bow cabin extension

[Fuel__2001]

For a while weve been thinking about creating some more internal space on our 57'x10' widebeam, cruiser stern. Instead of having a cratch cover installed on the bow, the idea was to remove the current bow bulkhead and weld in place a new bulkhead against the gas locker, thereby removing the doors completely and having no bow deck - we really dont use the bow deck and its wasted space. SO the bow deck would then become part of our bedroom

 

Low and behold in next months copy of 'canal boat' the widebeam 'Ansuka' has had this done - http://www.canalboat.co.uk/in-this-issue-index

 

Would it be possible to retro fit this new bulkhead and completely remove all traces of the existing bulkhead without compromising the integrity of the structure?

Edited August 19, 2012 by Fuel__2001

[blackrose]

For a while weve been thinking about creating some more internal space on our 57'x10' widebeam, cruiser stern. Instead of having a cratch cover installed on the bow, the idea was to remove the current bow bulkhead and weld in place a new bulkhead against the gas locker, thereby removing the doors completely and having no bow deck - we really dont use the bow deck and its wasted space. SO the bow deck would then become part of our bedroom

 

Low and behold in next months copy of 'canal boat' the widebeam 'Ansuka' has had this done.

 

Would it be possible to retro fit this new bulkhead and completely remove all traces of the existing bulkhead without compromising the integrity of the structure?

 

I originally wanted that design for my widebeam, but the builders were reluctant.

 

My thoughts on retro-fitting would be to add the extra steelwork, remove the bow doors but keep the original bulkhead and fit a bed into the new space. Mine would allow a 4ft wide bed.

 

The main problem with a retrofit is getting cabin sides to match the curve of the new cabin bow - almost impossible on mine without cutting some of the "corners" away.

 

Edited August 19, 2012 by blackrose

[Fuel__2001]

My thoughts on retro-fitting would be to add the extra steelwork, remove the bow doors but keep the original bulkhead and fit a bed into the new space. Mine would allow a 4ft wide bed.

 

The main problem with a retrofit is getting cabin sides to match the curve of the new cabin bow - almost impossible on mine without cutting some of the "corners" away.

 

We've spoken to someone about this and that is what they have also recommended, is cutting up the original bulkhead but leaving 130mm surround in place, then adding the new bulkhead to the gas locker.

 

Getting the cabin sides to match is a good point!

[blackrose]

We've spoken to someone about this and that is what they have also recommended, is cutting up the original bulkhead but leaving 130mm surround in place, then adding the new bulkhead to the gas locker.

 

Getting the cabin sides to match is a good point!

 

I think if I did it I'd forget about trying to match the cabin sides as I don't really think it could be done and the join would look terrible. Instead it's better to make a feature out of the new bow, so the new sides would start about 6" in from the existing cabin sides (welded to the bulkhead) with the roof curved to match the existing roof (I'm sure a matching roof could be done without a problem).

 

That design would also create wider gunwales along the new bow, allowing better access to cleats, gas locker, etc.

Edited August 19, 2012 by blackrose

[Fuel__2001]

Instead it's better to make a feature out of the new bow, so the new sides would start about 6" in from the existing cabin sides (welded to the bulkhead) with the roof curved to match the existing roof (I'm sure a matching roof could be done without a problem).

 

That design would also create wider gunwales along the new bow, allowing better access to cleats, gas locker, etc.

 

Do you mean something like this http://www.apolloduck.co.uk/display.phtml?aid=170786

 

Having spoken again with our fabricator, he said he will be able to use machinery to bend the steel (cabin sides and roof) to match any existing lines to remain in keeping.

 

Something i dont quite understand is the terminology, kness and stringers and where these are on the boat.

[Eddimonton]

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?app=gallery&module=user&user=5928&do=view_album&album=830

 

This link will hopefully take you to the work that has now nearing completion on the boat

[blackrose]

I think I'd rather go for something like this.

 

 

Instead of cutting out the bulkhead I'd just remove the doors and put a bed in the space.

Edited October 16, 2012 by blackrose

[Ex- Member]

I have to say, even if desperate for space I wouldn't have gone that route.

 

A perfectly good cratch and bow are now totally ruined and replaced with, in my honest opinion what can only be described as a carbunkle. Even If it was possible to keep the boats lines and integrating the rails, I still think it's a poor decision and totally ruined the look of what looked like a reasonable craft.

