other drivers of impending dangers. Sorry to have "opened" old wounds but it was a thought I had.

Don't apologise!

 

In theory it is perfectly possible to use legal CB radio on canal boats, and occasionally one sees it.

 

For whatever reason though, it is not very common, and if you installed it, I think only rarely would you find anyone else in range, and likely to talk to you. If travelling with another boat that had it though, I can see it as being dead useful.

 

Exactly the same applies to any amateur band, in my view. Use on canal boats possible, but very rare I would say. Asuuming they have not relaxed a requirement to give your call-sign each time you transmit, though, it would be tedious having to interject it regularly into conversations about state of readiness of locks, or how many boats are in a lock!

 

Almost certainly used more used than anything else is the PMR446 hand-helds, but although we bought some, we found their range severely limited, and now seldom bother, (other sets may do better than the fairly small ones we have, though). Even so I have only ever talked to my own crew on PMR446 - I have never heard any other canal related use of it on one of our sets, despite seeing others using them. (With no recognised calling channel, you don't have huge chances of being on the same frequencies as other canal users).

 

I would say that one reason CB doesn't find favour is that to be useful for things like lock wheeling you really need small portable sets that will clip to a belt. Back when I last knew much about it so called "portable" CB sets were generally about as big as a house brick - I still have one in a cupboard somewhere! That may have improved since, though - I haven't researched it recently!

 

...... I hope that was a sensible discussion of the options, without getting heated about it.

[Harmony]

Don't apologise!

 

In theory it is perfectly possible to use legal CB radio on canal boats, and occasionally one sees it.

 

For whatever reason though, it is not very common, and if you installed it, I think only rarely would you find anyone else in range, and likely to talk to you. If travelling with another boat that had it though, I can see it as being dead useful.

 

Exactly the same applies to any amateur band, in my view. Use on canal boats possible, but very rare I would say. Asuuming they have not relaxed a requirement to give your call-sign each time you transmit, though, it would be tedious having to interject it regularly into conversations about state of readiness of locks, or how many boats are in a lock!

 

Almost certainly used more used than anything else is the PMR446 hand-helds, but although we bought some, we found their range severely limited, and now seldom bother, (other sets may do better than the fairly small ones we have, though). Even so I have only ever talked to my own crew on PMR446 - I have never heard any other canal related use of it on one of our sets, despite seeing others using them. (With no recognised calling channel, you don't have huge chances of being on the same frequencies as other canal users).

 

I would say that one reason CB doesn't find favour is that to be useful for things like lock wheeling you really need small portable sets that will clip to a belt. Back when I last knew much about it so called "portable" CB sets were generally about as big as a house brick - I still have one in a cupboard somewhere! That may have improved since, though - I haven't researched it recently!

 

...... I hope that was a sensible discussion of the options, without getting heated about it.

[/quote

 

 

Thanks Alan And If you happen to find that "old brick" one please give me a PM I would like to leave one on the boat. Might talk to the lorrys while travelling near roads. Thanks again

[Guest]

We certainly use our PRM handhelds much less than we thought we would when we bought them - often relying on a few arm and hand signals that we both understand if we are out of reasonable earshot (but within sight obviously).

 

They come into play on flights sometimes but as has been said the range can suffer so even then sometimes they don't get dusted off.

[Nickhlx]

We certainly use our PRM handhelds much less than we thought we would when we bought them - often relying on a few arm and hand signals that we both understand if we are out of reasonable earshot (but within sight obviously).

 

They come into play on flights sometimes but as has been said the range can suffer so even then sometimes they don't get dusted off.

 

We have one for each of the two crew and "helmsman" and generally on most of the time - we find most use for calling down to the others who may be reading a book up front, or them calling back from the front to warn of an approaching hazard - as well as any

queries one has of the other - they are tiny and fit in almost any pocket ( cigarette pack sized) and have more than adequate range / battery life and not the end of the world if one gets dropped in ( £10) although not yet happened...

 

Nick

[Keeping Up]

We have three types on board now, as I don't have my Amateur gear any more. The CB has not been switched on for years, we use the VHF marine whenever we are on the big rivers (except the non-tidal Thames), and we use the PMR the whole time. Like Nick I find it most useful as helmsman to be able to speak to the crew (who is invariably in the lounge), particularly to call for another cup of coffee, and it is incredibly helpful on most lock flights for occasions such as when the crew calls back to tell me not to close the gates behind me because there is a boat coming the other way.

 

It was particularly useful to be able to hand out the PMR sets once, when I found two boats broken down on the Severn and was towing them both in line, since I could talk to the lock-keeper on the VHF and relay his instructions back to the other boats so that everybody knew where they were heading as we entered the lock.

 

 

In all my years of boating I have never once found myself talking to another boater on the radio, unless it has been pre-arranged (edited to add, excepting the occasional specific ship-to-ship communication on the VHF marine radio)

Edited October 22, 2012 by Keeping Up

[larkshall]

I was one of those with a keen interest in using / promoting use of radio on the canals..

 

As a radio ham I use the amateur bands when possible partly out of interest on how the improved signal propagates from the naturally wetter environs, and was also looking forward to discussions with other like minded boaters, either on or off the water at the time...

I also use 446 when on the boat and moving, listening out on channel 8 code 0, but we use it for locking etc especially when e.g. a lock and a liftbridge are adjacent, but around the corner so not in view of each other, and we wait to be called through "when the bridge is open"...

 

I regret to report that the usage seems so low that not in a long while have we encountered any other nearby users, so generally end up talking to the (usually) Americans who generally find it interesting to find themselves talking to a canal boater in little ol' England...

 

I was left with the impression that many were unable to see that radio brought anything useful to what has been done quite successfully for decades without - either that or they were mic-shy, couldn't afford the tenner for a 446 set, or had extreme techno-fear

 

Nick

 

 

Mike shy?, yep, give me a morse key anyday

[luctor et emergo]

I am sorry to have caused this big discussion I dont want to "go all out" for using marine band and obtaining a licence after taking exams and all that stuff I just wanted to know if someone up the canal had any problems with kids throwing stones, a big fishing match or the lock was out of order. If I was a lorry driver and I needed help I could use band 19 ( I think that is the channel) to get help or warn other drivers of impending dangers. Sorry to have "opened" old wounds but it was a thought I had.

 

 

There may be a few diehard 'good buddies' still using the CB whilst on the move, but I don't think it's very popular anymore these days, other than with the tipper boys. Range is limited, and it is is just as illigal to use a CB as it is to use a mobile, whilst driving. And seeing that an HGV driver risks a suspension of his licence, if caught using one whilst driving, not many bother.

 

Besides, apart from the occassional warning about traffic problems, or skirt, most transmission is inane claptrap from unemployed nitwits with nothing better to do than insult each other, or regal stales of their forthnightly sign on session.....

( I used to switch my set off when approaching the M42, or Bristol, or the Reading Corridor...)

 

Now, a chart plotter, that would be usefull

Edited October 22, 2012 by luctor et emergo

[nebulae]

We have marine band VHF on board.Would not consider going on commercial waterways without it.The course for the licence is only one day and the vessel licence is now free.The equipment is as cheap as chips.DMSS not much help on canals but essential on semi coastal hops such as Ribble link.Why risk you life and your vessel plus trouble you can cause to rescue services if you cant communicate.We use chanel 15 to communicate between the boat and the lockwheeler who has a portable set.This is a marine unit which is waterproof.Still cost less than £100.I hope we are legal on ch15 which is a low power chanel.Obviously no chitchat,just for safety information.Range is basicaly line of site.Mobile phone for communication when out of sight,assuming a signal.