 

IMO of course, but to lose a part of the boat where you can enjoy the summer let light and fresh air in and have a link to the outside world for the sake of slightly bigger accomodation simply doesn't make sense.

 

Your boat and your decision, but i think it's a big mistake, and looks it.

[RLWP]

Do you have another means of escape from your boat in the event of a fire?

 

Richard

[Ex- Member]

Do you have another means of escape from your boat in the event of a fire?

 

Richard

 

Funnily enough Lynn just asked that, I was so taken aback by the Bleep Bleep bleep state of that extension it never crossed my mind A very valid point though.

 

 

 

[blackrose]

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?app=gallery&module=user&user=5928&do=view_album&album=830

 

This link will hopefully take you to the work that has now nearing completion on the boat

 

How much did they charge you for that if you don't mind me asking?

 

I have to say, even if desperate for space I wouldn't have gone that route.

 

A perfectly good cratch and bow are now totally ruined and replaced with, in my honest opinion what can only be described as a carbunkle. Even If it was possible to keep the boats lines and integrating the rails, I still think it's a poor decision and totally ruined the look of what looked like a reasonable craft.

 

IMO of course, but to lose a part of the boat where you can enjoy the summer let light and fresh air in and have a link to the outside world for the sake of slightly bigger accomodation simply doesn't make sense.

 

Your boat and your decision, but i think it's a big mistake, and looks it.

 

I tend to agree except that if he has a cruiser stern he'll still have plenty of external space at the stern.

 

Do you have another means of escape from your boat in the event of a fire?

 

Richard

 

I'd be very surprised if the boat didn't have stern doors and perhaps a side hatch or two.

[John Holden]

I got told off for saying that a boat wasn't very good looking so I'll make no comment in this case

[RLWP]

How much did they charge you for that if you don't mind me asking?

 

 

 

I tend to agree except that if he has a cruiser stern he'll still have plenty of external space at the stern.

 

 

 

I'd be very surprised if the boat didn't have stern doors and perhaps a side hatch or two.

 

My impression is that these enclosed bow areas often become bedrooms. In the event of a fire, it would make sense to include a means of egress from the closed en, like a suitable window

 

The Canaltime boats have/had a hatch just about where the foot of the bed is

 

Richard

[blackrose]

My impression is that these enclosed bow areas often become bedrooms. In the event of a fire, it would make sense to include a means of egress from the closed en, like a suitable window

 

Yes, if it were mine I'd have hatch at the bow. My drawing shows one.

 

A perfectly good cratch and bow are now totally ruined and replaced with, in my honest opinion what can only be described as a carbunkle. Even If it was possible to keep the boats lines and integrating the rails, I still think it's a poor decision and totally ruined the look of what looked like a reasonable craft.

 

Your boat and your decision, but i think it's a big mistake, and looks it.

 

Why don't you say what you really think about it?

[mrsmelly]

I got told off for saying that a boat wasn't very good looking so I'll make no comment in this case

 

I think it looks bloody orrible !!! There is no way I would do that to my boat, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder and if thats what they want then it is their boat. I think boatmans cupboards behind an old clanky engine in some narrowboats are orrible also but again that must be the owners preference.

 

Tim

[John Holden]

I think it looks bloody orrible !!! There is no way I would do that to my boat, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder and if thats what they want then it is their boat.

 

Tim

 

Resale value?

[Ex- Member]

Yes, if it were mine I'd have hatch at the bow. My drawing shows one.

 

 

 

Why don't you say what you really think about it?

 

Well I'm not normally that critical, but I really do think it's a bad mistake, also going through the constructtion photo's and comments, there's a lot more i would be worried about.

 

There's a photo full length of one side of the boat and no hatch doors aparrent there, the stern looks very short alhough can't see fully, but don't think it's a cruiser stern, could be wrong of course.

 

I suppose if you bunged some portholes in it and maybe a window of sorts over the gas locker as you suggested it might look a bit better, It would take a lot to convince me though. Your suggesttion of constructing itt like the one on Apollo Duck would have been a more sensible approach. The actual amount of space gained really is minimal taking into account the SS water tank and tapering in of the bow. Then the cost involved, I think rearrangement of the interior would be money much better spent to achieve more viable space.

 

I don't mean to offend the poster, as I siad it's his boat and he can do what he likes with it.

 

It just doesn't look right IMO and anyone considering doing this should give it much more thought IMO.

 

ETA apologies the poster does have a cruiser stern which he states in his original post.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 16, 2012 by Julynian

[blackrose]

I suppose if you bunged some portholes in it and maybe a window of sorts over the gas locker as you suggested it might look a bit better, It would take a lot to convince me though.

 

That's what I originally thought but I was wrong!

 

 

Actually it does look a bit better. Now it's a wendy house instead of a carbuncle on the backside of humanity. The dog looks like it's about to show exactly what it thinks of it...

[Ally]

sorry, but I think it's a dreadful idea...just my thought, but it will, to me, look unbalanced and ugly...just my opinion.

[Radiomariner]

That's what I originally thought but I was wrong!

 

Actually it does look a bit better. Now it's a wendy house instead of a carbuncle on the backside of humanity. The dog looks like it's about to show exactly what it thinks of it...

 

Well, I'll be. It's a Springer!

 

 

The dog of course

 

Edited to add: Is that dog wearing a pair of pink flowery knickers?

[blackrose]

sorry, but I think it's a dreadful idea...just my thought, but it will, to me, look unbalanced and ugly...just my opinion.

 

Some might even say it takes the whole concept of the "pig-ugly widebeam" to an entirely new level.

[saltysplash]

 

 

This is exactly what we had done this spring at Highline.

 

Cut out the existing well deck floor and bulkhead and cover with steel with escape hatch/window in the front.

 

It was all wasted space for us, The well deck was only used for collecting fallen leaves and snow during the winter. The void underneath the deck only housed a sliding drawer and water pump and we didnt use it as things tended to get damp under there.

The only real use that space couldve provided was to fit an extra water tank but we settled for the extra space instead.

 

Water tank is in the bow and gas locker is at the rear.

 

 

eta the red and white dutch barge in the background 'PAX' is owned by a friend of mine, sadly up for sale owing to a move on land but its accomodation is stunning.

 

Its a pity the Barge only floats twice a year on that mooring

[OldPeculier]

Not my idea as I saw it on a narrow boat but what about having a smart cratch cover made then building a plywood 'room' inside it.

 

The one I saw was a cozy bedroom made from 100mm celotex sandwiched between 9mm ply. It looked great with steep sloped sides and a stained glass window at the front over the bed head. From the outside you would never know. No major work to the boat was involved, no loss of resale value and cheap as chips to do.

 

Not the one I looked at but this is the same idea

Edited October 22, 2012 by OldPeculier

[Eddimonton]

Do you have another means of escape from your boat in the event of a fire?

 

Richard

 

Yes, we have Stern doors, side doors and houdini hatch

[Eddimonton]

I have to say, even if desperate for space I wouldn't have gone that route.

 

A perfectly good cratch and bow are now totally ruined and replaced with, in my honest opinion what can only be described as a carbunkle. Even If it was possible to keep the boats lines and integrating the rails, I still think it's a poor decision and totally ruined the look of what looked like a reasonable craft.

 

IMO of course, but to lose a part of the boat where you can enjoy the summer let light and fresh air in and have a link to the outside world for the sake of slightly bigger accomodation simply doesn't make sense.

 

Your boat and your decision, but i think it's a big mistake, and looks it.

 

Thank you Julynian but I (We) did not ask for your opinion yet you have given it several times.

 

Whilst I do not feel the need to justify our decision I do want to reply to your comments, as well as comments left by others.

 

We've gained around 15% extra space to be used on a permanent basis. This is home to a family who enjoy living on board but need more space - its part of an on going refit.

 

We realised that over the 8 years of living on board we rarely used the bow space. We have a reasonable stern deck area as well as the roof for relaxing and getting some fresh air and lots of windows for light.

 

The work is of course not finished. Yet to be added are the rails, headlamp, horn and further vents as well as more painting to match the rest of the boat and decals.

 

You are correct to say that it is our boat and it is our decision.

 

How much did they charge you for that if you don't mind me asking?

 

 

 

I tend to agree except that if he has a cruiser stern he'll still have plenty of external space at the stern.

 

 

 

I'd be very surprised if the boat didn't have stern doors and perhaps a side hatch or two.

 

The materials and labour were far less than a price of a standard cratch board and cover.

 

I had no luck getting a cratch board and cover made for our boat due to our location hence why we changed tack.